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samjoandco
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 10:39a
saxman717 said:Leroy said:This essentially means the grind must be within spec to get the desired 25-30 second pull for 2oz,
Does anyones machine take this long for 2 oz's? I have packed and pressed the grind and have just pressed as directed and it still just comes flying out in like 3-4 seconds. I have tightened up the screw and that didn't help either. I am not getting the love.
I have beans ground from Starbucks
The exact same thing is happening with me --- what is the deal? Some help would be great! I have the same expierence. I wait for the green light to come on and the coffee start poruing within a second and almost 4 cups are filled in 3-4 seconds. the coffee is too mild for me compared to the older krups that i have which passes steam through and has much more intense flavor. Can we make the brewing /dripping slower any way? Which screw is Leroy referring to in the post above? |
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matthewf01
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 10:45a
samjoandco said:
Which screw is Leroy referring to in the post above? the big round tool with a screw bit on the end is used to tighten/loosen/unscrew a metal plate on the underside of where the coffee comes out (when the handle is not installed, of course).
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Chisand
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:04a
The espresso comes out faster than the 20 or so seconds, mine seems to be about 12 seconds. I can't see how you are getting 4 cups worth in 4 seconds! It also shouldn't bee weak... This may be a really silly question but how much coffee are you putting in? You don't have the pod basket in, do you? |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:12a
FOLKS! You MUST have a decent espresso grinder. Drip grind WILL NOT work. Solis Maestro DJSpray mentioned is absolute bare minimum for any espresso machine. You MUST grind AT THE TIME you are preparing your shot..can't buy pre-ground coffee, even out of a Lavazza can, and expect fresh crema espresso..even vacuum-sealed grind oxidizes too fast to retain essential oils and flavor (the whole point behind espresso). 25-30 second pulls are absolutely essential to have a full-flavored cup...the first few seconds are usually occupied by the shower screen wetting the puck (in this case, wetting the 'sludge mass'! ), so the instant you hit the brew button, you need to be counting/timing the shot, since you've just exposed the grind to hot water. If you can squeeze out a shot of 1-1.5 oz. in 15-20 seconds with no blonding, you've just done a 'ristretto' shot, aka 'shortshot'. Enthusiasts shoot quality double-ristretto, or regular double-pulls for their own consumption, as a coffee bar/barista will generally have a routine for production purposes/speed..often a single or double automatic(timed)pull at whatever grind the grinder happens to be at in that moment. Better bars/baristas are always tweaking their grind as they notice the shots behaviour..as home enthusiasts, it's pretty much all we do..adjust grind repeatedly until we can 'match' the qualities of the oil/oxidized state of the beans at that moment. The grind setting I tweak to in the next hour will not work on the same beans this evening..I'll need to tweak the grind to compensate for the state of the beans tonight. Insane?...yes...most likely. Best you'll ever have?...yes...most likely, but EVERY roast, EVERY pull is a new and exciting experience, and that god-shot is always right around the corner. Kinda like life itself, isn't it? You get out of it what you put into it.  |
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microsoftissuck
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:12a
for those that are getting 4 second shots, my guess is you don't have the pressure insert in the filter. When you take the basket out of the portifilter, you should see a black round disc with a rubber gasket, In the middle, there is a small hole. That keeps the pressure high and forces the coffee out slowly. |
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samjoandco
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:13a
Chisand said:This may be a really silly question but how much coffee are you putting in? You don't have the pod basket in, do you? i put 1 tbsp of coffee. this was enough for my earlier krups to make 4 cups of strong espresso |
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samjoandco
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:16a
matthewf01 said:samjoandco said:
Which screw is Leroy referring to in the post above? the big round tool with a screw bit on the end is used to tighten/loosen/unscrew a metal plate on the underside of where the coffee comes out (when the handle is not installed, of course). Do you tighten the screw for slower brewing or loosen it? |
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matthewf01
- Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:22a
samjoandco said:
Do you tighten the screw for slower brewing or loosen it? my guess is you tighten it, constricting waterflow thereby slowing throughput, and thus slowing brew time. i need to play with this thing myself. ive been brewing big double-shots, but i need to make sure my brew time is right since there's no other way to know if you're letting it go for too long --- or is there another way? |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:26a
Regarding grind quality: Your grinder must be able to produce a fine to very fine CONSISTENT granuled product..espresso grind is often described as a fluffy, coarse but clumping powder. The closest texture I can come up with is powdered Splenda..light and fluffy, but enough moisture and texture that it compacts tightly but still very permeable to water/extraction when compacted. This Barista does not allow you to witness the actual behaviour of the 'puck', relying on the spring pressurized system of the PPF, so we can only guess at grind. Naturally a skilled barista has a pretty good idea and palate to determine a grind suitable for the Barista, but the 25-30 second for 2-2.5 oz double will always be the goal (exc. ristrettos). |
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brushwood
- Greedy Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:27a
samjoandco said:matthewf01 said:samjoandco said:
Which screw is Leroy referring to in the post above? the big round tool with a screw bit on the end is used to tighten/loosen/unscrew a metal plate on the underside of where the coffee comes out (when the handle is not installed, of course).
Do you tighten the screw for slower brewing or loosen it? There is a lot of weird information in this thread. As the poster pointed out above, the problem you are experiencing is due to not having the correct grind. The grinder is actually much more important than the espresso machine since getting the grind correct is critical. If you are trying to use pre-ground coffee your results will not be that great. If the shot is coming out too quickly then you are using too coarse of a grind. Those pressure inserts are supposed to help but most people do not like them. The only way to get truly good espresso is to grind the beans yourself, get the grind correct and tamp with the proper pressure. The screw for the brew head screen does nothing to control the brew length. Don't do anything with it. It is there to keep the brew head screen on. The tool is provided so you can periodically clean the brew screen. The only factors that affect the length of time it takes to pull a shot are the coarseness of the grind and (to a lesser extent) the pressure you've tamped at. |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:28a
microsoftissuck said:for those that are getting 4 second shots, my guess is you don't have the pressure insert in the filter. When you take the basket out of the portifilter, you should see a black round disc with a rubber gasket, In the middle, there is a small hole. That keeps the pressure high and forces the coffee out slowly. Umm..no..thats for pods. The filter should be bare before filling with grind. |
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Leroy
- Addicted Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:30a
The Starbucks DVD guy is Pulling the at the same speed as I am. |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:30a
samjoandco said:Chisand said:This may be a really silly question but how much coffee are you putting in? You don't have the pod basket in, do you? i put 1 tbsp of coffee. this was enough for my earlier krups to make 4 cups of strong espresso You need 2 heaping coffee scoops of whole bean into the grinder, then FILL the filter with grind, level off the top with a straight-edge or finger, tap gently to get 1/8 of headroom, lock and pull. |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:36a
Leroy said:The Starbucks DVD guy is Pulling the at the same speed as I am. I have no need to watch the DVD..misleading, and will instill bad habits, trust me! You NEED 25-30 seconds, accomplished with a decent grinder. Blonding is only acceptable at the final few seconds. The entire pour should be a nice reddish foam, with thin 'mousetails' as it fills your cup. |
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iwearnosox
- Senior Member - 3K
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:41a
HokieOkie said:Leroy said:The Starbucks DVD guy is Pulling the at the same speed as I am.
I have no need to watch the DVD..misleading, and will instill bad habits, trust me! You NEED 25-30 seconds, accomplished with a decent grinder. Blonding is only acceptable at the final few seconds. The entire pour should be a nice reddish foam, with thin 'mousetails' as it fills your cup. I think I did mine wrong, I got fat cameltoes as my cup filled. |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:57a
sholling said:For those interested and lucky enough to get the Food Network - Alton Brown's episode about getting the getting the perfect espresso brew airs twice this week. For those that don't maybe a friend will record it for you. I've seen this episode before and if you can deal with his slightly manic style it's pretty interesting.
Good Eats - Episode EA1018 - "Espress Yourself" - 30 minutes We could all use some education about true espresso. Join Alton Brown as he explains how the beans, the grind, the machine and the hand make up the essential components.Airs August 30, 2007 11:00 PM ET/PT August 31, 2007 2:00 AM ET/PT
Espress Yourself
Has anybody figured out how to keep the milk from caking on the wand? Youtube-3parts
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comprx
- Senior Member - 3K
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 11:59a
HokieOkie said:microsoftissuck said:for those that are getting 4 second shots, my guess is you don't have the pressure insert in the filter. When you take the basket out of the portifilter, you should see a black round disc with a rubber gasket, In the middle, there is a small hole. That keeps the pressure high and forces the coffee out slowly.
Umm..no..thats for pods. The filter should be bare before filling with grind.He's not talking about the rubber insert. He said under the basket, where there is indeed a pressure "plate" (for lack of a better word) installed in the portafilter. |
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Cisco
- Tired Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 12:03p
samjoandco said:Chisand said:This may be a really silly question but how much coffee are you putting in? You don't have the pod basket in, do you? i put 1 tbsp of coffee. this was enough for my earlier krups to make 4 cups of strong espresso 4 cups, I only get one shot from two tablespoons, perhaps I'm wasting my pilon and cafe' bustello. I find using these preground espressos works better than trying to grind my own, but i do have organic beans I grind up too. Now the krups isn't even a pressure machine so maybe thats why you can run four cups out of it. and whats this abot mousetails and cameltoes in my cup? never seen them before, just an occasional roach that crawled in there and got brewed to taste floating in my cup. (just kidding, lol) though a friend once made me a cup and had a cockaroach floating in the cup eeeyewh! |
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HokieOkie
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 12:17p
comprx said:HokieOkie said:microsoftissuck said:for those that are getting 4 second shots, my guess is you don't have the pressure insert in the filter. When you take the basket out of the portifilter, you should see a black round disc with a rubber gasket, In the middle, there is a small hole. That keeps the pressure high and forces the coffee out slowly.
Umm..no..thats for pods. The filter should be bare before filling with grind.He's not talking about the rubber insert. He said under the basket, where there is indeed a pressure "plate" (for lack of a better word) installed in the portafilter. I see...I hadn't read it that way, since it didn't make sense that someone would have needed to unscrew and disassemble their PPF to have the pressure device removed. I assumed he meant that atrocious pod insert, which I hope everyone throws away.  |
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Gorby911
- Senior Member
posted: Aug. 29, 2007 @ 12:27p
I use this burr grinder: Krups Burr Coffee Grinder I set it to smallest setting. Seems to produce very fine (and appears consistent) grind. But what do I know. Do I HAVE to get a more expensive one or should this one be ok..? |
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