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rezzor said:   So I guess the start date varies based on your billing cycle date if I understand it correctly.

Yes, that was spelled out in the letter they sent. You get Cash Back on your next billing cycle date after 2/1 for the prior period (cycle) and the next day you are on rewards if you decided to switch. Makes perfect and systematic sense.

kriskos4 said:   c3 said:   jmel said:   I wonder what the math is on lost potential Cash Back earnings due to this.

When you use the PenFed card to buy gas, you get 5% back. When you use a Visa gift card instead, you lose that 5%.


jmel is saying that the $250 visa card he gets for switching is worth far more than 5% on gas. At the rate he buys gas, it might take 5 years to get $250 worth of savings.
Thats why I said I'm going to do both. I will keep my current card for gas purchases with 5% CashBack in a statement credit and apply for the new card for the $250 (I'm really not that concerned about one inquiry).

jmel said:   cheezedawg said:   Getting visa gift cards is inferior compared to a statement credit or direct Cash Back because then you need to use the gift cards for purchases that you otherwise could charge on your rewards card to earn more rewards. I think I'll go with both cards.

I wonder what the math is on lost potential Cash Back earnings due to this.

I switched regardless, since I would only typically use the card for gas, and 250 is 2 years worth of gas Cash Back for me.

Anything else is gravy, although it would be interesting to know the math...
The math would be different based on what your other CashBack cards are and how much you spend on groceries and gas.

But lets take an example of somebody that spends $40/week on gas and $600/month on groceries. Their Cash Back for the year with this card would be $320 (I am assuming they can do better than 1% for the rest of their purchases). With a 2% Cash Back card for their other purchases that he can't use because of $320 in visa gift cards, thats $6.40 in lost Cash Back. So we aren't talking about a lot of money here, but there is a difference.

FWIW, I just called and got another platinum cash card/account. I now have two platinum cash credit card numbers or soon will once processing is done.

I was told there would be no credit pull as I opted to have them just split my existing credit limit between the new card and the existing one. No new paperwork is required on my part either (e.g. credit application). The phone call is supposed to handle it all.

Come 2/1 I can then convert either the old or new card. This is just another way to get the bonus and keep a 5% gas rebate card. I am not saying this is easier or better than waiting until 2/1 to apply for the new card, just that it is another way and maybe one without a credit pull.

Per the rep I talked to, the conversion bonus program does not currently have an expiration date. She could be wrong of course but if she is correct that means one could have several months to elect to make the conversion/apply for the new card and get the conversion bonus.

This does though beg the question of how many new card bonuses one could get over the next several months by opening/converting several accounts. Or did I miss something in the fine print about coversion bonuses being limited per customer not per card number?

larry33 said:   "Q. What if I want to keep my existing Platinum Cash Rewards Card AND get the new PenFed Platinum Rewards Card?

R. That's great – you should keep your Platinum Cash Rewards Card open and apply for the new PenFed Platinum Rewards Card when it is available in February.

"Q. Will I still be eligible for the special 25,000 bonus point offer, even if I apply for the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card instead of switching to it?

R. Yes, you will still be able to take advantage of the 25,000 bonus point offer."


A no brainer, having both cards, end of discussion, or am I missing something?

i plan to apply for the new card. after fulfilling the $250 bonus requirement, put this card in the sock drawer and continue to use the old Platinum Cash Rewards Card.
i only use the card for gas, and i like the instant rebate on my monthly statement.

edit:
if super walamrts are coded to be grocery stores (like Schwab 2% converted to BoA card), then i will be using this new Penfed card, and sock drawing the old penfed card.

What are the chances PenFed approves me for the old card today and the new card next month?

provicemo said:   What are the chances PenFed approves me for the old card today and the new card next month?

PenFed is from my experience one of the pickier creditors. Only cc issuer I have ever had to send W2s or pay stubs to get a credit card.
PenFed in my experience will give you a new card IF you agree to take some of the credit limit from the existing card has been my experience. You can always call and ask them.

yurgreat said:   
edit:
if super walamrts are coded to be grocery stores (like Schwab 2% converted to BoA card), then i will be using this new Penfed card, and sock drawing the old penfed card.


It may turn out to be false, but when I called the rep checked with a supervisor (she didn't know herself), and she said that super WalMart would be coded as grocery. Won't know until it's out I guess.

Here is the disclosure from the Pen Fed Website - Frequently asked questions regarding the transition from platinum cash rewards to platinum rewards
Q. Do I have to switch to the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card?

R. No, the choice is entirely up to you. We are just providing you with the option to switch, if you are interested.

Q. The value of Cash Back is easier to understand than the value of points. What would my points be worth in the PenFed Platinum Rewards program?

R. A lot of point rewards programs are tricky but PenFed designed the PenFed Platinum Rewards card to be very simple. Each point you earn is worth $.01 (a cent) in terms of value. For example, 5,000 points would be equal to $50, which you can put on a gift card of your choice, including a pre-paid Visa® card that can be used like cash anywhere Visa is accepted, or use towards brand-named merchandise or travel rewards.

Q. How will I be able to redeem my points?

R. You will easily be able to track and redeem your points online or via phone.

Q. Is the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card better for me than my PenFed Platinum Cash Card?

R. Yes, in terms of the ability to earn rewards. The PenFed Platinum Rewards Card not only offers bonus points for gas but it also offers bonus points for supermarket purchases and a point for all other purchases. Remember, the points are worth $.01 so it is like receiving 1% "Cash Back." The biggest difference between the two programs is that the cash rewards program credits you automatically each month in the form of a statement credit while the point rewards program requires you to redeem your points when you are ready. If the automatic monthly statement credit is something that is very important to you, it may be better to keep your existing Cash Rewards card. You can always apply for the Platinum Rewards Card at a later time.

Q. What if I want to keep my existing Platinum Cash Rewards Card AND get the new PenFed Platinum Rewards Card?

R. That's great – you should keep your Platinum Cash Rewards Card open and apply for the new PenFed Platinum Rewards Card when it is available in February.

Q. Will I still be eligible for the special 25,000 bonus point offer, even if I apply for the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card instead of switching to it?

R. Yes, you will still be able to take advantage of the 25,000 bonus point offer.

Q. Can I switch back to cash rewards once I make the switch to point rewards?

R. Unfortunately, you cannot switch back to cash rewards. However, you can always keep your cash rewards card and apply for the new PenFed Platinum Rewards Card once it is available in February.

Q. What types of merchandise and gift card items are available for point redemption?

R. There will be over 1,000 brand-named merchandise items and nearly 100 well-known gift card merchants to choose from, including the option to redeem for a generic Visa® prepaid card. Additionally, there will be a wide selection of travel and experiential rewards as well.

Q. Can I see the rewards website so I know what the selection will be before I decide to switch?

R. The rewards website will launch on February 11, 2012.

Q. Can I combine my PenFed Platinum Rewards Card points with my PenFed Premium Travel Rewards American Express® Card points?

R. Unfortunately, you cannot combine your points between programs at this time.

Posted the FAQ in the quick summary. Flame away if it gets posted again.

Wondering if I should wait for a 50k offer...

HEPennypacker said:   Miniwallet said:   kriskos4 said:   Miniwallet said:   I also have cell phone insurance from paying my wireless bill with the Cash Rewards card. That might be enough for me not to switch.

Care to elaborate on that? Your phones are insured by paying for the bill with your current Visa Rewards card?



Yes, that was one of the benefits offered by the card when I originally signed up for it but it's no longer offered. It sounds like there are several of us grandfathered into that benefit which to me is worth more than the bonus for switching, even though I've never had to take advantage of the insurance.


I initially was hesitant to give that up, but I've had the card for 3 or 4 years now and have only had to use it once (and that was the wife's fault...she now has the ATT iPhone insurance plan). I'll just consider the $250 a cash out...that's enough to cover the benefit for one lost phone and all but $50 for another lost phone. In other words, enough to last me the next 3-8+ years at the current rate. Unless you lose your phone frequently, I think the $250 is worth it.


Is there info. about this in the terms given when we signed up, or how could I find out if I have the cell phone insurance plan?

Also, I am considering BOA 3-2-1 because of this change and because they are offering 0% for 15 months. Has anyone tried out this card, and if so can you speak to its pros and cons (i.e. how is the customer service? issues with cashing out rewards?)? Has anyone here used up the promotional 0% while storing the payoff amount in a savings account to earn a little interest on it, then paid it off at the end? If so, is there anything I should be aware of if it is my first time using such a strategy?

robodukie said:   HEPennypacker said:   Miniwallet said:   kriskos4 said:   Miniwallet said:   I also have cell phone insurance from paying my wireless bill with the Cash Rewards card. That might be enough for me not to switch.

Care to elaborate on that? Your phones are insured by paying for the bill with your current Visa Rewards card?



Yes, that was one of the benefits offered by the card when I originally signed up for it but it's no longer offered. It sounds like there are several of us grandfathered into that benefit which to me is worth more than the bonus for switching, even though I've never had to take advantage of the insurance.


I initially was hesitant to give that up, but I've had the card for 3 or 4 years now and have only had to use it once (and that was the wife's fault...she now has the ATT iPhone insurance plan). I'll just consider the $250 a cash out...that's enough to cover the benefit for one lost phone and all but $50 for another lost phone. In other words, enough to last me the next 3-8+ years at the current rate. Unless you lose your phone frequently, I think the $250 is worth it.


Is there info. about this in the terms given when we signed up, or how could I find out if I have the cell phone insurance plan?

Also, I am considering BOA 3-2-1 because of this change and because they are offering 0% for 15 months. Has anyone tried out this card, and if so can you speak to its pros and cons (i.e. how is the customer service? issues with cashing out rewards?)? Has anyone here used up the promotional 0% while storing the payoff amount in a savings account to earn a little interest on it, then paid it off at the end? If so, is there anything I should be aware of if it is my first time using such a strategy?


I'm not sure where to find the original terms and conditions if you don't have the copy you received at the time. The PenFed rep, and later the FIA rep, were able to verify that I was grandfathered in.

Lots of discussion of the BOA 3-2-1 on the board, especially in the thread on the defunct Schwab card (everyone was converted to the 3-2-1). I haven't really heard of anyone keeping it. Most seem to have moved to the Fidelity 2%.

HEPennypacker said:   Lots of discussion of the BOA 3-2-1 on the board, especially in the thread on the defunct Schwab card (everyone was converted to the 3-2-1). I haven't really heard of anyone keeping it. Most seem to have moved to the Fidelity 2%.

Yep. I have kept the converted Schwab card, but I have charged approximately $0 on it.

The question is how long Fidelity 2% will last.

-mike

mikeg1 said:   HEPennypacker said:   Lots of discussion of the BOA 3-2-1 on the board, especially in the thread on the defunct Schwab card (everyone was converted to the 3-2-1). I haven't really heard of anyone keeping it. Most seem to have moved to the Fidelity 2%.

Yep. I have kept the converted Schwab card, but I have charged approximately $0 on it.

The question is how long Fidelity 2% will last.

-mike


There's also a no annual fee 2% CashBack Priceline visa. In my opinion, the best general purpose CashBack card currently. FWF thread: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1125529/

cheezedawg said:   Getting visa gift cards is inferior compared to a statement credit or direct Cash Back because then you need to use the gift cards for purchases that you otherwise could charge on your rewards card to earn more rewards. I think I'll go with both cards.Yes, that is the downside, along with likely cash-in tiers (still no word on exactly what they are, right?) & the loss of the pleasant "automatic & immediate" nature of the rewards (vs. hassle of watching point balance & cashing them in & waiting & then activating gift card & then spending to take it to exactly zero ... sigh). But I agree with consensus I think, the $250 bonus, better non-gas rewards (esp supermarket), and no credit pull push me towards converting ... although the idea of splitting accounts and converting one is appealing. There is a real possibility that in the future the new card will get its points devalued, while the old card will still keep chugging at straight 5% for longer -- especially if there are relatively few cards still in circulation.

Regarding the opportunity cost of using up the VISA prepaid balance vs.buying witha CashBack card, something I've wondered a while about prepaid VISA cards, but have not had to deal with them in sufficient quantity to ever bother to check deeply into -- what is the best inexpensive way to cash them out (get cash out), i.e. the one with least fees to realize their value without having to make retail purchases? I know it's possible for some to take them to an ATM and/or go to your bank and do a cash advance, but there are usually fees associated with this, and not all prepaids may allow it (or at least that was the case when I last examined this Q to any depth, a few years ago). Anyone have thoughts on that? If there was a straightforward, inexpensive ( < 1% fee, maximum ) way to transmute the prepaid VISA into cash, that would remove your negative at least, cheezedawg.

MarkM said:   If there was a straightforward, inexpensive ( < 1% fee, maximum ) way to transmute the prepaid VISA into cash, that would remove your negative at least, cheezedawg.
Suggestion if you shop at WalMart. Cash out your VISA gift cards via WalMart.com for physical WalMart gift cards. They do $10 to $1000 per card and free shipping. I can always spend money at WalMart. They sell other gift cards at face value if you don't do any/much shopping at WalMart. I think the best bet is to cash out through your bank if they do it.

Some other options: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1158079/

mikefxu said:   MarkM said:   If there was a straightforward, inexpensive ( < 1% fee, maximum ) way to transmute the prepaid VISA into cash, that would remove your negative at least, cheezedawg.
Suggestion if you shop at WalMart. Cash out your VISA gift cards via WalMart.com for physical WalMart gift cards. They do $10 to $1000 per card and free shipping. I can always spend money at WalMart. They sell other gift cards at face value if you don't do any/much shopping at WalMart. I think the best bet is to cash out through your bank if they do it.

Some other options: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1158079/


How does this help? Couldn't you just use the Visa GC directly at WalMart to purchase the goods?

kwest said:   How does this help? Couldn't you just use the Visa GC directly at WalMart to purchase the goods?
I have had problems when not using the whole VISA gift card at once and later purchases would not liquidate card but fail.

I called PenFed and had them split the credit line into two cards. It took all of three minutes over the phone.

I am upgrading the one card for the bonus, and keeping the "other" card as the cash rewards.

-mike

What did you guys say? I tried calling and the gentleman said it couldn't be done.

Updated: Tried again and they said to wait until the new card launches to split.

isobro said:   What did you guys say? I tried calling and the gentleman said it couldn't be done.

Updated: Tried again and they said to wait until the new card launches to split.


Weird. I even referenced this FatWallet thread specifically when I called in, and asked if I could do the same. The operator said yes, and the change now reflects online (two cash rewards cards). Note that I called in a short time after one of the other posters on this thread referenced doing it, though. Perhaps they had enough requests since then that they decided to temporarily stop taking new split requests (until after the new card launches, as you mentioned?).

-mike

mikeg1 said:   isobro said:   What did you guys say? I tried calling and the gentleman said it couldn't be done.

Updated: Tried again and they said to wait until the new card launches to split.


Weird. I even referenced this FatWallet thread specifically when I called in, and asked if I could do the same. The operator said yes, and the change now reflects online (two cash rewards cards). Note that I called in a short time after one of the other posters on this thread referenced doing it, though. Perhaps they had enough requests since then that they decided to temporarily stop taking new split requests (until after the new card launches, as you mentioned?).

-mike

I split and opened a second account about two weeks ago. I just helped my family member do the same. Piece of cake, verified no hard pull and the 5000+20000 points bonus once I convert over, as well.

Can anyone who's switched confirm whether they change your account number?

I'm mainly interested in whether they report it as a new account with the CRAs. If they don't change the number, they almost surely do not.

Thanks FW for the thread. Just signed up to switch. This is my general use card, so while Cash Back was nice, not worth giving up extra points on grocery and non gas purchases.

Worth it to me for $250 in gift cards, and if program stinks I'll look at one of the other cards mentioned earlier in the thread.

Seems like from earlier posts the number doesn't change which hopefully is true - I hate shifting my auto pays to new cards.

DaveHanson said:   Can anyone who's switched confirm whether they change your account number?

I'm mainly interested in whether they report it as a new account with the CRAs. If they don't change the number, they almost surely do not.

From reading the following it looks like number stays the same and we don't even get a new card?

"Switching from Cash to Points is Easy
We made it easy for you to switch from the Visa Platinum Cash card to the PenFed Platinum Rewards card. There is no application necessary, your rates will stay the same, and you can continue to use your existing card plastic. Simply fill out the information requested on the side and click the "Submit" button and you will automatically begin earning points with every purchase at the start of your first billing cycle after February 1. Until then, you will continue to earn Cash Back."

Spoke to a very helpful PenFed CSR on the phone earlier today and he did say that they've been getting a lot of calls about the changes and the confusion surrounding the whole conversion process. I had him convert my card over the phone. In my situation, since my billing cycle is on the 27th of each month, and I converted it over the phone today, here's what my situation would be [as a data point]:

- From today until 2/1, the rewards on my card still remain the same; 5% on gas, 1% on everything else on purchases;
- Starting 2/1 until 2/27, the rewards changes to 5% on gas, and .25% on everything else on purchases
- Starting 2/28 onwards, the card changes to the new points system rewards, and the bonus points promotion begins/applies

No wonder it's confusing...


I'm gardening right now but the consensus seems to be switch/go new (when available, if you don't already have one) for the points card because of the $250 bonus and the fact that points are worth a cent each making it effective 5% gas/3% grocery/1% all spending (except it's not a statement credit, you have to get Visa gift cards)?

I already have a 3% grocery card and a 2% all spending card, so all I really care about is the 5% gas.

My only other concern is that "CashBack" is CashBack - there's not really an effective way to devalue it (if you tried people would flip). Versus silently changing the redemption rates so points no longer redeem at 1 point = 1 cent...

Do I understand this properly?

JDCMAN said:   I'm gardening right now but the consensus seems to be switch/go new (when available, if you don't already have one) for the points card because of the $250 bonus and the fact that points are worth a cent each making it effective 5% gas/3% grocery/1% all spending (except it's not a statement credit, you have to get Visa gift cards)?

I already have a 3% grocery card and a 2% all spending card, so all I really care about is the 5% gas.

My only other concern is that "CashBack" is CashBack - there's not really an effective way to devalue it (if you tried people would flip). Versus silently changing the redemption rates so points no longer redeem at 1 point = 1 cent...

Do I understand this properly?

I think the term you are referring to is "on the fence right now".

Yes, the switch offer is better because you are getting a $250 bonus and your points come out roughly to 1 dollar spent equals 1 point. However, the immediate credit to your account no longer will occur and you will be forced to request and redeem gift cards which probably will be issued in specific increment amounts. The thing with switching to points is that your rebate is no longer immediately applied to your account. You can only "get the cash equivalent" in specific gift card amounts and then only when your point balance reaches a specific level. Also, I am sure the issuing gift card company is paying something to the credit union for this service (similar to the interchange fees involved with debit cards). So the credit union no longer is paying out the rebate money as fast as before and the account holders can only get paid when they reach a specific point level. Of course, if the account owner is lazy and forgets about redeeming the points, then the credit union saves even more money. This change to the program is a win-win situation for the issuer of the credit card.

I can confirm that they will allow you to split into two cards- I did it today.

They said that they would split my line (I chose $3k on the Cash Back card, and the remaining limit on the points card) without a hard pull.

The CSR explained that they would convert my old CashBack into the new points card so that I could receive the bonus points, and that I would receive a new CashBack card in the mail. They claimed that the purchases I make on my old card will be rewarded with the points system, but not until Feb. 1st.

If I were denied for the split, I would just try calling again- perhaps they just didn't know what to do when you called but now have been briefed on how to do it.

So it sounds like even if you switch, they will let you use your same card. Thus, I think there will be no new number associated with your account if you switch. Of course, that could be different when you don't do the split like I did, but I'm guessing it is the same for anyone who switches.

Anyone know if they give a second card for an authorized user without requiring the SSN of the authorized user? Note: the primary user is accepting full responsibility for all debts and is the owner of the account and the second card is not for a co-owner. The rep I talked to told me that I had to give the SSN of the authorized user and I was wondering if anyone's experience was different.

robodukie said:   I can confirm that they will allow you to split into two cards- I did it today.

They said that they would split my line (I chose $3k on the Cash Back card, and the remaining limit on the points card) without a hard pull.

The CSR explained that they would convert my old CashBack into the new points card so that I could receive the bonus points, and that I would receive a new CashBack card in the mail. They claimed that the purchases I make on my old card will be rewarded with the points system, but not until Feb. 1st.

If I were denied for the split, I would just try calling again- perhaps they just didn't know what to do when you called but now have been briefed on how to do it.

So it sounds like even if you switch, they will let you use your same card. Thus, I think there will be no new number associated with your account if you switch. Of course, that could be different when you don't do the split like I did, but I'm guessing it is the same for anyone who switches.


I just called and tried to split my cards w/o the hard pull and the CSR did not allow me to do it. I guess it's YMMV. I will try again in a few days.

Does anyone know if they will start giving only the new cards at some time? If the new card starts now, might they only give you the new one?

Looks like PenFed sent out an email telling me exactly when my card will be converted and explains that the bonus will kick in after that date.

I got that email, too. A bit confusing, though. The date of the switch authorization was wrong, too. Does it mean that my Feb. 3rd statement will accrue points instead of CashBack, or only statements after that?

This e-mail is to acknowledge your request to switch from the Visa Platinum Cash Rewards Card to the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card, authorized on PenFed Online on January 29, 2012. Upon your account's next billing cycle, scheduled for February 3, 2012, you will start earning 5 points per dollar spent on gas purchases, 3 points per dollar spent on supermarket purchases, and 1 point per dollar spent on all other purchases.

Don't forget that starting February 3, 2012, you also have the opportunity to earn 25,000 bonus points - that's equal to $250. You will receive 5,000 bonus points upon your first purchase on or after February 3, 2012. You will receive an additional 20,000 bonus points if you spend $1,000 within 3 months of February 3, 2012.

If you believe that this is an error, please contact Pentagon Federal Credit Union at ... immediately.

If you have any questions, please contact us at ...

Thank you for allowing us to serve your financial needs.

Thank you,
PenFed Credit Union

provicemo said:   Looks like PenFed sent out an email telling me exactly when my card will be converted and explains that the bonus will kick in after that date.
I got that e-mail also. No doubt the conversion date for me now.

Seems like I might be too late to try to change my Promise card that I split a while ago to the Cash Rewards... I might try again later and see if another rep will do it, but they might have just stopped completely.

Russell_ said:   Anyone know if they give a second card for an authorized user without requiring the SSN of the authorized user? Note: the primary user is accepting full responsibility for all debts and is the owner of the account and the second card is not for a co-owner. The rep I talked to told me that I had to give the SSN of the authorized user and I was wondering if anyone's experience was different.

I added my wife as an AU and they wanted her SSN. They wouldn't issue the card without it.

Opusnbill7 said:   I got that email, too. A bit confusing, though. The date of the switch authorization was wrong, too. Does it mean that my Feb. 3rd statement will accrue points instead of CashBack, or only statements after that?

Switched online yesterday. They now make you log into your account to do the switch. Last day of my billing cycle is the 12th of every month. Clear as can be.

Letter sent:

Dear xxxxxxxxxx:This e-mail is to acknowledge your request to switch from the Visa Platinum Cash Rewards Card to the PenFed Platinum Rewards Card, authorized on PenFed Online on January 30, 2012. Upon your account's next billing cycle, scheduled for February 13, 2012, you will start earning 5 points per dollar spent on gas purchases, 3 points per dollar spent on supermarket purchases, and 1 point per dollar spent on all other purchases.Don't forget that starting February 13, 2012, you also have the opportunity to earn 25,000 bonus points - that's equal to $250. You will receive 5,000 bonus points upon your first purchase on or after February 13, 2012. You will receive an additional 20,000 bonus points if you spend $1,000 within 3 months of February 13, 2012.If you believe that this is an error, please contact Pentagon Federal Credit Union at (800) 247-5626 immediately.If you have any questions, please contact us at (800) 247-5626 or by e-mail at info@HQ.PenFed.org.Thank you for allowing us to serve your financial needs.Thank you,PenFed Credit Union

I checked today and the CSR said he can do the split but he confirmed with a supervisor that it involves a hard pull. For people who were told it does not do a hard pull for a split, are you sure about it?

Teletubbie said:   I checked today and the CSR said he can do the split but he confirmed with a supervisor that it involves a hard pull. For people who were told it does not do a hard pull for a split, are you sure about it?

Confirmed -- no hard pull appeared for me.

-mike



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