Forged real property titled - What's cheapest fix

I only know what my brother told me.

I believe FMV was approximately $42K. Originally, I at one point was going to pay my brother and sister 2/3 of FMV. However, they thought it was worth $60K. This was all done while my mother was alive and she was in the middle relaying messages. I was like no way. Get it appraised by someone that's not one of your friends, or list it and I'll beat the best offer by $1K. Personally, I thought they'd be lucky to get $40K, so for them to get $42K was reasonable.

If my brother wanted to, he could pay me, but as of now, he's only saying that now was the first he's heard that my sister didn't send me a check. I'm not willing to go so far as of yet to say he's lying on that issue.

ratdaddy said:   Did sister truly take all of the $14K, or split it with brother? Does he have assets to go after for repayment? If the house was sold to relatives, I'd be checking into whether all you're really entitled to is just $14K. There could be more to the story yet that you weren't told. Do you know the fair market value of the house? IANAL, but can OP sue for 1/3 of FMV if greater than $14K if property was fraudulently sold under FMV without his consent?

Jeez. Are you ready for the possibility of seeing one or both your siblings going to prison over this?

swandown said:   2. authorities begrudgingly agree to investigate but drop the case due to lack of evidence. (You say your signature is forged? Well, your sister's attorney's handwriting expert says otherwise...)

Can you establish you were 2500 miles away at the time of the forgery? Think landline phone records, meetings or timecards at work, EZ pass records, credit card transactons, etc.

Also, I Would be curious if the escrow agent would be willing to provide you a copy of the canceled check "you" cashed to see if it passed through any banks where you don't have any accounts but your sister does, and what the endorsement on the check looks like.

vipercon said:   zapjb said:   Jeez. Are you ready for the possibility of seeing one or both your siblings going to prison over this?

Exactly what part of this story makes it sound like there is a strong sibling relationship to start with?

If I hated my siblings and they stole 14K of mine, I still wouldn't want to see them go to jail.

zapjb said:   Jeez. Are you ready for the possibility of seeing one or both your siblings going to prison over this?

Apparently they're fine with it, or they wouldn't have committed the fraud. Why shouldn't OP be OK with it too?

OP: What county/township/city is the house in? Can you look up the property/owner/purchase price here, or on the county's web site?

That means the sister got 28k and has nothing left? What did she blow 28k on? Are you sure your brother only got 14k?

zapjb said:   If you can live without the 14k - taxes, forgive the debt.

I mean if you at least love them & you're not starving. You don't have to like them.

This isn't so much a debt as it is money that they stole from OP by committing fraud. Of course i hardly know anything about OP's family but it doesn't sound like preserving relations with his siblings is important at all. I can completely respect if someone wants to avoid the this drama altogether, whether it be because they stole from you or because you were deprived of $14k. The restitution or feeling of justice from taking it to court might not be worth the stress and energy. (Though personally i'd probably pursue the matter if i were in this situation.)

And I can understand not wanting to see them get a criminal sentence in either case. prison can be a rather harsh place in the US (but nothing compared to some countries). Several years in prison (and your life ruined because of a felony conviction) might not be a punishment that fits the crime.

Chyvan said:   I only know what my brother told me.

I believe FMV was approximately $42K. Originally, I at one point was going to pay my brother and sister 2/3 of FMV. However, they thought it was worth $60K. This was all done while my mother was alive and she was in the middle relaying messages. I was like no way. Get it appraised by someone that's not one of your friends, or list it and I'll beat the best offer by $1K. Personally, I thought they'd be lucky to get $40K, so for them to get $42K was reasonable.

If my brother wanted to, he could pay me, but as of now, he's only saying that now was the first he's heard that my sister didn't send me a check. I'm not willing to go so far as of yet to say he's lying on that issue.

ratdaddy said:   Did sister truly take all of the $14K, or split it with brother? Does he have assets to go after for repayment? If the house was sold to relatives, I'd be checking into whether all you're really entitled to is just $14K. There could be more to the story yet that you weren't told. Do you know the fair market value of the house? IANAL, but can OP sue for 1/3 of FMV if greater than $14K if property was fraudulently sold under FMV without his consent?I don't know anything about the legalities with liabilities and such, but for yourself, keep in mind that your brother still was complicit with the fraud of forging your signature even if he thought you were getting a check.

zapjb said:   Jeez. Are you ready for the possibility of seeing one or both your siblings going to prison over this?
I love my sister, and wouldn't want any harm to come to her. But some of that is based on the thought that she loves me too. If she hypothetically raided my parents' estate and performed criminal actions in the process, my feelings towards her would probably change. In OP's case, it sounds like he is mostly estranged from his siblings. While I wouldn't expect him to actually try to deliberately jail his siblings, I wouldn't blame him if he risked the possibility of it happening. Remember that they, or at least the sister, showed him complete disrespect and consciously decided to criminally rip him off. It's no better than if she had forged checks on his bank account.

DamnoIT said:   I again think you may have suit against the title company. I cannot see a proper transfer of title without you present and I would now seek to try to nullify the sale or cloud the title since you probably won't get a time out of your sister. Whomever was the idiot agent that handled the close without you needs to be fired and have their notary pulled, their company should take some blame in this matter. But do defiantly get on your sisters good side and BS her into signing a contract, +1 if in her writing an with her signature offering a repayment plan. If you cannot get it out of her at least that may be some evidence for your case against the closing agency that didn't do their job and illegally transferred title. But again get a lawyer.

I'm on board with this plan, OP.

SUCKISSTAPLES said:   We don't know if the sublings removed his name from title before the home was sold. Title company may have seen only two people were on title when they became involved .
SIS, I thought that the title company had to pay out regardless of whether there was an obvious defect on the title when they got involved. Regardless of whether they saw two or three people, don't they still have to pay out to resolve claims against the title?

In addition to what has been mentioned, I have to think there is a way to involve the IRS in this. She has $14k that she never reported. If she says you loaned her the money, you should be able to write off the $14K as a loss. Due to the distance involved and fraudulent RE transactions being so important to the feds right now, I would see what the feds say.

DO what you have to do OP but I think that once you have the facts and a clear timeline of the events that others can verify unless the title company or the notary bond wants to settle at the demand letter point you likely have expenses (your time, energy, and effort as well as your money) that exceeds $14,000.

OTOH I have seen cases where people with "no money" when confronted with "Here is the evidence I have and I'm going to file a civil suit in the morning." suddenly someone in the group finds some money. Present the evidence at a meeting of all three -your siblings and the "homeowners". Do not threaten to accuse them of a crime or to "go to the DA" if they don't pay up -in most states that is either extortion or blackmail. IANAL.

I do not think ANY deal is absolute if it is based on Fraud.
It seems that a lot of people here are trying to treat this as a Civil matter. This is Criminal.
The OP will need an attorney to begin with..but when the ball gets rolling, his attorney will not have to be the one pushing this...the DA will.
Once the Sis is found guilty, the Civil part will be a slam dunk.

I did just buy a house recently and the closing attorney took all the money for closing into an escrow account and then cut checks to each party that was supposed to get it. This included the seller, inspections....misc...
I am trying to determine how the Sis would have gamed this. I am wondering if she took the check and somehow got it cashed...or if she forged some power of attorney.....or maybe forged the Will and the OP was no longer even on it.

I can not stress how badly you need to find out exactly what is going on and if you were even listed as being a part owner.

And since when is stealing 14k so small that the police will not care?
That is more than you usually get in a bank robbery.

Ohh..the police just let the killer go. The victim was old and was gonna die soon anyways.
Nahhh..the police did not go after the rapist...the victim will just forget about it. No harm..no foul.
Look...this is serious. And it should be addressed now. If she will do this, she will also steal your identity...or something else.

Point blank. I want to know if 14k - attorney fees will take food off the OP's table.

zapjb said:   Point blank. I want to know if 14k - attorney fees will take food off the OP's table.

You don't know OP or his family. I think you're commenting from the perspective of your family relationship, and it doesn't seem that the OP fits that model. I think he knows what kind of ramifications can mean for his brother and sister and can make his own decision whether or not to proceed. He got screwed over. If it were a "business partner" or a random stranger, I doubt you'd question his desire to press forward. Just because it's his family doesn't give them a pass, unless HE wants to give it.

Reallyfrugal said:   I would see an attorney and then go to the police if the attorney agrees that there was a crime committed. The people who bought the house may have well been in the scam as well. If the sister came into the OPs house and stole 14K worth of property I think most people would agree the OP should call the police. I do not see this as much different. It is not the OPs fault if the sister goes to jail. I also would not be so sure that the house closing is a done deal. If you buy a stolen bike you do not get to keep it just because you paid for it.I am not a lawyer, but I believe I do get to keep the bike -- provided I didn't know that the bike was stolen.

I am an attorney, in practice for 30 years but not in Michigan. In the interest of brevity, there are some interesting posts here but I am not going to discuss them individually. You need to retain counsel in the area where the property is located. Get all the documents you have relating to this situation, and sit down with the lawyer. There are too many unknown facts now to try to sort it out here. If there is a forged deed, it may have been forged and notarized long before the sale. There could be a claim against the Notary who notarized the forged deed, but that may have occurred well before the buyer's title company became involved. Assuming a forged deed was involved, there is no coverage for the original poster under the buyer's title insurance. There is usually coverage for the buyer of the property under the title policy, but no insurance coverage for the OP resulting from the fraudulent recorded documents. The buyer's title company will usually provide attorney representation to defend the OP's claim that he is still a partial owner of the property that was sold.

The first thing you need to do is get an attorney in Michigan, provide whatever documents you have, and meet with him/her. The attorney can obtain other public records, and lay out your options. I would NOT take any of this to the police until after you've obtained an opinion from your lawyer. When and how to start a criminal investigation will be something to decide with your attorney. I would also stop discussing this with any family members until you have decided your plan of action with your attorney.

Laws vary from state to state. Start by determining your choices and plan a course of action with your attorney. Get a second opinion if you are not comfortable with the first attorney you see. Most attorneys have very reasonable fees (or even no fees) for initial consultations. Make sure you understand how you will be charged, and get this in writing.

The Fat Wallet community is a great resource, but not a substitute for your own fully-informed attorney. Good luck!

Sorry for not being more precise originally. Yes, the BUYER's title insurance would cover the BUYER against forged documents in most circumstances, but this coverage does not belong to or extend to the original poster. My advice is still the same -- get everything together and see an attorney.

There must be more to the story. If op lived 2500 miles away who provided most of the day to day care for the mother? Even if she lived in a nursing home there is still ALOT of day to day stuff a relative has to do. Did op go to the funeral? did sister/other brother pay for/plan the funeral? Does the sister and/or brother possibly have the feeling that they did all the work and should therefore rightfully get the op's part?

mrlandlord said:   There must be more to the story. If op lived 2500 miles away who provided most of the day to day care for the mother? Even if she lived in a nursing home there is still ALOT of day to day stuff a relative has to do. Did op go to the funeral? did sister/other brother pay for/plan the funeral? Does the sister and/or brother possibly have the feeling that they did all the work and should therefore rightfully get the op's part?

There may well be more to the story, but none of these questions change the fact that the law was broken when this property was sold without OP's knowledge or consent. Being angry does not give anyone the right to break the law.

...or maybe it does. IANAL nor do I care to be!