Fatwallet Consensus: Why not to marry (alternatively titled...how to implode a thread in one bagel or less)

mikef07 said:   uutxs said:   
That is not how you stated your #1. Did you follow your own rule "one word as a choice" when you made that list of four?


That is damn good point. I will right now

#1) Kids
#2) Wife
#3) Wife
#4) Kids

Which party is #1? Kids

Pulling out the redundancy remove 3 and 4. Which is #1? Kids

Add 400 more (your choice) Who is #1? Kids

Get rid of everyone except #1. Who is #1? kids
First, you changed the list from what you had earlier. So you were inconsistent in your usage then. Agree?

MissCrabette said:   Would you mind sharing one example of how you prioritized your kids' needs over your wife's needs? I'm talking real needs here, not asking you to do the dishes or wanting the last bagel.

If you never had to choose because, as you say, your wife is self-sufficient, then you're not really prioritizing your kids over your wife. You're prioritizing needs over wants.

I have needed to drive my wife to work before and needed to take the kids to the doctor (basic well visit, nothing serious). Took the kids. Wife missed work.

uutxs said:   
More name calling and nothing accomplished.

"Child's needs" are #1. That is what YOU had and I agree with that.
Not "Child", Not "Child's ****", not "Child's wants", but "Child's needs".

Hey if you can't understand what party is being talked about I can't help you. There are only two parties and one has to be chosen. If it isn't A then it is B. If it isn't B then it is A. To 99% of the posters here they understand which party was put down as #1. You don't. Sorry that you don't.

So being consistent - Kids are the priority in our house. 99% of people get that. You don't. Congrats on finally being a 1%er

mikef07 said:   uutxs said:   
More name calling and nothing accomplished.

"Child's needs" are #1. That is what YOU had and I agree with that.
Not "Child", Not "Child's ****", not "Child's wants", but "Child's needs".

Hey if you can't understand what party is being talked about I can't help you. There are only two parties and one has to be chosen. If it isn't A then it is B. If it isn't B then it is A. To 99% of the posters here they understand which party was put down as #1. You don't. Sorry that you don't.

So being consistent - Kids are the priority in our house. 99% of people get that. You don't. Congrats on finally being a 1%er
In your list, you were more explicit to say "Kids needs" are #1. You had a #4 entry that also used the word "kid" except it qualified it as "Kids wants". All your list means is sometimes the Child comes first (if it is to do with a need), sometimes the Child does not come first (if it is a want). Great!

Cost of having a child: $227,000 per child, not including college

mikef07 said:   MissCrabette said:   Would you mind sharing one example of how you prioritized your kids' needs over your wife's needs? I'm talking real needs here, not asking you to do the dishes or wanting the last bagel.

If you never had to choose because, as you say, your wife is self-sufficient, then you're not really prioritizing your kids over your wife. You're prioritizing needs over wants.

I have needed to drive my wife to work before and needed to take the kids to the doctor (basic well visit, nothing serious). Took the kids. Wife missed work.

Can you explain this to me? I'm asking because there is nothing about this that really has anything do with needs. There is a scheduling issued caused by lack of cars or lack of drivers or something.

Your kids didn't need to go to the doctor that day. Your wife didn't need to go to work that day. The Dr. appt could have been changed. Your wife could have rented a car, taken a cab, etc. Instead, I'm willing to bet that she said, "Mike, it's no problem. Just keep the Dr. appointment and I'll call off work for the day."

The alternative, if this was truly about needs, is the situation in which the conversation was more along these lines:

Wife: "Mike, I really need to go to work today. I have a big presentation that I can't miss."
Mike: "Sorry, Wife, but the children have a routine Dr. appointment so you'll have to miss work."

BrodyInsurance said:   mikef07 said:   MissCrabette said:   Would you mind sharing one example of how you prioritized your kids' needs over your wife's needs? I'm talking real needs here, not asking you to do the dishes or wanting the last bagel.

If you never had to choose because, as you say, your wife is self-sufficient, then you're not really prioritizing your kids over your wife. You're prioritizing needs over wants.

I have needed to drive my wife to work before and needed to take the kids to the doctor (basic well visit, nothing serious). Took the kids. Wife missed work.

Can you explain this to me? I'm asking because there is nothing about this that really has anything do with needs. There is a scheduling issued caused by lack of cars or lack of drivers or something.

Your kids didn't need to go to the doctor that day. Your wife didn't need to go to work that day. The Dr. appt could have been changed. Your wife could have rented a car, taken a cab, etc. Instead, I'm willing to bet that she said, "Mike, it's no problem. Just keep the Dr. appointment and I'll call off work for the day."

The alternative, if this was truly about needs, is the situation in which the conversation was more along these lines:

Wife: "Mike, I really need to go to work today. I have a big presentation that I can't miss."
Mike: "Sorry, Wife, but the children have a routine Dr. appointment so you'll have to miss work."

No it was a last second situation that occurred that made it so we only had one car. Sure the doctors appointment could have been changed and sure if it was life or death my wife could have made it to work. Regardless both were needs. People fail to realize that not all needs are life and death. I personally have a game tonight that I need to make (the commitment is made). Is life over if I miss it? No. Would I miss it if something the children needed came up? Yes I would. Just because you don't like what our needs are is irrelevant. We (not arguable) make choices where the kids come first. You (nor anyone else) gets to decide what our needs are. Yes there are degrees of needs (water food, etc). We consider 529s for college a need and they come before wants. I need to do reports for work in the next day, but if something happened with the kids I would not do them as their needs come first.

The point once again are that kids come first in this house and based on many of the posts I read and see we seem to have an easier life and marriage than most here. It also shows me many people here have no business having kids. Oh an my wife's father has made a Sh*tload of decisions based on his child's needs over his wife's needs.

skansiewicz said:   mikef07 said:   BrodyInsurance said:   mikef07 said:   MissCrabette said:   Would you mind sharing one example of how you prioritized your kids' needs over your wife's needs? I'm talking real needs here, not asking you to do the dishes or wanting the last bagel.

If you never had to choose because, as you say, your wife is self-sufficient, then you're not really prioritizing your kids over your wife. You're prioritizing needs over wants.

I have needed to drive my wife to work before and needed to take the kids to the doctor (basic well visit, nothing serious). Took the kids. Wife missed work.

Can you explain this to me? I'm asking because there is nothing about this that really has anything do with needs. There is a scheduling issued caused by lack of cars or lack of drivers or something.

Your kids didn't need to go to the doctor that day. Your wife didn't need to go to work that day. The Dr. appt could have been changed. Your wife could have rented a car, taken a cab, etc. Instead, I'm willing to bet that she said, "Mike, it's no problem. Just keep the Dr. appointment and I'll call off work for the day."

The alternative, if this was truly about needs, is the situation in which the conversation was more along these lines:

Wife: "Mike, I really need to go to work today. I have a big presentation that I can't miss."
Mike: "Sorry, Wife, but the children have a routine Dr. appointment so you'll have to miss work."

No it was a last second situation that occurred that made it so we only had one car. Sure the doctors appointment could have been changed and sure if it was life or death my wife could have made it to work. Regardless both were needs. People fail to realize that not all needs are life and death. I personally have a game tonight that I need to make (the commitment is made). Is life over if I miss it? No. Would I miss it if something the children needed came up? Yes I would. Just because you don't like what our needs are is irrelevant. We (not arguable) make choices where the kids come first. You (nor anyone else) gets to decide what our needs are. Yes there are degrees of needs (water food, etc). We consider 529s for college a need and they come before wants. I need to do reports for work in the next day, but if something happened with the kids I would not do them as their needs come first.

The point once again are that kids come first in this house and based on many of the posts I read and see we seem to have an easier life and marriage than most here.

If it's not life and death, it's a not a need, it's a preference, or a want.

You don't understand what NEED means.

It is not your need. That would be like saying you don't need food for 7 days since you can survive for that long without food. If my wife had not eaten in 4 days then in your opinion she does not need food ....yet. That is a load of crap. Any sane person knows she needs to eat every day. In San Diego you don't need shelter either since you can live without shelter as shown by many homeless people who live there. A homeless guy there will tell you that you don't NEED a roof over your head. Again a load of crap.

Hey if you need to spin crap go ahead.

Lets try it one more time. My wife and I dictate what our needs are period. My wife and I dictate what our kids needs are period. KIDS GET PRIORITY. It doesn't matter what you call a need or a want for our kid. What matters is that our kids needs (as we define them) get priority. No matter what your definition is what we give priority too is not arguable.

So lets be clear. If we (not you, but us) decide that playing video games is a need for our child then it would get priority over my wife's needs. You can call playing video games anything you want, but it wouldn't change what WE give priority to one iota.

yes I guarantee there are things we consider needs that you do not and things that you consider needs we do not. I know people who consider living next to family a need. I do not. If they do and give that priority it does not change what I give priority to.

BrodyInsurance said:   Sorry, Mike, but I am just missing the need in your car situation.

Be honest here. What would have happened if your wife would have said, "Honey, please reschedule the Dr. appt. It's important to me that you take me to work."?

Don't know because we both consider a doctor appointment a need and kids needs come first. Honestly though if I can try and be truthful if we could have made it work for our schedule and got him in a timely manner then we probably could have rescheduled. The point as I just pointed out is that what we deem our kids needs come first. What you think is a need is irrelevant since you aren't part of the marriage.

Like I said (ONCE AGAIN) kids come first. How is that so hard for people to figure out.

Like the bagel situation with us. WHile you may not consider a bagel a need for our 5 year old we do and kids get priority in our house. For the car situation it is irrelevant that you don't think it is a need. It doesn't change what we think and it doesn't change who gets priority. How don't you get that.

I am not here to argue with people about what my needs are and what they deem a need. I don't give a flying f what they think is a need. What I do know (AGAIN) is that our children get priority. I need cup of coffee in the morning. I work with people that wouldn't touch a cup of coffee and could argue that it is not a need until their blue in the face.

I have friends that consider things they do for their dogs a need which I think is ridiculous. Dogs come first in their house. What I think of dogs does not change who and what they give priority to.

After you explained your situation I get it and my view on your children have changed (which I know you couldn't care less about), but some others here have no business having children.

Mike, the reason why "kids come first" is hard for us to figure out is that "kids come first" usually isn't the recipe for a successful marriage. I truly hope that it continues to work for you.

"Sorry, Honey, but you can't go to the huge meeting that you have been planning for the last 3 months. Jr. has his annual physical and his needs come first."

uutxs said:   
Why did you feel the need to qualify that with "Kids needs" in your #1 on the lost. Why not simply leave it at "Kids" at #1?

As for "everyone else gets it", just LOL. This is what you said to glxpass.

I didn't initially. Sorry wrong again. First post about the subject - Kids come first. Sucks when facts get in the way.

People then wanted to expand and act like every single want and need that you kid has comes before anything your wife wants or needs. Not at all, but kids come first. Then we drill down.

mikef07 said:   

People then wanted to expand and act like every single want and need that you kid has comes before anything your wife wants or needs. Not at all, but kids come first. Then we drill down.

Why didn't you just say this 186 posts ago? I think this is a concept that at least the "pro wife" people can accept, whether they agree or not.

BrodyInsurance said:   After you explained your situation I get it and my view on your children have changed (which I know you couldn't care less about), but some others here have no business having children.

There may be something that you are missing with the general mantra of "spouse comes first". There is some important circular thinking. I have no doubt that you want what is best for your children. People who believe in putting their spouse first also want what is best for their children. It's based upon the simple belief that having a happy home is what is best for the children. The belief for these people is that the best way to have a happy home is to have a happy spouse and the best way to have a happy spouse is to make your spouse the priority.

Look I would hope to not do something to the detriment of my spouse. It is a fine line. Does that mean the wife has never ever come first or that I have never come first? No, but when the needs are even (what we deem needs) the kids get priority. Simple as that. IMO i think you are missing the general mantra of "kids come first". You are literally the first person ever I have come across that says kids do not come first.

mikef07 said:   uutxs said:   
Why did you feel the need to qualify that with "Kids needs" in your #1 on the lost. Why not simply leave it at "Kids" at #1?

As for "everyone else gets it", just LOL. This is what you said to glxpass.


I didn't initially. Sorry wrong again. First post about the subject - Kids come first. Sucks when facts get in the way.

People then wanted to expand and act like every single want and need that you kid has comes before anything your wife wants or needs. Not at all, but kids come first. Then we drill down.
You initially said "kids come first". I am not disputing that at all.
When you say "kids come first", does everything to do with kids come first or only certain things to do with kids come first? As you say, not everything. So the answer is a qualified one --- mostly, almost always, depends, if it is a need, however the Mike household defines it.

We agree on the facts, they dont suck and dont come in the way. Just you want to spin it both ways --- kids come first in "everything" or "not always".

mwa423 said:   So if Mike leaves the grocery store at 5:42 pm with one package of bagels and it's raining outside. He travels an average of 31 mph home due to rush hour. Given that his entire extended family in the third world is apparently starving and Southlake, Texas has a high cost of living, who gets the last of the strawberry creme cheese the next morning?

A. Kids?
B. Wife?
C. The dog?
D. None of the above, the strawberry creme cheese gets overnighted to Asia with a box of doughnuts from the family business.
E. SIS while attempting to provide anger management therapy
F. SIS would be overnighting himself to Asia to provide much needed financial relief to young ladies , and I'd take the strawberry Creme cheese and bagels to snack on during the flight

Alternative titles for this thread (now that it's pointless):
1.) "The importance of the block user function, and why did it take me so long?"
2.) "A kidney for my wife, or a bagel for my kids? I can't decide!"
3.) "How to win a debate on a message forum when nobody's debating. Circular Logic 101."
4.) "The importantance of hitting refresh every 5 seconds instead of spending time with my wife."
5.) "Receiving your first epenis PM. How to deal with the devastating reality that you'll never have as nice of a house, as hot of a wife, or as great of a job as a certain FW user."