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The finance forum gets questions every now and then about what to do after a financial "error in your favor". This is one of the worst (or best) case-scenarios, depending on how you look at it.

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/09/dealership-apologizes-error-cust...

Update 11/19/12
Seven weeks after the president of Priority Chevrolet publicly apologized for the wrongful arrest of a customer and promised to make things right, his attorneys are asking the courts to dismiss the Chesapeake man's million-dollar lawsuits.

Attorneys representing Priority also asked the Circuit Court last week to compel Danny Sawyer to enter into binding arbitration with the Better Business Bureau in Norfolk.

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/11/dealership-wants-court-dismiss-b...

Member Summary
Most Recent Posts
Interesting PR strategy for the dealership... they laid low and waited for about 2 months for the national media spotlig... (more)

BADADVICE (Nov. 19, 2012 @ 1:14p) |

It'll be like Casey Anthony 2.0. Grab your popcorn!

BradisBrad (Nov. 19, 2012 @ 2:12p) |

Maybe the Judge will do something cool. Like suggest an impartial arbitrator who can go over all the dealership transact... (more)

sackoloot (Nov. 19, 2012 @ 4:18p) |

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I'm pretty sure that's the most expensive Chevy Traverse in history.

I have a feeling he knew he was putting one over on them but maybe that's just the way I read the article.

I also feel his 2.2 million lawsuit is bogus.

I could see 10k for his time plus any lawyer costs.

He wants $500,000/hr for the time he spent in jail?

I've never been to jail and never had any problems with the police. If I was arrested and put in jail for a civil contract matter, I would be livid and probably also want some outrageous sum, and would be happy to stipulate that the sum be donated directly to a charity or something, if only to show people how egregious it is that someone go to jail over a civil matter such as this.

Why not pursue the employee criminally for falsely reporting the vehicle was stolen?

True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.

I wish more news stories would include the actual court documents on the same page as the article.

BADADVICE said:   I wish more news stories would include the actual court documents on the same page as the article.
but that would be reporting the news!

BADADVICE said:   I wish more news stories would include the actual court documents on the same page as the article.

Smoking Gun publishes some strange stories, but they do always back it up with actual police/court documents.

Was hoping to find some funny reviews for the dealership online (like the bar that had their customers arrested awhile back).

drsauce said:   He wants $500,000/hr for the time he spent in jail?

it's not as if he suffered profound emotional distress or anything. so let's just grossly oversimplify the matter, mkay?

Even if you are a minority of one, the truth is the truth. ~ Mahatma Gandhi

cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


Nice story and nice gesture by your dad, but if a car is sold as is, and it breaks down a week later, what do you think the dealer would have done?

jigsaw1975 said:   cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


Nice story and nice gesture by your dad, but if a car is sold as is, and it breaks down a week later, what do you think the dealer would have done?


Thats a pretty irrelevant question as that story was for a new car and covered by all sorts of rules, laws and warranties.
That car breaks down a week later they would have gotten a new one.

imbatman said:   jigsaw1975 said:   cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


Nice story and nice gesture by your dad, but if a car is sold as is, and it breaks down a week later, what do you think the dealer would have done?


Thats a pretty irrelevant question as that story was for a new car and covered by all sorts of rules, laws and warranties.
That car breaks down a week later they would have gotten a new one.
]

Are u stuck by only what the story tells you? You hate curve balls?

When it's a curveball in a polo match. Yes. I hate them. There's no place for that.

,

And this is why FW Finance forum continues to be one of my key places of amusement on the internet (sad, I know, I know)

I always try to do right if I find that I am not charged or undercharged. Many times in the grocery store they skip items because they scan so quickly. I know that if I was overcharged I would want it corrected. Maybe they should not have lied and went to the police, but I think he should have just went back and signed the new papers. Of course anyone would be tempted not to return to the dealership, but put yourself in their position.

imbatman said:   jigsaw1975 said:   cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


Nice story and nice gesture by your dad, but if a car is sold as is, and it breaks down a week later, what do you think the dealer would have done?


Thats a pretty irrelevant question as that story was for a new car and covered by all sorts of rules, laws and warranties.
That car breaks down a week later they would have gotten a new one.


And many dealerships (legit ones, that are actually backed by manufacturers) will help you out and meet you halfway (if not do more), particularly if said breakdown was related to something they should have seen in the inspections that they are required by law to do. I can't count how many times the dealership I work for has gone out of our way to fix things we should have seen the first time through, particularly if the customer is nice about things and doesn't immediately jump down our throats / threaten lawsuits.

BADADVICE said:   I wish more news stories would include the actual court documents on the same page as the article.
There are no court documents, the DA says there was insufficient evidence to pursue the case.

How can you be charged with stealing a car when you have the sales contract and title in hand with your name on it? Anything else is a civil matter.

BradMajors said:   BADADVICE said:   I wish more news stories would include the actual court documents on the same page as the article.
There are no court documents, the DA says there was insufficient evidence to pursue the case.


The court documents for the civil suit where the buyer is suing the dealership are embedded at the bottom of the article.

sanmd said:   Even if you are a minority of one, the truth is the truth. ~ Mahatma Gandhi

Once an absurdity is accepted as truth, it will seem truer the more absurd it is shown to be. ~Robert Brault

cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


Your Dad demonstrated to you what is integrity and now you proudly share the story with us. We need more people like your Dad in this society where everyone is looking out for themselves only.

Dealer has apologized according to news.
How can the police come and arrest you like this ? You had a contract !!!
I'd sue them too !!

The owner wants to sit down and talk ? HAHAHA And he says you can keep the $5600. HAHAHAH They never were to get the $5600 according to the contract, so how the heck is it a deal you can keep it ???? They still don't get it do they !!!!
How about sitting down in court.

hkgfnt said:   Your Dad demonstrated to you what is integrity and now you proudly share the story with us. We need more people like your Dad in this society where everyone is looking out for themselves only.

I want more people like his dad too. they're easy to exploit.

drsauce said:   He wants $500,000/hr for the time he spent in jail?

Or, another way to look at it, freedom is priceless.

cheezedawg said:   True story:

When I was in high school, my family bought a new car. I went with my Dad to the dealership and watched him negotiate the purchase. This was well before widespread use of the internet, so I don't know how he found the invoice and competitive pricing like he did, but he came armed and ready to negotiate.

After they finalized the deal, we got to the wimpy accountant to write up the paperwork, but the papers he gives us are $1500 less than what we thought the negotiated price was. My dad confirmed, and reconfirmed, and the wimpy guy walked him through it. It turned out that we thought we were negotiating the price with the rebate, but apparently it was the price before the rebate. We got an even better deal than we thought! We were feeling pretty good.

The next day the salesman calls us to tell us that there had been a mistake and we needed to come back in. He wouldnt say why. Then wimpy accountant calls and blubbers on the phone about how he is going to get fired because he undercharged us.

In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.


In economic terms, that behavior is called irrational. In plain English, the word is "stupid".
Well done, good for you and your dad.

If he had signed a contract saying he would pay $5k over the "target price", and came back to the dealership the next day saying he was charged too much, they would have told him to pound sand.

They tried to bully him and it didn't work, so they took it too far. I hope he gets all $2.2mil, and everybody involved at that dealership was fired.

In a related story. Presumed dead, criminal mastermind Murdoc, called police to report that Angus MacGyver had blown up his storage shed. MacGyver spent several hours in jail before police determined that Murdoc had rigged the storage shed to blow up, then locked MacGyver inside. MacGyver escaped just before the explosion, by using a pair of sunglasses and some duct tape. Murdoc apologized to MacGyver, and said he felt bad and would let MacGyver "off the hook" for the cost of the shed. Later, The Phoenix Foundation arrested Murdoc on unrelated charges. Murdoc immediately faked his own death and escaped.

I knew someone who worked in a dealership.
He told me that everyone at that dealership jacks up the prices and sees if they can get away with it.

For example,
Retail will be 30K.
The negotiated price will be 28K.
But when they go to sign the papers the price magically gets raised to 30K again.

1. If the client sees it they would apologize and fix it.
2. If the client does not notice they will let it slide.

(BTW I have been to one dealership with my gf where they pulled this crap on her and kept on insisting that the price was correct.
When I mentioned about leaving (after about 15 mins of getting nowhere) they magically talk to the sales person and then claim it was a mix up)

TravelerMSY said:   How can you be charged with stealing a car when you have the sales contract and title in hand with your name on it? Anything else is a civil matter.

I am curious, would this even fly civilly? I mean they have a contract. It's not as if the consumer wrote the contract and pulled one over on the dealer. The dealer constructed it.

cheezedawg said:   In a very un-FWF way that taught me a lot about integrity and ethics, I went with my dad to write them a check for $1500. Not because we had to (all of the paperwork that both of us signed listed the lower price), but because it was a mistake and we knew it. We did this knowing that if it was the other way around, the dealership wouldn't have budged.
Round about 25 years ago, and prior to, it would be unthinkable for anyone to let an error like this slide in their favor; if, for no other reason, to keep a good reputation within your town.

Well, Times have changed.

Big business is trying to screw consumers at every turn, and lobbies hard against any oversight. Car dealerships, in particular, are far worse than ever before... only recently offset by the availability of deals due to the recession.

Many times we overlook or don't immediately notice our losses... when we get screwed - even if it's just a little bit. But, over time, our losses mount.

So, When you get a win like this, nowadays, it's best just to take it; because, it all evens out. Reputation isn't given enough respect worth saving anymore. The bottom line is, Would the dealership have written a check if the buyer had mistakenly signed to a higher price than agreed. Highly doubtful.

The fact that a car dealership manager would think they can dictate the law to act as their own personal mercenaries is well beyond unconscionable.

Also, anybody that knows car dealerships knows that they always screw you on the trade in, by several thousand below what your car is actually worth.

The, "error," was probably equivalent to simply selling the car for approximately what the dealer purchased it for. Their contract software probably doesn't even allow them to printout a contract below that, "floor," price.

So this, contract "error," is unlikely to have caused any real losses to the dealership. What's more, they probably still broke even, or turned a modest profit, when you factor in a significantly undervalued trade in.

billybwilde said:   If he had signed a contract saying he would pay $5k over the "target price", and came back to the dealership the next day saying he was charged too much, they would have told him to pound sand.

They tried to bully him and it didn't work, so they took it too far. I hope he gets all $2.2mil, and everybody involved at that dealership was fired.


Only fired? Is that all you hope for? Someone at the dealership lied to the police so that they would arrest and jail an innocent person. I would hope for him to be at least arrested himself, and then charged and convicted for lying to the police.

Have had many experiences with sleezy and lying car dealers, but never arrested. This customer should sue their pants off and have them arrested for false arrest.

fatwellatio said:   
Only fired? Is that all you hope for? Someone at the dealership lied to the police so that they would arrest and jail an innocent person. I would hope for him to be at least arrested himself, and then charged and convicted for lying to the police.


This. This isn't about the price of a car. An innocent man was arrested and jailed based on the deliberately false witness of a scumbag car dealer. If I were the victim I would make it my personal mission in life to go after the perpetrator on every legal level.

drsauce said:   He wants $500,000/hr for the time he spent in jail?

If I was falsely arrested like that, I would be worried about the possible impact to future income. Some 'customers' which require high security clearances really aren't intersted in why you were arrested or if the charges were dissmissed. You're not welcome to participate. If you're not useful to a customer, you are less useful to your company.

Skipping 103 Messages...
Maybe the Judge will do something cool. Like suggest an impartial arbitrator who can go over all the dealership transactions for the last five years (including the service and repair shop), and make sure everyone was treated fairly.



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