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bobbybore said:   NotSoHard said:   I'm really not in the know and this is a serious question: CAN you use an attorney in small claims? I was under the impression that in small claims you couldn't use an attorney.

Yes you can.


In what state? The point of small claims court in most states is that lawyers are not allowed in there.

Al3xK said:   saladdin said:   Al3xK said:   I'd like to play devil's advocate here for just a second, so I'm sure this will get red because of the overwhelming support for the OP in this thread. This was compared to a car accident where you have the right to choose who fixes your car, and I don't think that's very accurate.

The sprinkler heads are ~$3 at Lowes, and you just unscrew/screw them in pretty much. This isn't paint work or body damage. The OP had already paid $110 before informing the company or giving them a chance to remedy.

I see where the owner might be a little upset, after he receives a picture that shows a truck tire through a yard, and then gets an abrasive demand for $110. I'd probably be a little upset as a business owner when I see what appears to be just grass with a little tire track through it.


But, as a business owner you know how other businesses mark up those items. No way if the OP called a service would that service only charge $3 for a sprinkler. Add in a "service" call and I can see a business charging a customer $110 easy.


Oh the $110 is completely fair, no doubt. But if the company who did the damage has a full pluming crew, it'd cost them $3/+fuel/+labor and they'd write it off. And again, the picture is not very damning. It shows a tire track.

I think the business should have been notified that a problem even existed first to see what they could do and if it'd be acceptable. And think if I'm right, where a $3 sprinkler head just needed unscrewed and replaced.


EDIT: ~$8 sprinkler head sorry (here)


The business was notified first. They're the ones WHO RAN IT OVER and didnt stop.

You should call the septic company out to random places at 3am.

Mickie3 said:   bobbybore said:   NotSoHard said:   I'm really not in the know and this is a serious question: CAN you use an attorney in small claims? I was under the impression that in small claims you couldn't use an attorney.

Yes you can.


In what state? The point of small claims court in most states is that lawyers are not allowed in there.


NY http://www.courts.state.ny.us/ithaca/city/webpageguidetosmallcla...

If you choose, you may be represented by an attorney at your own expense, but it is not necessary to have an attorney since Small Claims Court is meant to be a "people's court" where claims may be tried speedily, informally, and inexpensively. The defendant has the same choice.

Al3xK said:   I woke up to a drunk mowing a penis into my lawn once (with my mower), and another time mowing the SNOW.

I think we've all glossed over the real solution here. Mow a penis into the company's lawn.

bobbybore said:   Mickie3 said:   bobbybore said:   NotSoHard said:   I'm really not in the know and this is a serious question: CAN you use an attorney in small claims? I was under the impression that in small claims you couldn't use an attorney.

Yes you can.


In what state? The point of small claims court in most states is that lawyers are not allowed in there.


NY http://www.courts.state.ny.us/ithaca/city/webpageguidetosmallcla...

If you choose, you may be represented by an attorney at your own expense, but it is not necessary to have an attorney since Small Claims Court is meant to be a "people's court" where claims may be tried speedily, informally, and inexpensively. The defendant has the same choice.


Kentucky is also optional for both sides. Most other states as far as I know.

Then what is the difference? It has nothing to do with the option / ability to have a lawyer. It's the reasonable ability to be a Plaintiff or Defendant in a case without a lawyer. Small claims court does away with a lot of the confusing process, and decides mainly on evidence and/or the whim of the Judge.

I.e , You have the option of going Pro Se in any court case, but is usually strongly discouraged above Small Claims Court. Judges usually make it clear that they are not going to provide you with any special consideration because you come without an attorney (Any court higher than small claims). I think it's even fairly rare for lawyers to represent themselves if they can afford otherwise.


What state are you in?

saladdin said:   The business was notified first. They're the ones WHO RAN IT OVER and didnt stop.

Listen, I agree with the OP. A lowly driver drove his truck on a curb barely going through the grass and probably thought there was no damage done. That's not notification. Is he even allowed to have a sprinkler head that close to the curb? The driver wasn't doing donuts and no water shot up or anything.

NotSoHard said:   I'm really not in the know and this is a serious question: CAN you use an attorney in small claims? I was under the impression that in small claims you couldn't use an attorney.
Maybe it varies by state, but in Minnesota you can't. I went to small claims court against my landlord many years ago because he tried keeping my security deposit (~$500) AND charge me $1000 after I moved out. His attorney was there and started talking. I politely asked the judge whether attorneys were allowed (I knew the answer already), and he said he agreed with me, told the attorney to sit down. The attorney then tried saying he was a co-owner of the building, to which I replied I had never heard of this guy before. Judge asked attorney how we were supposed to know this guy was a part owner and he said, "They could've gone downtown and pulled the records." Judge was not amused and told the attorney to sit down and not talk anymore.

I ended up winning the lawsuit. (in Minnesota, unlawfully withholding the security deposit gives you the right to sue for twice the deposit plus $200. Judge gave me the security deposit and $200, but didn't give me the double. That worked fine for me. ).

you can report it to Department of business affairs and consumer protection. you can call 311 and report this incident then they will call him in court.

Call up local police or sheriffs department, file complaint of trespassing, for which you have proof.
After which, file claim in SCC for $110.


I like the California rule (no attorney in small claims ) because it forces a southern California company to fly out a representative

I usually pick night court to really make it a hassle for them


Landscape Quote
Disclaimer
Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.

I also, wondering if this would happen, got a quote from a landscape company for the sod and such.

I also attached that.

Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.



Time for small claims court.

SUCKISSTAPLES said:   I like the California rule (no attorney in small claims ) because it forces a southern California company to fly out a representative

I usually pick night court to really make it a hassle for them


That litigation style, have to love it! Nothing like being the shark in the midst when you do face someone who hasn't a clue presenting a terribly weak argument. Systematically tear them to pieces in front of the judge. ha ha

Mickie3 said:   Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.



Time for small claims court.


Yep, I think they intended to string me along the whole time, to make time pass and hope I would just give up.

Lappie said:   Mickie3 said:   Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.



Time for small claims court.


Yep, I think they intended to string me along the whole time, to make time pass and hope I would just give up.
So what are you waiting for? It's really pretty simple to file a small claims court action.

caterpillar123 said:   Lappie said:   Mickie3 said:   Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.



Time for small claims court.


Yep, I think they intended to string me along the whole time, to make time pass and hope I would just give up.
So what are you waiting for? It's really pretty simple to file a small claims court action.


Because they may have actually paid like they said they were going to? There are some people who still have a shred of decency and some honor left, just harder to find them all the time.

Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.

I also, wondering if this would happen, got a quote from a landscape company for the sod and such.

I also attached that.


Woo hoo!

Sorry OP, it's like a small novella that you enjoyed reading came to an abrupt end, then you got word that the author decided to turn it into a series.

Sue, because the more of us that actually follow through with a suit when dealing with companies that try to roll over us, the fewer times those companies may try to screw someone else over in the future. Or, the fewer of those companies will exist as they'll be sued into oblivion.

All the wussies that are telling you to roll over are inviting future abuses.

My own story: I had a roofer working on someone else's house drop a load of shingles onto my car. The owner refused to cover any damages, said he "had a buddy that could fix me up." Right. Took the car to the two most reputable shops in the area, quotes were within $50 of each other, at about $900. Called and offered to send him the paperwork, was hung up on. I took him to small claims court, he actually showed up and argued his side to the judge. Judge stared at him for a while and said "Are you serious? Can you be that stupid? Judgement for the plaintiff, $950 plus court costs, etc. etc."

Felt great! Granted, I only ended up collecting $4 of that judgement 15 yrs ago because he drained all his accounts, but it still felt great. I put a lien on his house which he likely will be in until he dies, and I believe that lien is expired or will expire before then... but ... it did feel nice to win.

*sigh*

If you have free time...sue them. Should be a pretty easy case in small claims. You'll win your money and get your filing fees back.

CowbellMaster said:   Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.

I also, wondering if this would happen, got a quote from a landscape company for the sod and such.

I also attached that.


Woo hoo!

Sorry OP, it's like a small novella that you enjoyed reading came to an abrupt end, then you got word that the author decided to turn it into a series.

Sue, because the more of us that actually follow through with a suit when dealing with companies that try to roll over us, the fewer times those companies may try to screw someone else over in the future. Or, the fewer of those companies will exist as they'll be sued into oblivion.

All the wussies that are telling you to roll over are inviting future abuses.

My own story: I had a roofer working on someone else's house drop a load of shingles onto my car. The owner refused to cover any damages, said he "had a buddy that could fix me up." Right. Took the car to the two most reputable shops in the area, quotes were within $50 of each other, at about $900. Called and offered to send him the paperwork, was hung up on. I took him to small claims court, he actually showed up and argued his side to the judge. Judge stared at him for a while and said "Are you serious? Can you be that stupid? Judgement for the plaintiff, $950 plus court costs, etc. etc."

Felt great! Granted, I only ended up collecting $4 of that judgement 15 yrs ago because he drained all his accounts, but it still felt great. I put a lien on his house which he likely will be in until he dies, and I believe that lien is expired or will expire before then... but ... it did feel nice to win.

*sigh*


Can you renew the lien or judgement? Another possibility is to try and garnish his wages...

highmktgoods said:   CowbellMaster said:   Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.

I also, wondering if this would happen, got a quote from a landscape company for the sod and such.

I also attached that.


Woo hoo!

Sorry OP, it's like a small novella that you enjoyed reading came to an abrupt end, then you got word that the author decided to turn it into a series.

Sue, because the more of us that actually follow through with a suit when dealing with companies that try to roll over us, the fewer times those companies may try to screw someone else over in the future. Or, the fewer of those companies will exist as they'll be sued into oblivion.

All the wussies that are telling you to roll over are inviting future abuses.

My own story: I had a roofer working on someone else's house drop a load of shingles onto my car. The owner refused to cover any damages, said he "had a buddy that could fix me up." Right. Took the car to the two most reputable shops in the area, quotes were within $50 of each other, at about $900. Called and offered to send him the paperwork, was hung up on. I took him to small claims court, he actually showed up and argued his side to the judge. Judge stared at him for a while and said "Are you serious? Can you be that stupid? Judgement for the plaintiff, $950 plus court costs, etc. etc."

Felt great! Granted, I only ended up collecting $4 of that judgement 15 yrs ago because he drained all his accounts, but it still felt great. I put a lien on his house which he likely will be in until he dies, and I believe that lien is expired or will expire before then... but ... it did feel nice to win.

*sigh*


Can you renew the lien or judgement? Another possibility is to try and garnish his wages...


In addition to the garnishment isn't there an fair allotment for interest as well?

Sounds like he owns his own roofing company so there are no easy wages to garnish

I'd take one of his trucks

He's the sole owner of his 'company' so there are no wages. If I remember correctly he had some kind of rental arrangement with his heavy equipment, including trucks, so there really wasn't anything to go after. One of these days I'll visit the country clerk's office and see if the lien is still active; I'll admit my tenacity has mellowed after this debt grew to be 15 years old.

Edit: you guys got me thinking so I called the clerk's office and got the following info:

The lien has since expired, they are only ever good for 10 years. However, judgements stay valid for 20 years and I can attempt to execute them whenever I'd like. Also, judgements incur interest at 9% annually. As the original amount was around $950, it looks like I now have a judgement of around $3500 waiting for me whenever I decide to try to pursue it.

Hmmmm......

Edit 2:

Aaaaaaaaaaahahahaa... spent a little time clicking around my county clerk's site and found a way to search for judgements.

 Detail     Party Name Group Date Bk_Type Status
    * View   ROOFERS NAME   MTG   07/22/1994   M   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME   LIEN   10/05/1998   Q   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME   MDISCH   02/23/2009   M   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME   UCC   07/19/2011   Q   V  
       View   ROOFERS NAME   UCC   07/19/2011   Q   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   MDISCH   02/13/1992   M   B  
       View   ROOFERS NAME C   DEED   05/11/1993   D   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   DAFF   05/11/1993   D   B  
       View   ROOFERS NAME C   DEED   07/30/1996   D   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   MTG   08/18/1997   M   B  
       View   ROOFERS NAME C   DMISC   08/01/2000   D   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   LIEN   02/02/2004   Q   B  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   UPD   10/05/2005   K   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   LIEN   08/28/2006   Q   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C   LIEN   08/29/2006   Q   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME C DBA   LIEN   12/05/2005   Q   V  
    * View   ROOFERS NAME DBA   LIEN   07/24/2001   Q   B  

That's me on line #2! Clicking on detail gives me:

Type: 100
File No.: xxxxxxxxxxx
Date/Time: 10/5/1998 3:54:34
Pages: 2
Consideration: $957.32
Legal:
Grantors:
ROOFERS NAME
ROOFERS NAME HOME IMPROVEMENT
Grantees:
COWBELLMASTER

Looking at the other judgements, I'm just one of many. Not sure there's going to be much blood left in this stone...

Assuming you still have the video why don't you fish around with a local news agency? They LOVE this kind of situation and with the election over might be looking for something to broadcast.

$225 for some grass? I am in the wrong business.

tehlorax said:   Al3xK said:   I woke up to a drunk mowing a penis into my lawn once (with my mower), and another time mowing the SNOW.

I think we've all glossed over the real solution here. Mow a penis into the company's lawn.


That sounds very painful.

biglittle said:   $225 for some grass? I am in the wrong business.
It's easier to get in Colorado and Washington now

CowbellMaster said:   
Looking at the other judgements, I'm just one of many. Not sure there's going to be much blood left in this stone...


Google your state and "judgment enforcement", there are firms who will collect for you for 40-50% of what they recover.
Im sure they can do some kind of till tap, they would probably have to follow him around to his job sites and intercept the payment

SUCKISSTAPLES said:   CowbellMaster said:   
Looking at the other judgements, I'm just one of many. Not sure there's going to be much blood left in this stone...


Google your state and "judgment enforcement", there are firms who will collect for you for 40-50% of what they recover.
Im sure they can do some kind of till tap, they would probably have to follow him around to his job sites and intercept the payment


Now that it has camped at 9% how does one collect on that new amount vs the original judgement? I want to see this crook roofer get blindsided or just leave that to the enforcement team?

on another note FW needs a collection enforcement network but I suppose they would be in the good guys for half the posts and the bad guys for the other half.

SUCKISSTAPLES said:   CowbellMaster said:   
Looking at the other judgements, I'm just one of many. Not sure there's going to be much blood left in this stone...


Google your state and "judgment enforcement", there are firms who will collect for you for 40-50% of what they recover.
Im sure they can do some kind of till tap, they would probably have to follow him around to his job sites and intercept the payment


Thanks, I'll give it a shot, I suppose I don't have anything to lose.

Lappie said:   Well, I hate to reopen an old thread, but the bastards never paid me.

I also, wondering if this would happen, got a quote from a landscape company for the sod and such.

I also attached that.


BradisBrad said:   Lappie said:   Its over. The Operations Manager just called me back and said they would pay for the sprinkler repair, nothing else. I agreed.

I'm glad you found resolution and you obviously feel well-compensated since you agreed to the repair bill.








But secretly I wanted to see this one turn into a FWF classic.


Take him down Lappie.



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