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Yesterday I had a new furnace put in and while they were in the exhaust pipe in the attic one of them slipped off a support beam and put a 3 foot crack in my ceiling. I didn't notice until they left and none of them mentioned it to me. Do I make them reimburse me or do I call me insurance company? How much would it cost to have it fixed? It's just standard painted drywall. They're coming back today to program the thermostat and I want to confront them.

p.s. I'm guessing no one was hurt because no one mentioned it, they may not have even known of the crack.


UPDATE 1 2/16/13:
One of the installers came by to check up on the work and I showed it to him. He took a picture with his cell phone and will show it to his boss on Monday. That's all for now.

p.s. thanks for the responses.

UPDATE 2 2/22/13:
Even though one of the workers came out the next day after installation, I haven't been able to get their "boss" to follow up on it... even after two calls to the company. I will update as soon as someone gets out here.


UPDATE 3 2/22/13: (later that day)
Called the boss directly on his cell phone and he says he'll take responsibility for it. He's getting in touch with his drywall contractor to have him set a date to come out. At least I'm getting somewhere.


UPDATE 4 3/17/13:
Well finally got a guy to come over yesterday and do the job. He did a really good job. It did take a few trips back and forth to get it all done and the result was good. Wow, 30 days from complaint to action... not too good.

Thanks for all the advice FWers

Member Summary
Most Recent Posts
Well finally got a guy to come over yesterday and do the job. He did a really good job. It did take a few trips back and... (more)

carpenter940 (Mar. 17, 2013 @ 2:26p) |

20 days isn't too bad. This could have been much more painful, and you didn't have to get legal folks involved, so I'd ... (more)

HawkeyeNFO (Mar. 17, 2013 @ 2:46p) |

That was as good as you could have gotten

SUCKISSTAPLES (Mar. 17, 2013 @ 3:39p) |

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The installer is responsible. Do not call you insurance company for something like this no matter who is at fault. It is super cheap to fix drywall.

Depending on your deductible this is probably under it and you'll get no payment from your insurer

The installer or their insurer need to fix it
Typically they have a deductible so it'll be coming out of their pocket and will be very resistant to paying as any profit from this job is now gone

Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.
What is the current newspaper for?

Usually to prove that picture is not older than claimed (date on newspaper).
In this case it is irrelevant.

Make sure when it's patched that they don't just put mud on it and do a paint over. Frequently these crack will reappear 6-12 months later if they're not covered with a mesh patch.

Drywall repair is not expensive, but as SIS said, the profit is now probably gone.

If there is any significant cost to the repair, it is due to return trips from the contractor. The process will likely take 4 trips to your home. Plaster. Dry. Sand. Plaster. Repeat. Texture. Dry. Paint

Powza said:   Usually to prove that picture is not older than claimed (date on newspaper).
In this case it is irrelevant.


or they could include a copy of the invoice.

DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.

EDIT: You email the picture to yourself after taking it, preventing the EXIF from being modified and providing a digital trail. Sheesh quit arguing the moot point of editing EXIF.

That still doesn't prove that the crack didn't happen BEFORE the furnace was installed...as the contractor will claim, of course!

Any update, OP?

UPDATE:
One of the installers came by to check up on the work and I showed it to him. He took a picture with his cell phone and will show it to his boss on Monday. That's all for now.

p.s. thanks for the responses.

RedCelicaGT said:   The process will likely take 4 trips to your home. Plaster. Dry. Sand. Plaster. Repeat. Texture. Dry. PaintOP first said "plaster", then said "just painted drywall".

It shouldn't take that much effort - patch in new drywall piece, tape and mud, come back to sand and paint (if textured, that would require and extra day). Depending on when they start, it could almost be done in one day, drywall mud dries pretty fast.

carpenter940 said:   UPDATE:
One of the installers came by to check up on the work and I showed it to him. He took a picture with his cell phone and will show it to his boss on Monday. That's all for now.

p.s. thanks for the responses.


This is sounding hopeful -- an installer following up on the work they completed. I've never had that happen.
Good luck!

Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


And that exif data is modifiable as well as the photo can be photochopped.

He doesn't need proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


And that exif data is modifiable as well as the photo can be photochopped.


Well you can easily photoshop a newspaper into a picture.

You can usually prove a picture is unedited...especially if you have iCloud where I think it syncs to automatically. Also if you modify the EXIF traditionally, it'll change the created/modified date.

You'd have to go through a ton of effort, including jailbreaking your phone to do this.

Al3xK said:   mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


And that exif data is modifiable as well as the photo can be photochopped.


Well you can easily photoshop a newspaper into a picture.

You can usually prove a picture is unedited...especially if you have iCloud where I think it syncs to automatically. Also if you modify the EXIF traditionally, it'll change the created/modified date.

You'd have to go through a ton of effort, including jailbreaking your phone to do this.

Unless you hire an expert to testify, "you" are not credible in a court of law to prove without reasonable doubt it was modified.
Jailbreaking an effort ?

mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


And that exif data is modifiable as well as the photo can be photochopped.


Well you can easily photoshop a newspaper into a picture.

You can usually prove a picture is unedited...especially if you have iCloud where I think it syncs to automatically. Also if you modify the EXIF traditionally, it'll change the created/modified date.

You'd have to go through a ton of effort, including jailbreaking your phone to do this.

Unless you hire an expert to testify, "you" are not credible in a court of law to prove without reasonable doubt it was modified.
Jailbreaking an effort ?


Well you'd have to jailbreak then unjailbreak...which might leave some remnants behind.

I'm saying that an expert would have to prove that the EXIF data was modified...not just that it "could" have been modified. Also, I forgot my second part, which is email it to yourself, which is flawless because it hits your email provider's servers.

MUCH better than a newspaper because you have a digital trail.

Al3xK said:   mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   mistycoupon said:   Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


And that exif data is modifiable as well as the photo can be photochopped.


Well you can easily photoshop a newspaper into a picture.

You can usually prove a picture is unedited...especially if you have iCloud where I think it syncs to automatically. Also if you modify the EXIF traditionally, it'll change the created/modified date.

You'd have to go through a ton of effort, including jailbreaking your phone to do this.

Unless you hire an expert to testify, "you" are not credible in a court of law to prove without reasonable doubt it was modified.
Jailbreaking an effort ?


Well you'd have to jailbreak then unjailbreak...which might leave some remnants behind.

I'm saying that an expert would have to prove that the EXIF data was modified...not just that it "could" have been modified. Also, I forgot my second part, which is email it to yourself, which is flawless because it hits your email provider's servers.

MUCH better than a newspaper because you have a digital trail.


Too much CSI on tv...

Sell crack and profit?

I always take a picture with the newspaper of a major engine part I've replaced such as a timing belt.

http://www.fototime.com/0CA5D57DBF25DEA/standard.jpg

king0fSpades said:   Sell crack and profit?The furnace installers know where they hid their crack and they will want it back. Might end badly for OP.

atikovi said:   I always take a picture with the newspaper of a major engine part I've replaced such as a timing belt.

http://www.fototime.com/0CA5D57DBF25DEA/standard.jpg

Why?
To show a future buyer when it was changed ?
The only problem is that could be any engine from the same manufacturer ...unless you take multiple pics of the engine compartment to show the hood headlights etc is same color and model car

adamsmart78 said:   What is the current newspaper for?

Habit. He is use to providing proof of life.

SUCKISSTAPLES said:   atikovi said:   I always take a picture with the newspaper of a major engine part I've replaced such as a timing belt.

http://www.fototime.com/0CA5D57DBF25DEA/standard.jpg

Why?
To show a future buyer when it was changed ?
The only problem is that could be any engine from the same manufacturer ...unless you take multiple pics of the engine compartment to show the hood headlights etc is same color and model car


Yes to show when it was changed. Once you take an engine apart to the extent of that photo, it wouldn't make sense not to have changed the belt.

It's Tuesday. Don't be a cocktease OP.

RedCelicaGT said:   Drywall repair is not expensive, but as SIS said, the profit is now probably gone.

If there is any significant cost to the repair, it is due to return trips from the contractor. The process will likely take 4 trips to your home. Plaster. Dry. Sand. Plaster. Repeat. Texture. Dry. Paint

doubtful.

and anyone who says "plaster" doesnt know dick about drywall. it's either called mud or joint compound, never plaster.

probably 2 days, maybe 3 hours max per day for a small repair. or a guy could come in the morning and again in the evening and be done.

either way, this is probably a $150-$200 job to sub out, unless the HVAC guys know somebody.

ceiling paint color tends to vary though (lots of brands) - it may actually be tricky to find the exact one. may end up repainting entire ceiling in that room....not that it's a huge deal.

CowbellMaster said:   It's Tuesday. Don't be a cocktease OP.

Sorry, didn't mean to be cocktease. Even though one of the workers came out the next day after installation, I haven't been able to get the "boss" to follow up on that... even after two calls to the company. I will update as soon as someone gets out here.

Called the boss directly on his cell phone and he says he'll take responsibility for it. He's getting in touch with his drywall contractor to have him set a date to come out. At least I'm getting somewhere.

solarUS said:   RedCelicaGT said:   Drywall repair is not expensive, but as SIS said, the profit is now probably gone.

If there is any significant cost to the repair, it is due to return trips from the contractor. The process will likely take 4 trips to your home. Plaster. Dry. Sand. Plaster. Repeat. Texture. Dry. Paint

doubtful.

and anyone who says "plaster" doesnt know dick about drywall. it's either called mud or joint compound, never plaster.

probably 2 days, maybe 3 hours max per day for a small repair. or a guy could come in the morning and again in the evening and be done.

either way, this is probably a $150-$200 job to sub out, unless the HVAC guys know somebody.

ceiling paint color tends to vary though (lots of brands) - it may actually be tricky to find the exact one. may end up repainting entire ceiling in that room....not that it's a huge deal.


Furthermore, it's a two hour job in reality. You can speed up JC dry times by mixing it with warm water. Ups it to a 10-20 minute dry time per coat. So he'll mud twice, sand a little and paint the spot (and/or ceiling). No biggie.

Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


You can easily change EXIF data to anything you want.

wateristasty said:   Al3xK said:   DamnoIT said:   Take pictures of the crack next to a current newspaper and keep your invoice in case you need to go to small claims. The drywall fix to make it look nice could be a pretty penny when you consider the sanddown, patch fill, retexture and repaint process.

With phone cameras today, they store EXIF data, such as time & GPS location...OP could just snap a picture with his iPhone and the EXIF data would support the date claim.


You can easily change EXIF data to anything you want.


The second part, I mentioned lower down, was that you email it to yourself. That's easier to prove than a newspaper. The point is not to prove the validity of the content in a digital image, but a traceable timestamp. EXIF+Email to a GMail/Hotmail/Bigmail is bulletproof, unless somebody wants to argue in court that you managed to compromise google's mail servers. And google has a vested interest in proving you did NOT compromise their servers.

Did they fix it yet?

Well finally got a guy to come over yesterday and do the job. He did a really good job. It did take a few trips back and forth to get it all done and the result was good. Wow, 20 days from complaint to action... not too good.

Thanks for all the advice FWers

20 days isn't too bad. This could have been much more painful, and you didn't have to get legal folks involved, so I'd say it ended up OK.

That was as good as you could have gotten



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