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So i drive a 98 Durango. 190k miles and in pretty good shape. I've done most of my own repairs (water pump, ac, radiator etc) however I know cars don't last forever... so I'm always looking for a graceful exit strategy.

My friend let me know he is selling his 2001 Tacoma with 99k. This has been a vehicle I've wanted, albeit I was hoping for something a little newer (2008 or newer) He has been the only owner and done all the maintenance (new water pump, tires, plugs and wires). He has just used it to commute 20 miles a day. It's pretty much has all the options, double cab, Pre-Runner V6, leather (not 4x4), however I was SHOCKED at the price $10,600 He told me that was in line with KBB. Sure enough he was right. However, edmunds.com has it more in the 6500-7000 range. Also on craigslist, similar vehicles are listed around 10k...

So my question is, as i've obviously been out of the car market for a long time, please help me realize if this is something I should pursue or not and if I should go for the edmunds price or somewhere between KBB and edmunds, I really couldnt believe the discrepancy. I have the cash, but it kills me to pay roughly 10k for a depreciating asset that is already 12 years old with roughly half its life used up (99k miles might not be half way on a Toyota). I can't believe Toyotas hold their value this well. Do I just need to man up and realize the used car market is like this now? Plus I'd only be "trading up" by 3 years from my current vehicle. I can only sell my durango for MAYBE 2k.


I have only a short commute so, if I put only 7k miles a year, the truck could last me another 10 years, easy, but then it would be 22 years old! At some point rubber and other parts starts to deteriorate/fall apart no matter the miles and how well you take care of it, due to age, right?

Spare the Crown vic jokes, I already pass a place everyday on my way to work where a guy always has 3 or 4 interceptors for sale (03' or 04' for roughly 3k-4k, maybe I should just buy one of those when my beloved durango dies)

Thanks for the advice!

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elektronic (Mar. 20, 2013 @ 2:51p) |

Yes, but it was actually Justan Tamberlake, DDS.

swandown (Mar. 20, 2013 @ 3:16p) |

That's so true. I remember me and a few friends was car shopping. I picked up a SUV first, then all my friend purchase... (more)

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You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

Your '98 Durango is still in 'pretty good shape.' Drive it until it dies, then worry about getting a new (used) car/truck. For all you know, the Durango will last you another 5-10 years.

I'm actually in the market right now for a fairly used car (looking around 2004-2007 with 75-100k miles). The best advice I can give you is be patient. I have found that there are some OK deals out there if you look around. Have a plan, know what you want to pay and be ready to jump on a deal you find.

Also, expect to pay a pretty hefty premium for Toyota and Honda. I'm in the market for a compact SUV / sedan and from everything I've seen the RAV-4,corolla,civic and CRV hold their value fairly well.

Finally, do your homework! I originally was looking at a 2006 civic, but after reading around the internet these vehicles have a tendency for the engine to crack, requiring a $5,000 repair (new engine block). Then after considering the Rav-4 I found out they have a tendency for the head bolts to unscrew themselves (and strip the threads).

I really think the smart buys are in the offbrands, suzuki, mitsubishi, nissan, etc. Japanese quality at good prices.


With todays cars (say 2000 +) I think its pretty reasonable to expect 200k miles, especially on the high quality japanese brands. Remember that the resale value stays high. Look at prices for a late '90s Tacoma, they are still pretty high. Your getting a working vehicle with ~100k usable miles for less than 50% MSRP.


Or...just buy a crown vic. You decide.

If you really want your friends car, I would offer him what you deem a fair price. If he doesn't bite then no harm.

If not, it sounds like you don't NEED a "new" car. Start looking and wait for a deal you can't refuse. You are in the perfect situation to be in.

What a depressing post. I have a nice 2000 (Lexus version of the Landcruiser) with 160000 miles.

It will need its second timing belt, hoses, etc... in a couple more years; and occasionally needs repairs - but I really like the vehicle. I really anticipate it lasting me through at least 2020 (if the Gasoline stays affordable).

Am I being over optimistic about the ability of a vehicle to last?

OP, you might want to check on car forums for used car pricing advice on a specific model.

yeah thats the thing, my current vehicle, works fine, when it dies, I'll just have my wife give me a ride to work for a few days till I grab something. I knew you guys would come through, thanks for the advice.

I was having a weak moment.


I would pass on the car... the used car market is overpriced currently... many cars have been appreciating.

No one should be buying a used car right now unless they have an absolute need that can't wait. I have seen Civics with 200k miles selling for like 4-5k.

Come back into the market when there are better deals.

Aren't the '01 Tacomas the ones with the rusting frame problems?

lotusgardener said:   Aren't the '01 Tacomas the ones with the rusting frame problems?

Bro-in-law had a Tacoma, don't remember year. Toyota bought it back at either at 12k, 15k, or 18k (don't remember totally rediculaous amount) due to the recall/rust couple years ago.

lotusgardener said:   Aren't the '01 Tacomas the ones with the rusting frame problems?

Good call...

Text

lotusgardener said:   Aren't the '01 Tacomas the ones with the rusting frame problems?

I thought that was prior to 2000. I had a 97 that got taken from that program.

Yep cash for clunkers wiped out the bottom of the market so there was more fighting over the available used cars, pushing prices up. Add to that less cars were sold during the economy tanking/credit crunch so now there are fewer 2007-2009 used cars out there driving up (pun intended) prices for older used cars.

If it were me I would hang on to the older car for a few more years (unless you are going to get a crazy increase in gas mileage). I think depreciation will get back to normal once the used car inventory increases.

But as has been said, you're in a good spot mobility wise, keep your eyes open for a deal you cant refuse.

Agree with others; keep the Durango. 10K for a decade + old pickup. LOL. I have a bridge to sell you. Was it owned by Justin Timberlake or something?

A used car with good maintenance records will sell for more then one without or that is broken/needs work. Recently i've found that KBB seems to have more accurate prices for what i see on the market in my area. If you know what to look for in a used car/truck and know how to fix them yourself then buying one already all fix is just a connivence that you have to pay for. If you don't mind making some repairs get one with a decent body that needs some work for cheaper. Personally i have a hard time getting rid of vehicles before they die but we have more then one car so its not a huge issue if one of us is without for a short period of time.


We have a subaru that is going on 250k. We have some ideas of what we will replace it with and the cost but we are holding out until it dies.

If you go through with this deal, you are betting your friendship on the reliability of a vehicle that is almost 15 years old. In other words, you are likely to have a broken-down pickup and one less friend.

elektronic said:   Do you like ducks?

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/3680195576.html


It's gotta be stolen...but I kind of dig it...

turtlebug said:   Your '98 Durango is still in 'pretty good shape.' Drive it until it dies, then worry about getting a new (used) car/truck. For all you know, the Durango will last you another 5-10 years.

Same here. I drive a 1995 Toyota T100 pickup to work. It's not going to win any beauty awards, and I've had to fix a few little things over the years, but I plan to keep driving it until the engine or transmission dies, or something breaks on it that I'm not able to get a part for that renders it undriveable.

Fuel economy on a Durango is not a strong point (13mpg-ish? perhaps), glad you don't have to drive much per year. 6-cylinder Taco is not much better.

If it were me, unless you need the vehicle for towing, etc. I'd opt for a 4-cylinder.

wateristasty said:   You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

C4C should only be affecting the used car market for vehicles that get a combined EPA rating of 18 mpg or less.

eBay is a good price indicator as well.

If your car works and has no problem then it's more worth then buying another used car.

Point is: Once you buy another car, whatever that new car is going to do after spending $10000, your current car can still do same task, without spending anything from your pocket. Plus, as you have worked on your car, you know it more better and you can fix it due to experience and confidence gained by working with it in past.

If you sell your car, you may get around $3500, but instead of taking $3500, if you keep it and use it, it can serve you to earn more then $3500 of it's value.

wateristasty said:   You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

Uh...that "BS" convinced me to purchase a new vehicle instead of a used one, got me an extra $2,500 trade in value for my old SUV, and put me in a crossover SUV that has saved me about $130 per month in gas.

Over the past 3 1/2 years, the cash for clunkers incentive program has saved me about $8,100.

You're absolutely correct that the program's affect on used car supply had an effect on used car pricing. But it's only fair to point out that the program also had a positive impact on (a) new car sales, (b) consumer savings in gas expenses, and (c) air quality.

FLSte said:   Yep cash for clunkers wiped out the bottom of the market so there was more fighting over the available used cars, pushing prices up. Add to that less cars were sold during the economy tanking/credit crunch so now there are fewer 2007-2009 used cars out there driving up (pun intended) prices for older used cars.

If it were me I would hang on to the older car for a few more years (unless you are going to get a crazy increase in gas mileage). I think depreciation will get back to normal once the used car inventory increases.

But as has been said, you're in a good spot mobility wise, keep your eyes open for a deal you cant refuse.


While this is sorta true, the abysmal state of the used car market is due to the lack of volume that was sold in 2008-2009. Now that we're 4-5 years out from that period, there are fewer used cars available for re-sale. Plus, the economy is still not great so people are holding onto their cars for longer than they may have previously. Like the other poster mentioned, C4C only wiped out cars with low gas mileage.

sirrebral said:   wateristasty said:   You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

Uh...that "BS" convinced me to purchase a new vehicle instead of a used one, got me an extra $2,500 trade in value for my old SUV, and put me in a crossover SUV that has saved me about $130 per month in gas.

Over the past 3 1/2 years, the cash for clunkers incentive program has saved me about $8,100.

You're absolutely correct that the program's affect on used car supply had an effect on used car pricing. But it's only fair to point out that the program also had a positive impact on (a) new car sales, (b) consumer savings in gas expenses, and (c) air quality.

The program certainly did benefit a small niche of consumers on an individual basis. We could get very political as to how/whether or not the program benefited society and taxpayers as a whole.

My brother is about as conservative and Republican as it gets, and he took advantage of the program. Why not? Once it was established, it was there to use while it lasted. I would have jumped in, too, but my old minivan (now sitting in my driveway unused) exceeded the mileage cutoff by one MPG. Sigh.

wateristasty said:   You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

That "cash for clunkers BS" got me out of a POS vehicle into a brand new one. I might have been able to sell my old GMC Jimmy for $1K private party, but the ole Gubment gave me $4500 for it, plus I got another $1600 in rebate and scrap value. I also get DOUBLE the gas mileage!

wateristasty said:   You can thank that cash for clunkers BS for the current state of the used car market.

Gov doing what it does best, wasting tax payer's money.

10k buys a lot of rubber parts and stuff. I'd be surprised if you couldn't do a pimp my ride style conversion or something like that

WorkerAnt said:   Gov doing what it does best, wasting tax payer's money.

While it's popular to criticize government programs, don't be so quick to judge.

Many consumers want to save $130/month in gas but can not afford the expenses associated with a new vehicle (e.g. a down payment and/or a higher monthly payment).

A government program such as cash for clunkers can help consumers get over this catch-22 scenario by offsetting the up-front cost and/or reducing the monthly costs to a more manageable figure. This way, consumers do not have to wait two, three, or more years before the deal pencils out. In the mean time, the increased expendable income experienced by the customer via gas savings can be used for alternative goods and services (i.e. the local economy may experience a benefit from spending that might otherwise go directly to oil companies).

This value can not be understated considering the fact that recent increases in global demand for oil have significantly reduced Americans' expendable income, and thus, our spending power. A program that incentivizes economic efficiency is not a "waste".

$10K is a lot for an '01 Toyota anything.

I picked up an '05 Infiniti G35 with 115K miles for a little over $7K as my daily driver a few months ago.
As long as you don't need a big vehicle like a truck or SUV for hauling crap all the time, get something smaller.

P.S. I would never get a pickup truck...too many friends would ask to borrow it to move, or even worse; ask me to help them move.

Right now everyone is getting their tax return. This drives up the value of used cars

Doing business with a friend is rarely a good idea, especially when it is an expensive used car that could throw a rod 2 days later
I'd drive what you have until it dies, but then I have a 2000 explorer with over 200k and a 1992 town car with 110k,
so I tend to have a bias to driving them until the wheels fall off

I had my jeep totaled and thought I wanted an 05-07 Tacoma, something in the first couple years of the second generator. The problem is multifaceted, C4C, used car sales and a lack of other models have significantly driven up the used Tacoma market price. Value for dollar I ended up getting a 2010 Tacoma for $17,3k with 12k miles in a killer, had to unload deal. To me this was worth it over the 10-15k for 2000-2006 models with lots of miles and without a warranty.

If your Durango will make it another 2-3 years I would keep it given the following. In 2015 Ford looks to be releasing the F100 basically ranger, there will be a new Chevy small truck and the Tacoma may be refreshed. Given more options and new small pickups hopefully the used small pickup market will drop back down to a reasonable level.

Another place to get a feel for pricing is cars.com. Looking up the OP's 2001 Tacoma and putting All miles from my zip produced 168 used ones. Further filtering options show about 90 under 10K and 60 some over 10K (some not priced). Of course you would need to select style, engine, mileage filters to get a better apples to apples comparison.

As the other posters have said, most newer cars (both foreign and domestic) should easily last 200K plus. Heck, the OPs Durango sounds like its still kicking at 190K. Plus 10K spent on your current ride can buy you alot of repairs (when they come up).

I've been thru the whole get rid of current ride and get another recently. The FW frugal side of me is sticking to what I have. I like the newer features of modern cars, such as backup sensors/camera, GPS, better info-tainment. But of course, many of these can be added on to older cars via aftermarket parts.

It's a seller's market for sure. Last year at this time I was shopping for an '09 Forester. Here in the PNW they were asking 21-24k depending on mileage. I almost bought an 09 with freshly installed leather and 30k miles. Can't remember my final offer, but they started at $24k. I walked and bought a brand new 2012 for $24k with more options (sans leather, which my wife reminds me about on a regular basis).

Another issue is that domestic cars often depreciate too much and import cars don't depreciate enough. Honda's and Toyota's are usually overpriced as used cars due to the perceived quality but domestic cars are usually a good deal. I would never buy a domestic car new though because they depreciate too much. Imports bought new typically hold their value well.

For me personally, I would never purchase a used car unless it was a fair price and there's clear documentation on the maintenance on the vehicle. From my experience as well as others, there's too many sellers out there that can put a band-aid on a vehicle before it goes broke. I enjoy the piece of mind that I am doing the maintenance and that I will not skip out on maintaining my vehicle's value (tires, brakes, fluids, waxing). Also with zero to 1% interest rates at Dealerships or at Penfed, a new car is a good value if you can get a good price. I know many FWF say to drive a used car until it breaks down, and I definitely respect that, but I would pay the twice the amount for a brand new car then one that is 13 years old with 100k miles. The repairs alone will add up quickly.

Skipping 49 Messages...
RealEstateMatt said:   

P.S. I would never get a pickup truck...too many friends would ask to borrow it to move, or even worse; ask me to help them move.


That's so true. I remember me and a few friends was car shopping. I picked up a SUV first, then all my friend purchased sedans because they said since I have a SUV, they will borrow my car when they go to IKEA or haul big stuff.



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