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I am a Citi TYP card holder and have been churning GCs since I got it. My normal "run" is 4 drug stores and one grocery store. I usually walk away with about 7K in GCs each run. This past Thursday however, went very different. Here is the series of events.

#1: Stopped at the grocery store. Picked up $1500 in GCs.

#2: Stopped at Walgreens and bought one $500 PayPal MyCash card.

#3: Stopped at Rite Aid and bought one $500 Vanilla Visa.

#4: Was pulling into Rite Aid #2 and was pulled over. Turns out Walgreens called the police on me for suspicious activity. The police officer questioned me about why I was stopping at all the drug stores and why I was buying so many GCs. I was honest with him and he checked my CC that I used with my ID to make sure they matched. After everything checked out, he was puzzled on why I was stopped in the first place, but said he had to keep me until the detective arrived to talk to me. When the detective arrived (with the K9 unit as well), he explained all the bad things GCs can be used for (which I already knew) and that is why I was stopped. He said he had called the Secret Service to confirm my identity and that everything checked out. After about 30 minutes of being questioned, I was on my way and told I can continue doing what I do, as it is not illegal.

I visit this particular Walgreens about 5 times a month and buy about $3000 in gift cards a month from there. Why wouldn't they say anything to me in person? Why do they make a store limit on gift cards if they are going to call the police even if you stay under the limit?

I have already called Walgreens and filed a complaint with their corporate office. They said I would hear back from them on Monday or Tuesday. Is there anything I can do legally? I'm not one to go around suing everyone, I have never even spoken to a lawyer (except to buy my house). I feel very violated and embarrassed by the situation. I was pulled over on one of the main streets in the city and everyone passing by could see me being questioned by a uniformed police officer, detective, and the K9 unit. I wanted to go back to the Walgreens and confront the manager(to talk, not cause a scene), but I was advised by many people that that wouldn't be a good idea.

Any advice would be appreciated.

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dbond79 (Aug. 29, 2013 @ 7:48a) |

Bump to nag MIA nsdp: donde esta la beef?

Last Login Date
Wednesday, September 4th 2013 8:12 PM

tuphat (Sep. 05, 2013 @ 10:12a) |

From now on, anytime nsdp comes back to post more (made-up) stories, we should link a response back to this thread.

kb75 (Sep. 05, 2013 @ 2:31p) |

"Don't Talk to Police." A law school professor and former criminal defense attorney tells you why you should never agree to be interviewed by the police. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

"10 Rules for Dealing with Police." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4nQ_mFJV4I

"Downfall" parody. http://youtu.be/r6R5cEEqXpk
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Just let it go. Legit or not, you were suspicious. They checked you out, and confirmed you aren't a money laundering drug dealer, and sounds like they were very professional and understanding. If you can't take it, then you don't belong in this game in the first place. And if you are worried about such suspicions causing problems with your job, then you shouldve factored that in BEFORE starting.

...and the store didnt say anything to you directly because if you were in fact a money laundering drug dealer, confronting you themselves could very well have gotten them shot.

The police officers were understanding and professional after they found out I wasn't a money laundering drug dealer. What I fail to see though, is how I was suspicious enough for Walgreens to call the police in the first place. Of the 5 stores I go to, I frequent that one the least. I stayed under their store limit. I used a CC that was in my name and they also checked it with my ID.

If I am diabetic and buy hypodermic needles from Walgreens, are they going to call the cops because I might be a heroin addict?

Doesn't make it not frustrating, but being called a terrorist is part of the gig. Stupid people don't understand what you are doing (and if they could everyone would be doing it) and so they just yell "terrorist!" to try and stop you from making money. I'd be bouncing off the walls, though, if that nonsense happened to me, so I'm with you.

Also, as an occasional couponer, I can tell you that calling Walgreens corporate is the most worthless thing you can do. They absolutely do not give a shit about anything, so don't waste your time.

sackland87 said:   

If I am diabetic and buy hypodermic needles from Walgreens, are they going to call the cops because I might be a heroin addict?


Yes. People are dumb. I bet you could go to a diabetes forum and find plenty of people with that same horror story.

Was pulling into Rite Aid #2 and was pulled over. Turns out Walgreens called the police on me for suspicious activity. The police officer questioned me about why I was stopping at all the drug stores and why I was buying so many GCs. I was honest with him and he checked my CC that I used with my ID to make sure they matched. After everything checked out, he was puzzled on why I was stopped in the first place, but said he had to keep me until the detective arrived to talk to me. When the detective arrived (with the K9 unit as well), he explained all the bad things GCs can be used for (which I already knew) and that is why I was stopped. He said he had called the Secret Service to confirm my identity and that everything checked out. After about 30 minutes of being questioned, I was on my way and told I can continue doing what I do, as it is not illegal.

I would be drafting a 42 USC 1983 lawsuit right now for violations of the 4th and 14th amendments. What exactly were you pulled over for? Buying a GC is not suspicious activity, nor is it criminal. They had no reason at all to pull you over, much less question you. Even if there were something suspicious, they had no reason at all to further detain you after the CC and ID were verified. At all. The detective's statement about stopping you because gift cards can be used for bad things is not PC or RAS.

I would immediately call the department involved, request whatever paperwork you need to file a formal complaint, and request all reports on the incident, audio and video of the incident if available, and all documents on the officers personnel files. I did this in a case I am pursuing now, and found out that the officer who pulled me over was an admitted drug user, never pulled anyone over for a DUI or had any interactions with anyone that was drunk (impeaches the "in my experience..."argument they may try to make saying they suspected I was a drunk driver", and the department has hired admitted drug dealers. Really great stuff pre-discovery. Actually, you probably want to request all the info first, get it in hand, then file the formal complaint.

Again, this pins them down to a story on what happened. I found all sorts of interesting stuff. The cop said he pulled me over for driving without my headlights on during the stop, but the police chief stated that I was pulled over for driving slowly on a busy highway, and the cop said in his response to my official complaint that he pulled me over because I swerved and crossed the median line. Asking them the same questions in a deposition under oath should be interesting..."were you lying then or are you lying now... officer, can you explain why the police chief disagreed with the reason you stated for why you pulled me over...Chief, can you explain how you determined the road was busy when no cars passed in either direction for 8 minutes..."

I wish I could be nice about this, but you are stupid for talking to the cops. Doubly stupid if you have a clearance and a job to lose. Go to flexyourrights.org and find out why or just watch this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCVa-bmEHuQ or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I_Btei6vKs

Is there anything I can do legally?
Yup, sue them. 42 USC 1983.

I'm not one to go around suing everyone,

Then don't complain and BOHICA. Sue them or sit back and enjoy getting your rights violated.

I have never even spoken to a lawyer (except to buy my house).

It may be helpful with a lawyer, but you really don't need one.

I feel very violated and embarrassed by the situation.
Apparently not that embarrassed or violated. I think you probably liked it, otherwise you would be ready and willing to sue them. Your definition of violated and embarrassed may differ from mine, but in the times that I have been harassed by cops, I was F'ing pissed.


A little background on myself. I have never been in trouble with the law. I am a military veteran and a current federal employee. I hold a secret clearance and get drug tested randomly.Had anything happened with the police, I could have been in jeopardy of losing my clearance, and therefore losing my job.
Again, these are things that that you don't value or really care about if you are willing to take this from the cops. You don't value your job, you don't value your security clearance. I would never, ever let this pass. As a veteran, you should be triply pissed because these guys are pissing on the grave of every person who died securing the country. I didn't stare down North Koreans on the DMZ to come back here and be harassed for buying a gift card.

It's never a good idea to play any large credit card reward point game when you have security clearance. Although it's very unlikely, but It may cause delay to your clearance renewal/reinvestigation.

hell ya don't mess with code name holy cow.
i agree, dude liked it!! some dudes love being humiliated. i got lots of videos that prove this!!

The police officers were understanding and professional after they found out I wasn't a money laundering drug dealer.
So what, they violated your rights and if nothing less to ensure it doesn't happen again, I would make them pay.

Oh, and you are wondering how it happened? Well, some retailers cooperate with local law enforcement and allow them to watch of CCTV or just notify them if someone purchases a large amount of say Oxycontin or valium or makes large purchases with gift cards, apparently. The cops then follow them down the road, pull them over, and question them on the purchase as well as run their info for warrants. They may try to build a case against say a pill mill that is getting prescriptions from a crooked doctor if they can track the purchases and source of the prescriptions.

It's never a good idea to play any large credit card reward point game when you have security clearance. Although it's very unlikely, but It may cause delay to your clearance renewal/reinvestigation.
Really? How? Considering they only look at your debts on your credit report and can't get access to your bank account information, much less transactions, how is that going to be a discussion point or disqualifying condition? Which factor would it be disqualifying for?

codename47 said:   The police officers were understanding and professional after they found out I wasn't a money laundering drug dealer.
So what, they violated your rights and if nothing less to ensure it doesn't happen again, I would make them pay.

Oh, and you are wondering how it happened? Well, some retailers cooperate with local law enforcement and allow them to watch of CCTV or just notify them if someone purchases a large amount of say Oxycontin or valium or makes large purchases with gift cards, apparently. The cops then follow them down the road, pull them over, and question them on the purchase as well as run their info for warrants. They may try to build a case against say a pill mill that is getting prescriptions from a crooked doctor if they can track the purchases and source of the prescriptions.

It's never a good idea to play any large credit card reward point game when you have security clearance. Although it's very unlikely, but It may cause delay to your clearance renewal/reinvestigation.
Really? How? Considering they only look at your debts on your credit report and can't get access to your bank account information, much less transactions, how is that going to be a discussion point or disqualifying condition? Which factor would it be disqualifying for?

Im not top secret cleared or anything like it but id think yes they could look at your bank records. As in they get your permission to look at the records or no pass the clearance.

codename47 said:   
It's never a good idea to play any large credit card reward point game when you have security clearance. Although it's very unlikely, but It may cause delay to your clearance renewal/reinvestigation.
Really? How? Considering they only look at your debts on your credit report and can't get access to your bank account information, much less transactions, how is that going to be a discussion point or disqualifying condition? Which factor would it be disqualifying for?


They don't just look at your debts and OP said cops called the Secret Service to confirm his identity - which is not really an issue, but likely to come up during reinvestigation and may or may not cause small delay.

codename47 said:   Was pulling into Rite Aid #2 and was pulled over. Turns out Walgreens called the police on me for suspicious activity. The police officer questioned me about why I was stopping at all the drug stores and why I was buying so many GCs. I was honest with him and he checked my CC that I used with my ID to make sure they matched. After everything checked out, he was puzzled on why I was stopped in the first place, but said he had to keep me until the detective arrived to talk to me. When the detective arrived (with the K9 unit as well), he explained all the bad things GCs can be used for (which I already knew) and that is why I was stopped. He said he had called the Secret Service to confirm my identity and that everything checked out. After about 30 minutes of being questioned, I was on my way and told I can continue doing what I do, as it is not illegal.

I would be drafting a 42 USC 1983 lawsuit right now for violations of the 4th and 14th amendments. What exactly were you pulled over for? Buying a GC is not suspicious activity, nor is it criminal. They had no reason at all to pull you over, much less question you. Even if there were something suspicious, they had no reason at all to further detain you after the CC and ID were verified. At all. The detective's statement about stopping you because gift cards can be used for bad things is not PC or RAS.

I would immediately call the department involved, request whatever paperwork you need to file a formal complaint, and request all reports on the incident, audio and video of the incident if available, and all documents on the officers personnel files. I did this in a case I am pursuing now, and found out that the officer who pulled me over was an admitted drug user, never pulled anyone over for a DUI or had any interactions with anyone that was drunk (impeaches the "in my experience..."argument they may try to make saying they suspected I was a drunk driver", and the department has hired admitted drug dealers. Really great stuff pre-discovery. Actually, you probably want to request all the info first, get it in hand, then file the formal complaint.

Again, this pins them down to a story on what happened. I found all sorts of interesting stuff. The cop said he pulled me over for driving without my headlights on during the stop, but the police chief stated that I was pulled over for driving slowly on a busy highway, and the cop said in his response to my official complaint that he pulled me over because I swerved and crossed the median line. Asking them the same questions in a deposition under oath should be interesting..."were you lying then or are you lying now... officer, can you explain why the police chief disagreed with the reason you stated for why you pulled me over...Chief, can you explain how you determined the road was busy when no cars passed in either direction for 8 minutes..."

I wish I could be nice about this, but you are stupid for talking to the cops. Doubly stupid if you have a clearance and a job to lose. Go to flexyourrights.org and find out why or just watch this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCVa-bmEHuQ or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I_Btei6vKs

Is there anything I can do legally?
Yup, sue them. 42 USC 1983.

I'm not one to go around suing everyone,

Then don't complain and BOHICA. Sue them or sit back and enjoy getting your rights violated.

I have never even spoken to a lawyer (except to buy my house).

It may be helpful with a lawyer, but you really don't need one.

I feel very violated and embarrassed by the situation.
Apparently not that embarrassed or violated. I think you probably liked it, otherwise you would be ready and willing to sue them. Your definition of violated and embarrassed may differ from mine, but in the times that I have been harassed by cops, I was F'ing pissed.


A little background on myself. I have never been in trouble with the law. I am a military veteran and a current federal employee. I hold a secret clearance and get drug tested randomly.Had anything happened with the police, I could have been in jeopardy of losing my clearance, and therefore losing my job.
Again, these are things that that you don't value or really care about if you are willing to take this from the cops. You don't value your job, you don't value your security clearance. I would never, ever let this pass. As a veteran, you should be triply pissed because these guys are pissing on the grave of every person who died securing the country. I didn't stare down North Koreans on the DMZ to come back here and be harassed for buying a gift card.

I assume he wants to continue buying gift cards in town, not pick a fight with the police department.

You should call us NSA and ask for the video to back up your claims.

They don't just look at your debts and OP said cops called the Secret Service to confirm his identity - which is not really an issue, but likely to come up during reinvestigation and may or may not cause small delay.
I just went through a reinvestigation for my clearance, and they absolutely never said one word about my income or transactions, nor did they gain access to it or much less know where I bank.

I assume he wants to continue buying gift cards in town, not pick a fight with the police department.
The department picked the fight with him. He didn't pick the fight. If he wants to continue to buy GC's unmolested, he is going to have to do something. Besides, it looks like the police dept wants to give him a gift card for his trouble.

Just let it go, no big deal. Good to hear these people are doing their job.

Glitch99 said:   
I assume he wants to continue buying gift cards in town, not pick a fight with the police department.


Codename outlined his two choices:
Pick a fight with the cops who violated his rights and blamed the 'war on terror', or bend over, spread your cheeks and pretend you enjoy it. Either choice can be viable, depending on whether you value your freedom more than your convenience.

asbuilt said:   Just let it go, no big deal. Good to hear these people are doing their job.

Those people were not doing their jobs. They were attempting to cherry-pick an ordinary citizen that was not doing anything illegal. I find it hard to believe that a terrorist of any relevance would be buying a single 500 dollar gift card. This was just hoping to cherry pick some kind of activity.

I am somebody also doing "runs" for a different card (no PMs about). I can certainly understand how you feel. I wouldn't want any of that happening to me.

However I think that is the danger inherit in playing this game. Somebody at the store was suspicious and called the cops. You can hardly blame them for thinking you were up to no good... I think it's fairly obvious when you buy $500 or $1000 that you have some ulterior motive. Most of the employees just don't know it's legal.

As far as the cops...well you can hardly blame them either. They also probably know little about what you are doing.

I try and be friendly with my cashiers wherever possible, and look harmless. I rarely do Walgreens, but of the few times I've been there, their employees are often the most squirrely. I think their policy is less lax than some of the other places, and they are more on the alert for suspicious behavior.

Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one. As to what the police did, would you rather they had taken you down to the police station to talk to you? How were they going to follow up on the incident and find out your side of the case without embarrassing you?

Finally, why were you only getting $500 at Rite-Aid??

codename47 said:   They don't just look at your debts and OP said cops called the Secret Service to confirm his identity - which is not really an issue, but likely to come up during reinvestigation and may or may not cause small delay.
I just went through a reinvestigation for my clearance, and they absolutely never said one word about my income or transactions, nor did they gain access to it or much less know where I bank.


As much as I respect you knowledge on the subject I have to disagree. You know very well that the person being investigated must sign and allow access to the investigators for and to any and all records available. Your credit report being one of them, therefore, they do know and get to scrutinize your finances if they chose to or see something out of the ordinary.

dbl118 said:   

As far as the cops...well you can hardly blame them either. They also probably know little about what you are doing.


It seems silly to give the cops a free pass for not understanding what you are doing. Cops don't tend to give us free passes for not understanding the law. I mean, it is part of the game, but that doesn't mean that in some hypothetically perfect world it would be nice if the cops understood what they were doing before pulling people over.

dbl118 said:   

Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one.


Why is this allegedly labeled as criminal activity?

And if it is, why do they offer to sell the cards with those high denominations to begin with?

Care to explain?

No stereotyping.

corporateclaw said:   dbl118 said:   

As far as the cops...well you can hardly blame them either. They also probably know little about what you are doing.


It seems silly to give the cops a free pass for not understanding what you are doing. Cops don't tend to give us free passes for not understanding the law. I mean, it is part of the game, but that doesn't mean that in some hypothetically perfect world it would be nice if the cops understood what they were doing before pulling people over.


The cops did not fine him. They didn't throw him in jail. They asked him to explain what was going on, and they followed up on it, they realized nothing was going on, and they let him go. It certainly wasn't a fun day for the OP, but everybody did what they were supposed to, and the OP got a little embarrassed. Not everything is the government out to get you. Sometimes it's just them doing their job, following leads, and making correct decisions, as they did here.

fattywallace said:   dbl118 said:   

Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one.


Why is this allegedly labeled as criminal activity?

And if it is, why do they offer to sell the cards with those high denominations to begin with?

Care to explain?

No stereotyping.


A criminal might use a stolen card to buy lots of untraceable $500 cards that can be unloaded. There is a different between acting "like" a criminal and being a criminal. When you are acting like somebody or something, it's not unreasonable to be initially confused for it. Only you are labeling it criminal activity, I simply said it looked like it, not that it was it.

codename47 said:   They don't just look at your debts and OP said cops called the Secret Service to confirm his identity - which is not really an issue, but likely to come up during reinvestigation and may or may not cause small delay.
I just went through a reinvestigation for my clearance, and they absolutely never said one word about my income or transactions, nor did they gain access to it or much less know where I bank.
.... Or they just didnt need to ask you....

codename47 said:   I assume he wants to continue buying gift cards in town, not pick a fight with the police department.
The department picked the fight with him. He didn't pick the fight. If he wants to continue to buy GC's unmolested, he is going to have to do something. Besides, it looks like the police dept wants to give him a gift card for his trouble.

Why is he going to have to do something to continue? He's been checked out and given the green light. Only issue may be at that Walgreens, if they decide they don't want to sell him any more - and that has nothing to do with the cops. The department didnt pick a fight with anyone, they were merely following up on a report of suspicious activity - and they didnt even talk to him until after he proceeded to stop at two additional drug stores.

Yes, he could've been a dick about it like you are suggesting, in which case I'd agree that he's screwed and needs to be watching over his shoulder. But your ignoring the fact that instead, he was cooperative and let them do their thing, and everyone left happy and satisfied that nothing illicit was going on.

For the record, the same thing happened to me over a year ago (not sure if I posted about it or not). Detective caught up to me in the parking lot, similar conversation. I volunteered a copy of my license and my phone number, and told them to call me if there was any future questions or issues. Continued going to that store (along with other area stores) daily for over 6 months with no issue, until corporate policies changed.

dbl118 said:   fattywallace said:   dbl118 said:   

Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one.


Why is this allegedly labeled as criminal activity?

And if it is, why do they offer to sell the cards with those high denominations to begin with?

Care to explain?

No stereotyping.


A criminal might use a stolen card to buy lots of untraceable $500 cards that can be unloaded. There is a different between acting "like" a criminal and being a criminal. When you are acting like somebody or something, it's not unreasonable to be initially confused for it. Only you are labeling it criminal activity, I simply said it looked like it, not that it was it.


A criminal may use anything to do criminal activities with, to include GC's, that alone should not be grounds for anything, specially when the store itself volunteer to sell them and making profit on the deal.

corporateclaw said:   asbuilt said:   Just let it go, no big deal. Good to hear these people are doing their job.

Those people were not doing their jobs. They were attempting to cherry-pick an ordinary citizen that was not doing anything illegal. I find it hard to believe that a terrorist of any relevance would be buying a single 500 dollar gift card. This was just hoping to cherry pick some kind of activity.

Unless the store managers had already talked amongst themselves and figured out it was the same guy "hitting" all their stores. It's highly unlikely that him walking into one store a couple times/week to buy one gift card was the real trigger.

Glitch99 said:   
I assume he wants to continue buying gift cards in town, not pick a fight with the police department.


Yes. the detective was very clear that any further suspicious activity calls on me would be dismissed.

dbl118 said:   
Finally, why were you only getting $500 at Rite-Aid??


As you probably know, store policy changes with each cashier. Thursdays cashier had a limit of $500. I don't argue with any of them so I dont raise suspicion (LOL).

dbl118 said:   Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one. As to what the police did, would you rather they had taken you down to the police station to talk to you? How were they going to follow up on the incident and find out your side of the case without embarrassing you?

IMO it shouldnt have even been followed up on. There is nothing illegal/suspicous about buying a $500 PayPal card. I bought it with a CC in my name, which they have checked with my ID in the past (they didnt this time).

dbl118 said:   
The cops did not fine him. They didn't throw him in jail. They asked him to explain what was going on, and they followed up on it, they realized nothing was going on, and they let him go. It certainly wasn't a fun day for the OP, but everybody did what they were supposed to, and the OP got a little embarrassed. Not everything is the government out to get you. Sometimes it's just them doing their job, following leads, and making correct decisions, as they did here.


I can understand this point of view

corporateclaw said:   Those people were not doing their jobs. They were attempting to cherry-pick an ordinary citizen that was not doing anything illegal. I find it hard to believe that a terrorist of any relevance would be buying a single 500 dollar gift card. This was just hoping to cherry pick some kind of activity.

And this point of view as well.


Finally, @codename47, I appreciate your passion and knowledge on the subject. I dont even mind you calling me an idiot. I knew coming into this post I would be called an idiot no matter what I did.

fattywallace said:   dbl118 said:   fattywallace said:   dbl118 said:   

Sorry for what you had to go through, but when you act like a criminal, expect to be treated like one.


Why is this allegedly labeled as criminal activity?

And if it is, why do they offer to sell the cards with those high denominations to begin with?

Care to explain?

No stereotyping.


A criminal might use a stolen card to buy lots of untraceable $500 cards that can be unloaded. There is a different between acting "like" a criminal and being a criminal. When you are acting like somebody or something, it's not unreasonable to be initially confused for it. Only you are labeling it criminal activity, I simply said it looked like it, not that it was it.


A criminal may use anything to do criminal activities with, to include GC's, that alone should not be grounds for anything, specially when the store itself volunteer to sell them and making profit on the deal.

You must be new here. Its common knowledge that most of the time that's exactly what a store will do - simply refuse to sell the product, no questions asked, end of story. I for one appreciate when a store appreciates the difference between looking like a criminal and being a criminal, and gives me the chance to show I'm just the former not the latter before deciding if they want to continue doing business with me...

As far as the cops...well you can hardly blame them either. They also probably know little about what you are doing.
And that's the point. They don't need to know anything about what I am doing. It isn't their business, and I don't have to tell them anything. They can prove whatever they can prove, which is simply that OP bought some gift cards, which isn't even a civil violation of anything, much less criminal. I can blame the cops, they should know better than to stick their snouts in non-criminal matters.

The cops did not fine him. They didn't throw him in jail.
So what. His freedom was temporarily restrained for nothing at all, which is not something cops are supposed to do. It is a huge deal and not a petty indignity, because Justice Rheinquest said so nearly 50 years ago in terry v Ohio. I bet you are ok with the NSA's prism program...just doing their jobs...right? :

"... it is simply fantastic to urge that such a procedure performed in public by a policeman while the citizen stands helpless, perhaps facing a wall with his hands raised, is a 'petty indignity.' It is a serious intrusion upon the sanctity of the person, which may inflict great indignity and arouse strong resentment, and it is not to be undertaken lightly."[4]

You know very well that the person being investigated must sign and allow access to the investigators for and to any and all records available. Your credit report being one of them, therefore, they do know and get to scrutinize your finances if they chose to or see something out of the ordinary.

It could be an issue if you have some unexplained affluence or you get a personal interview and as a PFC drive up to the hearing in a Lambo. Yes, they can presumably do it if they have some clue that unexplained affluence is a problem or suspect that you are on the take. This sort of thing could cause a problem if he was charged with money laundering or some BS, but in my experience they focus on debts more than income. I told the investigator what I had in my retirement accounts and he didn't blink or even ask for statements or anything. It didn't really seem to matter. I'm not saying in a specific case that it could not possibly be an issue because it could, just saying not likely. Keep in mind that credit reports don't report income.

As to what the police did, would you rather they had taken you down to the police station to talk to you? How were they going to follow up on the incident and find out your side of the case without embarrassing you?
Wow, you are suggesting a custodial arrest for buying gift cards?? Then again, dumber things have happened...like getting arrested for paying with $2 bills...http://www.thelibertyvoice.com/man-arrested-cuffed-after-using-2...

Again, they don't need to know my side of the story other than "I don't consent to any searches, I'd like a lawyer, I don't wish to make any statements or be interrogated, and I would like to be free to go and will now exercise my right to be silent."


My guess is all that a trip to the station would just up the cost of a civil lawsuit to about $40-50k. They can't just take you downtown to make you talk. Then you have to get into the actual charging of someone with a crime, which is what exactly?

Yes. the detective was very clear that any further suspicious activity calls on me would be dismissed.
Want to take odds on that? I know of only one way to assure that and burn your image into their minds. When they see your name with Plaintiff under it.

IMO it shouldnt have even been followed up on.
Absolutely correct and therein lies the problem they have. Your option to follow up on it or not.


Finally, @codename47, I appreciate your passion and knowledge on the subject. I dont even mind you calling me an idiot. I knew coming into this post I would be called an idiot no matter what I did.
Not a personal jab against you, just saying it is profoundly unwise, particularly in your position with a security clearance and job to lose. It is like walking into a police station and asking if you have any active warrants or if anyone looking like you has been suspected of a crime. The gov will fire you and walk you out the door first and ask questions later. I would never, ever talk to the cops other than to exercise my rights and leave it at that. If they had PC, you would have been arrested already and not talked to. They are just trying to get something on you. My suggestion is to not fall into the trap.

codename47 said:   
Again, they don't need to know my side of the story other than "I don't consent to any searches, I'd like a lawyer, I don't wish to make any statements or be interrogated, and I would like to be free to go and will now exercise my right to be silent."


My guess is all that a trip to the station would just up the cost of a civil lawsuit to about $40-50k. They can't just take you downtown to make you talk. Then you have to get into the actual charging of someone with a crime, which is what exactly?

A person can be detained without being charged. Just not indefinitely. Give your response, and that's exactly what happens. Then one $5k legal bill later, you are sitting in the same position that OP got to for free, only for you the cops are still wondering what you were hiding while OP has a new friendly contact in the department should he ever need it.

Glitch99 said:   
You must be new here. Its common knowledge that most of the time that's exactly what a store will do - simply refuse to sell the product, no questions asked, end of story.


If they felt and they obviously did, that this was the case, they should've done as you described. End of the story. Are the GC's being displayed to be sold or to attract criminals-want-to-look-like?

Glitch99 said:    I for one appreciate when a store appreciates the difference between looking like a criminal and being a criminal, and gives me the chance to show I'm just the former not the latter before deciding if they want to continue doing business with me...

They had that chance, OP mentioned showing CC's and ID's in the past, which makes the purchase legit. They had no reason to call Police to investigate what, a legit purchase?

codename47 said:   As far as the cops...well you can hardly blame them either. They also probably know little about what you are doing.
And that's the point. They don't need to know anything about what I am doing. It isn't their business, and I don't have to tell them anything. They can prove whatever they can prove, which is simply that OP bought some gift cards, which isn't even a civil violation of anything, much less criminal. I can blame the cops, they should know better than to stick their snouts in non-criminal matters.

The cops did not fine him. They didn't throw him in jail.
So what. His freedom was temporarily restrained for nothing at all, which is not something cops are supposed to do. It is a huge deal and not a petty indignity, because Justice Rheinquest said so nearly 50 years ago in terry v Ohio. I bet you are ok with the NSA's prism program...just doing their jobs...right? :

"... it is simply fantastic to urge that such a procedure performed in public by a policeman while the citizen stands helpless, perhaps facing a wall with his hands raised, is a 'petty indignity.' It is a serious intrusion upon the sanctity of the person, which may inflict great indignity and arouse strong resentment, and it is not to be undertaken lightly."[4]

You know very well that the person being investigated must sign and allow access to the investigators for and to any and all records available. Your credit report being one of them, therefore, they do know and get to scrutinize your finances if they chose to or see something out of the ordinary.

It could be an issue if you have some unexplained affluence or you get a personal interview and as a PFC drive up to the hearing in a Lambo. Yes, they can presumably do it if they have some clue that unexplained affluence is a problem or suspect that you are on the take. This sort of thing could cause a problem if he was charged with money laundering or some BS, but in my experience they focus on debts more than income. I told the investigator what I had in my retirement accounts and he didn't blink or even ask for statements or anything. It didn't really seem to matter. I'm not saying in a specific case that it could not possibly be an issue because it could, just saying not likely. Keep in mind that credit reports don't report income.

As to what the police did, would you rather they had taken you down to the police station to talk to you? How were they going to follow up on the incident and find out your side of the case without embarrassing you?
Wow, you are suggesting a custodial arrest for buying gift cards?? Then again, dumber things have happened...like getting arrested for paying with $2 bills...http://www.thelibertyvoice.com/man-arrested-cuffed-after-using-2...

Again, they don't need to know my side of the story other than "I don't consent to any searches, I'd like a lawyer, I don't wish to make any statements or be interrogated, and I would like to be free to go and will now exercise my right to be silent."


My guess is all that a trip to the station would just up the cost of a civil lawsuit to about $40-50k. They can't just take you downtown to make you talk. Then you have to get into the actual charging of someone with a crime, which is what exactly?


Wish I could give this post more green!

Though the things we do here are legal, a lot of them are outside of the realm of normalcy. We are more likely to get strange looks from store clerks and get fraud alert calls from our credit card companies. Appearing suspicious comes with the territory. You ran into an overly cautious employee who called the cops and the cops handled the situation professionally.

If you want some revenge, pursue Walgreens though their corporate office/letter to the CEO.

Glitch99 said:   

A person can be detained without being charged. Just not indefinitely. Give your response, and that's exactly what happens.


Or talk to the cops, put your foot in the mouth and be jailed w/o any mercy. Cops look as heroes and you, well, talking to Bubba.

Glitch99 said:   Then one $5k legal bill later, you are sitting in the same position that OP got to for free, only for you the cops are still wondering what you were hiding while OP has a new friendly contact in the department should he ever need it.

You can't be that naive?

fattywallace said:   Glitch99 said:   
You must be new here. Its common knowledge that most of the time that's exactly what a store will do - simply refuse to sell the product, no questions asked, end of story.


If they felt and they obviously did, that this was the case, they should've done as you described. End of the story. Are the GC's being displayed to be sold or to attract criminals-want-to-look-like?

Glitch99 said:    I for one appreciate when a store appreciates the difference between looking like a criminal and being a criminal, and gives me the chance to show I'm just the former not the latter before deciding if they want to continue doing business with me...

They had that chance, OP mentioned showing CC's and ID's in the past, which makes the purchase legit. They had no reason to call Police to investigate what, a legit purchase?

Walgreens has no way to verify that a license is legit. Matching credit card name with ID only weeds out the random bums who find a credit card on the street. If, as I previously speculated, they knew he was visiting multiple stores, it shows a level of organization beyond a petty theif. Besides, most people here crying foul over this situation would also bitch about a store requiring ID at all "in violation of their merchant agreement with Visa" or some other technicality.

As I've told numerous store managers - "whatever will make you comfortable with my activity". If it takes a police detective clearing me, so be it. Goes hand in hand with voluntarily respecting whatever limits each manager wants to impose, regardless of company policy.

Glitch99 said:   
As I've told numerous store managers - "whatever will make you comfortable with my activity". If it takes a police detective clearing me, so be it. Goes hand in hand with voluntarily respecting whatever limits each manager wants to impose, regardless of company policy.


At least you had the opportunity to speak with the managers. Thats the thing that bothers me the most I think. Not a single word was said to me. Just wait till I leave then call the cops. Punk move IMO.

OP was detained, detentions are like 20-30 minutes, tops. Taking someone in handcuffs to a police station as a detention for buying gift cards is frought with civil liability.

A person can be detained without being charged. Just not indefinitely. Give your response, and that's exactly what happens. Then one $5k legal bill later, you are sitting in the same position that OP got to for free, only for you the cops are still wondering what you were hiding while OP has a new friendly contact in the department should he ever need it.
5k legal bill? Surely you jest. What for? I don't need any contacts in the department, either and I wouldn't presume that they are that friendly with him.

Glitch99 said:   
Walgreens has no way to verify that a license is legit. Matching credit card name with ID only weeds out the random bums who find a credit card on the street. If, as I previously speculated, they knew he was visiting multiple stores, it shows a level of organization beyond a petty theif. Besides, most people here crying foul over this situation would also bitch about a store requiring ID at all "in violation of their merchant agreement with Visa" or some other technicality.


So what are they, at store that sells merchandise or a crew of Hawaii 5-0 looking for an alleged crime?

Glitch99 said:   As I've told numerous store managers - "whatever will make you comfortable with my activity". If it takes a police detective clearing me, so be it. Goes hand in hand with voluntarily respecting whatever limits each manager wants to impose, regardless of company policy.

That is your choice.

Skipping 657 Messages...
From now on, anytime nsdp comes back to post more (made-up) stories, we should link a response back to this thread.



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