www.FirstIB.com and USAA.com have long been celebrated as the two finest transactional accounts available. Both have provided automated, online funds transfer via the Federal Reserve's Automated Clearing House (ACH) for several years. They both have different strengths and weaknesses.
I'm just learning USAA's system, but have been heavily using FirstIB's services for years, including their new system, which came online just last month. Previously, FirstIB's ACH transfers had all been done manually by FirstIB reps. Last month, it was all automated and farmed out to CashEdge, one of the leading vendors for ACH services.
Here are some details about the system:
-CSRs still learning FirstIB offers v good customer service, but as they confirmed to me on the phone today, even their most senior people are still learning about its quirks. Expect them to not know the answer to every exotic question right away, but to try to address them professionally.
-Automated verification. Now, when you add an external account, you get two paypal-style trial deposits the next business day. After verifying those, you're instantly ready to go. (Unlike some other banks, like Capital One's, you get to keep the deposits, which are often $1-2 per account.) As pnfisher notes, "For some accounts, such as adding a Citibank account, FirstIB/CashEdge will, by default, verify your external account by attempting to login to the account with your username and password (or other online credentials). Using this method you can instantly transfer funds, but you'll miss out on the $1-2 deposit. There is an option on the form which permits you to opt out of the default method and perform a normal ACH deposit verification for these types of accounts." (Thanks pnfisher)
-Premium vs. Standard Cashedge's "standard" service is 3 business day transfers. This is lame, because in addition to being slower, they get to keep the "float" made on transactions. So, If I do a "standard" ACH in on a Monday from Citibank, then the funds leave Citibank on Tuesday, but don't hit FirstIB until Thursday. "Premium" service is next day: I schedule Monday, funds leave citibank AND arrive at FirstIB on Tuesday. For both services, the cutoff is always 8 pm eastern, 5 PM pacific time (unlike their previous 12 pacific time cutoff.)
-Incoming free, outgoing $5 Just as before, FirstIB never charges for incoming ACH, either standard or premium. For outgoing ACH's, it's $5, no matter how large the amount.
-Variable limits. Transfers are by "customer number", not account. So, if I have 10 accounts, I get the same limits on ACH as if I had one. Similarly, if I have a joint account, both account holders can use their transfer limits on the same account. Upon signing up for the service, each customer number is given a limit. (AFAIK, you can't check your limit until start your first transfer--which in turn can't be done until you've verified at least one external account.) You're given both daily limits and "rolling" 30-day limits. They start at $5K daily/$25K monthly. They couldn't confirm their maximum, but said they thought my limit of $100K daily/$250K monthly was as high as they would go.
Supposedly, the limits for ACH out are entirely distinct from ACH in. I have some reason to believe this isn't right, and will hopefully be confirming it one way or another in the coming days.
-Scheduling for Standard Transfers onlyCashedge is always pushing standard transfers, so that they can keep the float. Probably as a result of this, the newly offered advance scheduling of ACH transfers works only on standard transactions, not premium ones. (This is the biggest weakess in their new offering, IMO. I asked if they would inquire about changing it, and while they indicated they would, they thought it was a CashEdge limitation, not a FirstIB limitation, so they couldn't promise anything.)
-Transfers on Sunday too, counter their site While the site states that you need to make the 5pm PT cutoff on one "business day" in order to have it processed by the next business day, weekends offer an exception. If you do a transfer before 5pm on Sunday, it posts Sunday night, and you receive the funds on Monday.
-They try to pull funds twice before rejecting them. Sadly, their Sunday policy was a problem for me last week, because by pulling on Monday instead of Tuesday (as their site stated), I had it pull just before funds were available to cover it, and had ACH overdraft. No big deal, they'd pay the fee, et cetera...EXCEPT that then, the next day, cashedge repeated the same pull! This was something that "senior management" at FirstIB had apparently not been told by cashedge, and they're researching it further.
-Available funds + $750 must cover outgoing Premium ACHs. Even if you have an LOC sufficient to cover the outgoing transfer, you need to have those funds available in checking at the time of transfer in order to input an outgoing ACH.
I hope this is clear so far...please add experiences, other info, etc. and I will do my best to answer questions.
Edited 7/28 to add info on opting for deposit verification (thanks pnfisher)
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Not sure if this thread is limited to just First IB or more broadly institutions that use CashEdge-based ACH. But FWIW, Meadows CU Emoney transfer service using CashEdge has similar requirements and features with a few variations: - Savvy Checking account has unlimited inbound and outbound transfers - Daily transfer limit for standard for in is 2,000 out is 15,000. Premium is 2,000 both in and out - Monthly transfer limit for standard for in is 5,000 out is 25,000. Premium is 5,000 both in and out. - Can pay anyone using their e-mail address. Day 1 to request the payment. Day 2 money debit from account. Day 3 fund is transferred to receiver. Day 4 notification to receiver of fund availability. Day 5, receiver collects fund and you receive confirmation. Daily limit is 500 and monthly is 1000.
Let's keep this thread limited to just FirstIB, just because it's complex enough (as the OP suggests.) However, having a separate, central "CashEdge-based ACH at online banks: comparison, analysis, & discussion" thread would be an excellent idea.
Would someone with an avid interest in these systems like to take the lead and start such a thread?
DaveHanson said:-Automated verification. Now, when you add an external account, you get two paypal-style trial deposits the next business day. After verifying those, you're instantly ready to go. (Unlike some other banks, like Capital One's, you get to keep the deposits, which are often $1-2 per account.)For some accounts, such as adding a Citibank account, FirstIB/CashEdge will, by default, verify your external account by attempting to login to the account with your username and password (or other online credentials). Using this method you can instantly transfer funds, but you'll miss out on the $1-2 deposit. There is an option on the form which permits you to opt out of the default method and perform a normal ACH deposit verification for these types of accounts.
pnfisher said:DaveHanson said:-Automated verification. Now, when you add an external account, you get two paypal-style trial deposits the next business day. After verifying those, you're instantly ready to go. (Unlike some other banks, like Capital One's, you get to keep the deposits, which are often $1-2 per account.)For some accounts, such as adding a Citibank account, FirstIB/CashEdge will, by default, verify your external account by attempting to login to the account with your username and password (or other online credentials). Using this method you can instantly transfer funds, but you'll miss out on the $1-2 deposit. There is an option on the form which permits you to opt out of the default method and perform a normal ACH deposit verification for these types of accounts. Yes. I was able to set up my Bank of America checking account using this (automated login attempt) method and could transfer funds right after (IIRC).
gkl said:-Variable limits. ...They start at $5K daily/$25K monthly...
How to increase these limits? I had to request and increase. It sounds like they have two sets of limits. They determine if you "qualify" for the higher limits based on your previous ACH activity.
Certain valid ACH routing numbers cannot be used to add external accounts. ING Direct, for instance, is locked out. While 031176110 is a valid ABA routing number for ING Direct, FirstIB/CashEdge displays an error:Error: No institutions match the information you have entered. Please confirm the ABA/Routing you have entered and try again.When I questioned FirstIB regarding the error message, they stated that ING Direct does not permit outside institutions to set up ACH entries to their accounts.
Apparantly Captial One doesn't either. I wasn't suprised you couldn't link the HYS, but was a little suprised that they wouldn't do a capone money market account either.
I have a situation where I need to make a monthly deposit to someone else's bank account. It is a citibank account, all I have is the routing number and account number. Could I use this service to do it? Do the transfers have to be between accounts in your name?
EDIT: After reading some more, I think what I'm looking for is basically a free wire transfer. Is this the solution?
I also found this at citibank, which might be of interest: Linky
If you transfer TO/FROM a citibank affiliate it is free nextday service.
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