• Go to page :
  • 1 234
  • Text Only
Voting History
rated:
I've noticed in the last few days that I am NOT getting nickels from stores. I am getting pennies instead. This is around Austin Texas. Have you noticed this in your part of the world, even intermittently?

If metal prices keep rising, nickels will soon have more nickel in them than their face value.

Real world inflation is marching on and the dollar is rapidly declining against commodities and metals- gold, oil, silver, copper- you name it.

Is it worth trying to obtain large bags of nickel? I am consider it, but I don't know how easy it'll be. Where could one get them- I doubt banks will give them to non-retail business customers.

We may be just a few days away before this makes world news and there is a public "panic" of sorts, as nickels literally disappear from our currency, as people horde them. This may have side effects on the larger economy that cannot be anticipated.

Further.. pennies have about .008 dollars of metal in them today, and they too may soon disappear.

This is a serious topic and I hear absolutely nothing about it anywhere.



Member Summary
Most Recent Posts
Squeezer99 said: <blockquote><hr>The US Mint is issuing today a new $50 gold coin that is like the buffalo nickel. Its ... (more)

longwood8 (Aug. 24, 2006 @ 10:41p) |

So is everyone on the same page that yes, a nickel is worth more then .05 cents in another form but it is not cost effec... (more)

WhiteGuy (Aug. 26, 2006 @ 12:26a) |

WhiteGuy said: <blockquote><hr>So is everyone on the same page that yes, a nickel is worth more then .05 cents in anothe... (more)

mariojm (Aug. 26, 2006 @ 12:54a) |

Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

the sky is falling!

they will simply use a new metals mix that costs less if the components of the current nickel rise too much, just like they did with the pennies

I can just imagine someone "hording" nickels...

I would assume it would be like having a silver quarter; the silver makes it more valuable but as an investment I can't imagine that being too great.


http://www.usmint.gov/about_the_mint/index.cfm?action=coin_specifications

richfish13 said: [Q]I would assume it would be like having a silver quarter; the silver makes it more valuable but as an investment I can't imagine that being too great.

Actually I believe those coins are worth more then 4x face value. Which makes them quite valuable, hence there are very few in circulation anymore, and people do melt them down.

Nickels are 75% copper and 25% nickel. I'm not sure how cost effective it would be to seperate the two (i have no clue what would be involved or what the cost would be) I doubt that it would be worthwhile unless nickel goes much higher.

BSRdr said: [Q]richfish13 said: [Q]I would assume it would be like having a silver quarter; the silver makes it more valuable but as an investment I can't imagine that being too great.

Actually I believe those coins are worth more then 4x face value. Which makes them quite valuable, hence there are very few in circulation anymore, and people do melt them down.

Yes but compare investing $1000 in silver quarters back in 1964 when they were last made (I believed) compared to investing $1000 in other investments in 1964 and i'm sure the quarters aren't the way to go.

Well you also have the 75% copper in the coin to consider, though I don't believe that is worth more than 0.1 cents.

My understanding is that both zinc and copper are in the penny - FT did a study showing there's 1.6c(as I recall) of both in the coin. Whole game here is in pennies and nickels, as the face value goes up they become less interesting to the smelter(question of weight of materials versus face value).

No of no law forbidding smelting of US currency, it's certainly been done before.

Most the silver value in other coins was flushed out in the early 80s when silver was $50+ per troy ounce.

wonderful site for fun for pennywise:

http://www.coinflation.com/ # seems to disprove thesis of thread

Fun discussion of same ft piece:
http://www.marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2006/04/should_you_melt.html

teaser of ft piece

manuel said: [Q]MyMost the silver value in other coins was flushed out in the early 80s when silver was $50+ per troy ounce.IIRC that never happened, or just for a day or so...i think $25 was about the peak

Pretty sure peak was $53 per troy ounce.

snippet from www.cftc.gov
To illustrate what I mean, consider the activity of the Hunt brothers in the silver markets in the late 1970s and early 80s. The Hunt brothers were convinced that silver was undervalued. They saw an opportunity and began to accumulate massive quantities of silver stocks. The more they bought, the more expensive it became to acquire; and the more expensive silver became, the more silver supplies flowed into the market. Due in large part to their accumulation of physical silver, futures prices rose from about $2.00 an ounce in the early 70s, to peak at $54 an ounce in 1980, before collapsing in dramatic fashion.

I think you people have to put down the pipe and step away from your computer!

CNBC did a story the other day about how $100 worth of pre-1982 pennies -- when they were still 100% copper -- is worth $158 (I think that was the number) in metal value. And pre-1982 pennies are still easily available in circulation.

it is actually possible to do this with pennies. I haven't followed this for awhile, but with the older pennies they do contain more copper than 1 cent. I imagine with the price of copper going up lately, it is a good bit more than .01.

If you've ever used coinstar (I use it just for pennies somtimes) you'll notice it separates (or used to separate) the pennies into new and old kinds. They would be silly to not keep the old pennies and melt them down for a profit.

From what I understand, nickels come to the banks in rolls from the fed. The bagged nickels come back from merchants. This means, if you're buying as a long term value investment the uncirculated rolls would be best. I might go and buy a hundred or so rolls, we'll see.

The same people hording the "gold" dollar coins? The ones they tried to start circulating at Wal-Mart and never made it since the cashiers swapped their paper dollars for the gold coins. <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif" border=0>

this is an excellent investment plan, i have liquidated all other assets and i just filled my swimming pool with nickels.

so i was on the beach wearing my speedo's the other day
and some chick walks by and goes "u got a roll of pennies in there?!?!?"
so i says "yeah, want me to knock some cents into you?>

I have been collecting coins for 40 years, run both a gold and a coin site,
Topic has been discussed in usenet *rec.collecting.coins", so I have numbers.

pre-1982 US cents weigh 3.11 grams
95% copper = 2.9545 grams worth 1.938 cents ($6560/mt)
5% zinc = .1555 grams worth .05 cents ($3215/mt)
which makes each cent worth 1.988 cents

Nickels weigh 5 grams
75% copper 3.75gram, worth 2.460 cents
25% nickel 1.25 grams, worth .2.276 cents (nickel is $18,200/mt)
Total 4.736, close but not yet !

post 1982 cents weigh 2.5g gram
97.5% zinc, 2.4375 grams worth .784 cents
2.5% copper, .00656 grams worth .041 cents
Total .825 cents, close but not yet !

By the way, "junk silver" (aka 90% dimes, quarters and halves)
has a melt value of .715 times silver price.
At $14 silver, "junk silver' is worth about 10X face
silver dime = $1.00 silver quarter = $2.50 silver halves = $5.00

Dealers pay less than melt, sell for more than melt
Here's an example of buy at 9.35 times, sell at 10.45 times, typical.

P.S. was aware of coinflation site, just wanted to give detailed calculations.

Save time - go to www.coinflation.com # fixed my typo

today's numbers last two are metal value and metal as % of face value

1959-1982 Cent (Copper) * $0.01 $0.0199465 199.4600%
1946-2006 Nickel $0.05 $0.0473977 94.7900%
1982-2006 Cent (Zinc) * $0.01 $0.0081884 81.8800%
1965-2006 Dime $0.10 $0.0171307 17.1300%
1965-2006 Quarter $0.25 $0.0427949 17.1100%
1971-2006 Half Dollar $0.50 $0.0855904 17.1100%
1979, 1980, 1999 SBA $1.00 $0.0650548 6.5000%
2000-2006 Sacajawea ** $1.00 $0.0514947 5.1400%

While we are talking about coins: Not quite as interesting as the arbitrage opportunity but maybe useful for some FWer in NYC:

Coins worth $1000 in NYC

manuel said: [Q]Save time - go to www.coininflation.com

you have an extra "in" in there: www.coinflation.com

Good point - I pasted it better the first time a few hours ago.


http://www.coinflation.com/ # seems to disprove thesis of thread

Fun discussion of same ft piece:
http://www.marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2006/04/should_you_melt.html

Put coinflation in Quick Summary
Hoarding pre-1982 copper cents makes sense mathematically,
but I do not know how practical it would be.
Also, I did not even bother mentioning 1982 cents,
since they could be either composition = too much work to sort.

does anyone have any good links/references to companies that will buy your pre-1982 pennies (obviously below spot) and melt them to copper?

Only the buy part of your question is important from a FW pov.

Cute piece of economic logic:
http://www.marietta.edu/~delemeeg/bonus/Spring2003/week6.html
Melting down copper pennies is never a good idea as long as you have some other source of copper already available. For that matter, itís not important, except for transportation costs, that you have the copper. So long as anyone has copper, if transportation costs are zero, it pays to hoard pennies and not melt them down. Why? If the price of copper stays high or rises further, it wonít make any difference whether you melt the pennies or not. If the price of copper falls, however, the price of the copper stockpile will decline but the price of the pennies will not fall to less than one cent each. Pennies can be turned into copper, but you canít mint the copper back into pennies. Because the value of pennies has a lower bound of one cent each, they are worth more than their copper value alone. Once you have melted the pennies, this surplus is lost. If the choice is between melting already-purchased pennies or buying more copper, and copper costs more than pennies, then pennies might be worth melting for immediate use. But as long as the copper stockpile last, it is always better to save or sell the pennies.

goldsheet said: [Q]Put conflation in Quick Summary
Hoarding pre-1982 copper cents makes sense mathematically,
but I do not know how practical it would be.
Also, I did not even bother mentioning 1982 cents,
since they could be either composition = too much work to sort.

if we are talking different metal content --- we must be talking different weight

perhaps a machine could be developed to quickly sort the two types --- with the older ones being sent to the furnace and the new ones being cleaned, rolled, and sent back to the bank --- I don't see why they (the government) couldn't be doing this already

--- in a side note: with soaring commodity prices it seems that theft of unattended metal objects might come into fashion

molecule said: [Q]this is an excellent investment plan, i have liquidated all other assets and i just filled my swimming pool with nickels.

ROTFL

Anakin Skywalker

This comment made my night. Thanks for the laugh.

The Hunt brothers cornered the silver market in the late 70's early 80's. Apparently one of them even went to jail for it.

When I have some time I'll research it... interesting story it seems.

Not going to horde nickels but the price of nickel is having a big effect on my business. We use about 20,000 pounds of Stainless Steel a month and nickel is big component of Stainless and we get a monthly surcharge based on nickel. It has been going up every month and is now .51 per lb, so that adds over $10,000 to my monthly bill

SUB said: [Q]I can just imagine someone "hording" nickels...

teller: "Did you hoard all these nickles yourself?"

girl: "No, my sister whored half of them."




I'm curious as to what the value in copper is for Canadian pennies. I mean aren't they also copper and worth less than a US penny (face value)? Anyone look into this?

I think it's time to speculate what the feds will do with the penny.

1. Discontinue it's production.
2. Make a 2 cent piece (no need for penny then).
3. Make out of sonething else (like plastic).

scott1961 said: [Q]Not going to horde nickels but the price of nickel is having a big effect on my business. We use about 20,000 pounds of Stainless Steel a month and nickel is big component of Stainless and we get a monthly surcharge based on nickel. It has been going up every month and is now .51 per lb, so that adds over $10,000 to my monthly billmay i ask what you do with all that stainless?

didYOUsearch said: may i ask what you do with all that stainless?
We are a screw machine shop and use round and hex stainless bar to manufacture electronic hardware and fasteners

I was hoping for something more exotic, like Ninja throwing stars, or something. <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif" border=0>

You are all confused...

Nickels will not make you a mint..
Nickels are made at the mint!!

Think of all the investment interest and the compounding you would loose out on should you horde massive amounts of nickels. The only way this could be profitable is if you had all retail establishemts run coins through a sifter of sorts to get the pre 1982's to return close ot 100%, however the implementation and work needed to sift would be an expense and not justify the means. Also melting, modifying, or detroying currency is a federal offense. Don't think this is a good idea at any rate.

Skipping 93 Messages...
WhiteGuy said: [Q]So is everyone on the same page that yes, a nickel is worth more then .05 cents in another form but it is not cost effective to make it?

Last I checked, a nickel was worth closer to 5 cents than 0.05 cents, WhiteGuy. <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif" border=0>



Disclaimer: By providing links to other sites, FatWallet.com does not guarantee, approve or endorse the information or products available at these sites, nor does a link indicate any association with or endorsement by the linked site to FatWallet.com.

Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

TRUSTe online privacy certification

While FatWallet makes every effort to post correct information, offers are subject to change without notice.
Some exclusions may apply based upon merchant policies.
© 1999-2014