I am not much of a contributor, but since I have learned so much from the many individuals here at FWF, I thought I would share my own AOR experience. This is my first attempt at an AOR and in contrast to many others, I decided to refrain from posting my version until after I had completed all the material segments. As shown below, I broke my AOR into four main stages:
(1) Preparation: Here, I organized my pre-AOR cards in a way I thought to be most beneficial to the actual AOR.
(2) Implementation: This is where I actually submitted the apps for all the new credit.
(3) Maximization: Here, I completed all my balance transfers in order to maximize my profits.
(4) Finalization: Here I discuss what I did with my AOR funds, the results, and my comments. While I was happy with my first AOR, there were definitely things that I could have done better (these are discussed in Stage 4).
Hopefully, someone will find this information interesting and/or useful.
Credit Profile before beginning my AOR (as of 12/1/2005): FICO scores: 763/744/730
Stage 1: Preparation - Restructuring my current cards for a more effective usage of an AOR
•I requested credit line increases on all cards without a hard pull on my credit report. If not available, I did nothing in order to avoid a pre-AOR credit score hit.
•I had my lovely wife add me to her MBNA Chicago Bulls card with a 1992 history and $25k limit in order to increase my credit history and size of average CL.
•I consolidated my Chase Sony card into the other three Chase cards so that I have a 20K+ limit on each of the 3 remaining cards, and thus, in my opinion, increased the possibility of larger lines on new cards from my AOR. This move also decreased my overall # of Chase cards in order to increase the possibility of approval for new cards with 0% promos from the AOR. Despite the "never close a line" rule, I felt that the benefits, as stated above, outweighed the costs of eliminating this card that was opened in 2004.
•I consolidated my AT&T Universal Platinum into my Citibank Diamond Preferred Rewards card for a total new credit line of $13,500 in order to take advantage of a 0%, 12 month, no fee BT to "refresh" my only current 0% balance on one of my Chase cards. Once again, I thought the benefits outweighed the costs here. The card was only opened in 2004, so not a big hit to my average age. Plus, I wanted to keep my utilization low with the $6,000 BT, thus the transfer of the full credit line to the Diamond Preferred card. Finally, this lowered my total Citi cards to just one, increasing my odds of multiple approvals for new Citi cards w with 0%/no fee BT promos from my AOR.
Stage 1 Results: •I increased my overall credit by $39,500 without any hits to my credit score via hard pulls. Individual card average increased from $10,900 to $16,500.
•I went from zero to four credit lines of $20,000 or more. I theorize that this will help me get larger lines during the actual AOR
•I decreased my Chase cards to 3 and my Citi cards to 1 in order to open more "spots" for new cards from these issuers during the actual AOR
•I extended my current 0% deal for another 12 months without any fees.
•I helped to increase my overall credit history by adding my wife's 1994 MBNA card.
•I indirectly lowered my overall average age by consolidating two cards obtained in 2004. I realize that this will have a negative impact when I open all the new AOR accounts in 2006. I felt that the additional benefits, as previously stated, outweighed this.
Stage 2: Implementation: FICO scores as of 2/1/2006: 744/746/757 I performed the AOR on a weekday morning, started early, and submitted all applications online to increase efficiency.
Card---------------------------------- 0% BT?-------------- CL Approved--------------- Comment Advanta Plat. Business------------- N/A-------------------- 12.5K----------------------- Bonus via cardoffers.com AMEXDelta Skymiles--------------- N/A-------------------- 4.3K----------------------- --17.5K bonus miles AMEX Blue----------------------------- N/A-------------------- 20K--------------------------Bonus via cardoffers.com AMEX Gold Rewards Plus---------- N/A------------------- N/A---------------------------50K points bonus AMEX Platinum------------------------ N/A------------------- N/A---------------------------100K points bonus BofA Choice Privileges Visa--------- N/A------------------ 8K----------------------------3 free nights at Choice Hotels BofA Platinum Visa -------------------0% for 12-------------1.5K CapOne Business Platinum-------- 0% for 12------------ 20K Chase Marriott Rewards --------------N/A------------------- 17K--------------------------- Free night, 15K bonus points Citi Platinum Select------------------- 0% for 15------------12.9k Citi Professional Rewards----------- 0% for 12------------10.6K-------------------------10K bonus points Commerce Bank Visa ---------------------0% for 12-------------- 18K eTrade Platinum Visa-----------------------0% for 12------------ 20K---------------- 2K bonus points HSBC GM Flex Earnings--------------- --N/A--------------------- 2.5k---------------- Bonus via cardoffers.com MBNA Jets------------------------------------ N/A-------------------- 10K---------------- Free iPod Nano Discover Platinum ---------------------------0% for 12------------ 10K---------------- Bonus via cardoffers.com RBS Platinum --------------------------------0% for 12------------- 15K WaMu Platinum------------------------------ 0% for 12------------- 30K---------------- Free TU credit scores
Stage 2 Results: •All cards applied for were approved
•I more than tripled my total available credit when compared to pre-Stage 1 results
•Created more than $160,000 in 0% balance transfer opportunities
•Earned $275.00 in cash rebates by applying through cardoffers.com (received check on 6/6/06)
•Earned a net $1,200.00 in Home Depot gift cards through card point bonuses (AMEX Platinum, Gold Rewards Plus, and Citibank Professional Rewards). These gift cards were sold on eBay when received.
•Earned various other hotel, airfare, Ipod rewards/credits
Stage 3: BT Maximization:
Card------------------------------------ Limit---------------- BT---------- Promo------------------ Method Commerce Bank Visa---------------- 18K-------------- 15K--------------- 0% for 12------------ via BT check WaMu Platinum-------------------------30K-------------- 25K--------------- 0% for 12------------ via BT check eTrade Platinum----------------------- 20K --------------15K--------------- 0% for 12------------ via BT to Citi card Discover Platinum--------------------- 10K---------------7.5K --------------0% for 12-------------via BT check CapOne Business Plat---------------20K-------------- 15K ---------------0% till 3/07----------- via BT to Citi card BofA Platinum------------------------- 11.9K------------ 10K--------------- 0% for 12------------ via BT to Citi card Chase Platinum----------------------- 55K--------------- 48K--------------- 0% till 11/06-------- via BT check Citi Platinum Select------------------ 12.9K------------- 10K--------------- 0% for 15----------- via BT check Citi Professional-----------------------10.6K-------------- 8k---------------- 0% for 12----------- via BT check RBS Platinum--------------------------15K--------------- 11.5K------------- 0% till 3/07---------- via BT check
•I reallocated 20,000 from my Chase Platinum Visa and 15,000 from my Chase Yahoo Visa to my second Chase Platinum Visa for a total credit line of $55,000 in order to maximize a 0% BT opportunity on that card.
•I consolidated BofA Choice Priveleges card into BofA Platinum Visa in order to maximize BT offer for a total credit line of 11,900 and then reapplied for the Choice Priveleges card for a $3K CL in order to get 3 more free nights.
•I also reallocated 8,000 from Citibank Dividend Rewards to Citibank Platinum Select in order to take further advantage of 0% BT rate
•I had other BT offers, but only used those that had a BT fee that was not profit prohibitive (usually $50 or less). I also requested 15K BT on applications if the option was available and I was sure of the 0% rate.
Ending credit profile as of 7/1/06 Card ---------------------------------Age---------- Limit------------- Balance------------ Promo Advanta Platinum Bus----------- ’06------------ 12.5K------------ 0 AMEXDelta SkyMiles------------’06------------- 4.3K------------- 0 AMEX Blue------------------------- ’06------------- 20K-------------- 0 AMEX Gold Rewards Plus--------’06--------------- ----------------- 0 AMEX Platinum------------------- ’06 --------------------------------- 0 BofA Platinum----------------------’06------------ 11.9K------------ 10K---------------- 0% for 12 CapOne Business Plat---------- ’06------------ 20K-------------- 15K----------------- 0% for 12 CapOne Platinum---------------- ’02------------ 11K----------------- 0 Chase Platinum------------------ ’03 -------------1.5K---------------- 0 Chase Yahoo---------------------- ’00-------------5K------------------ 0 Chase Platinum------------------- ’04-------------55K----------------- 48K------------- 0% till 11/06 Chase Marriott-------------------- ’06--------------17K ----------------0 Chase Amazon --------------------’03-------------14K---------------- 0 Citi Diamond Prefer-------------- ’04--------------5K------------------ 0 Citi Platinum Select--------------- ’06------------ 20.9K------------- 16K--------------- 0% for 15 Citi Professional-------------------- ’06------------ 10.6K------------- 8K---------------- 0% for 12 Commerce Bank Visa------------- ’06------------ 18K --------------15K---------------- 0% for 12 Discover Platinum Gas------------’96-------------12.5K-------------- 0 Discover Platinum-------------------’06-------------10K-------------- 7.5K---------------- 0% for 12 eTrade Platinum-------------------- ’06--------------20K-------------- 15K----------------- 0% for 12 HSBC GM Platinum--------------- ’03--------------11.5K -------------0 HSBC GM FlexEarnings---------- ’06--------------2.5K----------------0 MBNA Chicago Bulls--------------- ’94------------- 25K--------------- 0 MBNA Jets Card-------------------- ’06-------------- 10K--------------- 0 RBS Platinum------------------------ ’06 --------------15K ------------11.5K--------------- 0% till 3/07 WaMu Platinum--------------------- ’06-------------- 30K------------- 25K------------------ 0% for 12
Recent Credit Scores since finishing the AOR: •Transunion FICO Credit score as of 6/10/06: 683 •Transunion FICO Credit score as of 7/10/06: 622 •Transunion FICO Credit score as of 8/10/06: 642
8/17/06: Received letters from Chase stating that they were closing 5 of my 6 credit card accounts due to "balances too high compared to credit limit, number of accts currently in use, and balance owed on revolving accts too high". The only account left open was my Platinum account where I had a $48K 0% BT. All the other cards had a zero balance. I called Chase in order to get the cards reopened. After providing them with proof of enough liquid assets to cover my liabilities, they agreed to reopen all the cards.
Stage 4: Finalization
•approximately $100K of my 170K balance transfer money went into my HSBC savings account currently at 5% interest.
•Approximately $50K of my 170K balance transfer money went into my eTrade brokerage account. I used this money to trade mutual funds and individual stocks. To date, I have made 6 stock trades, netting approx. $4,000.00. I also have an unrealized gain of $1,200 on a mutual fund that I purchased using the BT money.
•Approximately $20K of my 170L balance transfer money went into another savings account that I have more direct access to than HSBC. This is to ensure that I have access to some cash in case my one of my balances become unexpectedly called due to a missed payment, etc.
•While I have earned an excellent return by trading stocks on the BT money, I would not recommend it to inexperienced investors, nor will I do it again myself. In general, I consider myself an intermediate trader that usually utilizes trends and statistics, as opposed to emotions and speculation, and only trade in a handful of stocks that I have been tracking for the past few years. While my net result was a gain of approx. $4K, I did get nailed on two trades for losses one of which was a purely speculative trade where I luckily did not lose much more. I believe that the stress of trading with "other people's money" is not worth the gain that I have achieved to date in this area. If I perform any additional AOR's in the future, I plan to park all of the money in more conservative investments such as high yield savings accounts.
•In addition, if I do another AOR, I would plan my card selections much more carefully. While my results were good, I feel that I missed out on some rewards and BT opportunities that I would have found if I had planned better.
•Finally, in any future AOR's, I will reduce my utilization of all BT's to below 75% in order to avoid negative actions similar to my dealings with Chase discussed above. While most of my utilization % were good, my one large Chase BT was not. While this issue was eventually resolved in my favor, I would rather not deal with any of this in the future.
As of 9/1, my profits from my first AOR are approximately……….. 275.00 from cardoffers.com bonus’ 1,500.00 HSBC savings account interest 500.00 other savings account interest 4,000.00 from stock trading 1,200.00 from unrealized mutual fund gain 1,200.00 from free gift card sales 100.00 from free iPod sale Total 8,775.00
The money earned from the HSBC interest should continue to grow, as most of my BT’s have a ways to go before I need to pay them back. My large 48K Chase BT is set to expire soon, at which time I will pay it off, and do a new BT at an available .99% rate. The money intially used to make equity trades has gone back into a high yield savings account.
I check out FWF a few times a week, so feel free to ask questions, make comments, etc. and I will try to respond/update as much as possible. In a nutshell - Anyone that wants to do an AOR needs to do ONE thing: READ, READ, READ all the great threads already posted on the subject!!
Thanks to all the AOR Guru’s for helping me make some extra $$$$ !! Text
Update – 3/29/07 I closed out the last of my BTs from this AOR in December 2006 and am now in the final planning stages for my second AOR. The following is a final recap of my first one, along with some additional comments.
275.00 from cardoffers.com bonuses approx. 2,500.00 HSBC savings account interest approx. 500.00 other savings account interest approx. 6,500.00 gross from stock trading approx. 1,000.00 gross mutual fund gain approx. 2,300.00 net from free gift card sales approx. 100.00 from free iPod sale Total: approx. $13,175.00 gross
For my AMEX cards bonuses, I initially received a targeted offer for 50K points and one for 100K points. The 50K points were received pretty quickly, but the 100K did not show in my account even after the stated wait time. So I called and after providing the relevant documentation, they made a manual adjustment to my account. A few weeks later I received another 100K points, which I think was the original 100K that should have been applied automatically by their system. In all, I used all the points for 2,500 in Home Depot gift cards, which I then sold for cash. Pretty sweet (and lucky) deal!
After stating originally that I would not do any more stock trading with the AOR funds, I made a few more small trades that I couldn’t pass up. Considering the current market conditions, I doubt I will use the BT funds from the next AOR for anything other than a high yield internet savings account, but that may change if presented with the right opportunity.
I only tracked my Transunion FICO score each month through the free score provided by my WaMu credit card and they slowly increased to the current levels, as shown below. Using my annual free credit report from each agency, I disputed a bunch of accounts at the end of my AOR that did not have updated balances (showing that the BTs had been paid off). These accounts were updated fairly quickly and I believe this helped the gradual jump in my credit score.
Transunion FICO Credit score as of 12/1/05: 763 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 2/1/06: 757 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 4/1/06: 747 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 6/10/06: 683 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 7/10/06: 622 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 8/10/06: 642 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 9/10/06: 622 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 10/10/06: 622 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 11/10/06: 683 Transunion FICO Credit score as of 12/10/06: 723 Transunion FICO Credit Score as of 1/10/07: 729 Transunion FICO Credit Score as of 2/10/07: 733 Transunion FICO Credit Score as of 3/10/07: 756
Essentially, it took about a year for my score to fully recover to pre-AOR levels.
With the decline of 0% BT offers with minimal fees continuing, I feel that the BT game will slowly lose a lot of its value over the coming years (however I am sure my fellow FW’ers will find other ways to milk the system), so I am going to try to maximize my next AOR to its fullest extent possible. This means going for max. bonus and BT opportunities. With over $400K in current CLs, It will be very interesting to see what kind of new credit lines I receive, as I believe that the first AOR (when properly planned) is the best chance at maximizing returns.
Finally, my wife recently completed a medium sized AOR, which I will include in my 2nd AOR results.
GREAT summation, OP--very thoughtful and nicely laid out. This will no doubt be helpful to many others. A few remarks:
-Great job laying the foundation before even getting the process underway. Others should note that this very sucessul AOR took MONTHS to prepare, and the results were the better for it.
-Why did you utilize lines in the way you did? It seems as though you went short of 90% but greater than 70% on all them...? Did that simply seem like the best risk/reward tradeoff for you, and if so, why?
steevyniu2004 said: While I have earned an excellent return by trading stocks on the BT money, I would not recommend it to inexperienced investors, nor will I do it again myself. In general, I consider myself an intermediate trader that usually utilizes trends and statistics, as opposed to emotions and speculation, and only trade in a handful of stocks that I have been tracking for the past few years. While my net result was a gain of approx. $4K, I did get nailed on two trades for losses one of which was a purely speculative trade where I luckily did not lose much more. I believe that the stress of trading with "other people's money" is not worth the gain that I have achieved to date in this area. If I perform any additional AOR's in the future, I plan to park all of the money in more conservative investments such as high yield savings accounts.You noted that you had "enough liquid assets to cover liabilities" in your Chase reopening episode. I'm wondering whether you didn't have enough to spare to cover possible stock losses here, and that contributed to the stress level you mentioned?
Also, a nitpick, but I probably wouldn't include the earnings from stocks and MFs in promo investing gains per se. That mixes your What really happened was you had some gain from promo investing, and then some additional return from your own trading accumen (that could have been a loss.) 8/17/06: Received letters from Chase stating that they were closing 5 of my 6 credit card accounts due to "balances too high compared to credit limit, number of accts currently in use, and balance owed on revolving accts too high". The only account left open was my Platinum account where I had a $48K 0% BT. All the other cards had a zero balance. I called Chase in order to get the cards reopened. After providing them with proof of enough liquid assets to cover my liabilities, they agreed to reopen all the cards.First, CONGRATS! Sucess with this isn't easy.
Second, would you please provide more details on just what you did to convince Chase to reconsider: which dept did you talk to, what docs did they want, what (roughly) did you show them you had "liquid" to make them reconsider, etc. This would be very useful to others in a smilar spot. •Finally, in any future AOR's, I will reduce my utilization of all BT's to below 75% in order to avoid negative actions similar to my dealings with Chase discussed above. While most of my utilization % were good, my one large Chase BT was not. While this issue was eventually resolved in my favor, I would rather not deal with any of this in the future.Very prudent thinking, but why 75%? I've never seen any evidence that this is a meaningful "break point." There's sketchy evidence for 70%, but the really key level before 90% is 50%.
I bet you that if you cut your utilization to 50% on those lines, your scores would jump well into the 700s, and you'd start getting MORE offers to exploit, auto line increases, etc. pretty soon, such that in the long run you'd surely come out ahead.
Again, congrats, and thanks for the excellent post!
Just looking at the way you organized the thread, its obvious why you could organize your AOR as well. Great job!
vinhboy
Tired Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 6:10p
holy cow. an AOR thread that actually made freaking sense. great job op!!
OmOd
Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 6:11p
steevyniu2004 said: 8/17/06: Received letters from Chase stating that they were closing 5 of my 6 credit card accounts due to "balances too high compared to credit limit, number of accts currently in use, and balance owed on revolving accts too high". The only account left open was my Platinum account where I had a $48K 0% BT. All the other cards had a zero balance. I called Chase in order to get the cards reopened. After providing them with proof of enough liquid assets to cover my liabilities, they agreed to reopen all the cards.
How did this reopening play out? Could you tell us more details?
Thanks a lot!
Freakazoid
Thrifty Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 6:21p
Excellent job OP. Way to put in the time and effort. It's very interesting to see your FICOs drop about 70 pts, but from 18 new cards. I'm glad see it worked so well for you. I'm with Dave on this one, perhaps the stock income shouldn't be included in the sign-up bonuses, but otherwise extremely well laid out and thought through.
chyamor
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 6:29p
As of 9/1, my profits from my first AOR are approximately……….. 275.00 from cardoffers.com bonus’ 1,500.00 HSBC savings account interest 500.00 other savings account interest 1,200.00 from unrealized mutual fund gain 1,200.00 from free gift card sales 100.00 from free iPod sale Total 4,775.00
-4,000.00 from stock trading for those who dont play in the market. Still nice, but would be great if 9k all interest.
Assuming OP put the $50k in HSBC instead of brokeage,
275.00 from cardoffers.com bonus 2,250.00 HSBC savings account interest 500.00 other savings account interest 1,200.00 from free gift card sales 100.00 from free iPod sale
Total 4,325.00
markkundinger
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 6:37p
Steevy, great post. Good planning, and it's so refreshing to see an AOR recap that already has the "big picture" fully developed in the original post. So many AOR recaps turn into a more off-the-cuff blog (mine included).
Actually, my only quibble is that the data "tables" are kind of hard to read.
I am also curious about Chase's adverse action, as well as your recourse, mainly because they jacked me as well, but perhaps not as much. First, how much CL was kiboshed when they closed those 5 accounts? And second, who precisely did you talk to get the lines restored? I wasn't expecting that to be worth it, but may want to give it a shot myself.
And finally, I'm a little unclear on how many CL increases you got during your phase 1?
You got 150,000 Membership Rewards points from the two AMEX cards (Gold Rewards and Platinum) and you only netted $1,200 total from Home Depot gift card sales, which includes points from other cards?!? Also, where did you even get the offers for 50k and 100k points for the Gold Rewards and Platinum cards, I'm sure curious, I'll take a Gold Rewards card for 50k bonus points, and didn't you have to pay the annual fee on those?
dr84
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 7:09p
Wow. Very nice. I like how its easy to read, unlike someother AOR's. Thanks OP.
Beckles said: Also, where did you even get the offers for 50k and 100k points for the Gold Rewards and Platinum cards ... and didn't you have to pay the annual fee on those ?Not sure where OP found these offers either. WRT to being assessed the annual fees on these cards, if you cancel the card AMEX has always given me a pro-rated refund such that at most I paid for just a month (1/12*AF). Sometimes they just refunded the entire annual fee.
warlord001
Broke Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 7:23p
Wow. Thank you sooooo much for this write-up. I have learned a GREAT deal from this thread cuz of the way you explained the AOR. This is the first thread that actually made sense after reading 10 other AOR threads.
Question: what do you do with your profits from the AOR ?
Dol007
Happy Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 7:56p
Speechless. Great job!!
steevyniu2004
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 8:05p
First of all, thanks to everyone for the positive feedback !!! I am glad that my post can 'give a little back' after I learned so much from everyone's contributions over the last few years.
Now to answer everyone's questions:
My inclusion of stock/mutual fund trading profits: While I can understand your point of view, I stand by this inclusion because these gains were made due to the cash flow from my AOR. From my viewpoint, my profits from my AOR include all monies gained through the use of said AOR cash flow. The fact that I chose the stock market as a profit vehicle for these funds, as opposed to savings accounts, treasury bonds, or lottery tickets, does not make a difference IMO.
As I mentioned in my OP, I decided to abandon the stock trading method of utilizing my AOR cash flow due to the stress of worrying about it. While I definitely have enough personal funds to cover any losses incurred in said trading, I realized that the increased chance of superior gains from this method over the tradional internet savings account was contrary to my overall goal of 'easy money' from an AOR. By this I mean earning an impressive profit with very little risk and time investment (after all the research and planning, of course!). The planning, tracking, and timing of the stock trading went strongly against this goal of stress free dough!
While I will not trade individual stocks with AOR $$$ in the future, I am still analyzing the viabilty of the mutual fund option for my own risk levels. But that's another thread!!
Dave's question about why I used a 75% CL utilization standard: To be honest, I believe I started out using the 70% standard that has been fairly commonplace in other AOR threads. After seeing my various credit lines grow, I admit I got a little greedy and abandoned the 70% parameter in some situations. I now see that the additional credit score hit, increased additional adverse action risk, and massive decrease in new offers could probably be minimized by sticking closely to the 70% (or 50%) levels. I hope to be able to control myself a little bit better in any possible future AORs. I advise other members that are planning future AORs to come up with a plan that is effective in both producing $$$ and covering your butt AND sticking to it as closely as possible. I know I will, as the Chase account closing letters really gave me a scare!
In addition, Dave mentioned that I might want to consider paying down my lines to below the 70% or even 50% levels in order to see the effect on my credit score and new offers. I will be doing this with my large Chase BT that recieved the previously discussed adverse action. I will also be reviewing my other BTs on this issue as well.
Chase Account Closings/Reopenings: Finally, a few members asked me about this. I will start from the beginning and go from there...
As mentioned in my OP, a few months after my AOR had been completed I received a bunch of letters from Chase (one for each of my non-BT accounts). These letters stated that they were closing these accounts due to (1) balance too high compared to credit limit, (2)number of accounts currently in use, and (3)balance owed on revolving accounts are too high.
Upon receiving the letters, I reviewed my accounts to familiarize myself with all the specifics for each and then called the number on the letter for the 'Portfolio Lending' Dept. (1-800-219-0015) in order to argue my case.
First, I tried the ol' I am a longtime customer that has always paid on time routine. That didn't fly.
Next, I stated that I possess more than enough liquid assets to cover all my liabilities and I would be willing to provide proof of this. The person I spoke with stated that they would be willing to review this information and possibly reopen my accounts and I should fax the info to the fax # he gave me. He stated that the docs. would be reviewed in the order they are received and the decision is up to which ever account rep. reviews my docs.
Based on this info, I gathered account statements (with account numbers, etc. blacked out) for my HSBC savings account (where most of my AOR dough was located), my eTrade brokerage account, and my 401(k) account (I'd be interested to see how they treated the 401(k) ). I also composed a nice little professional cover letter that I think aided my case as well. These docs were faxed over to the Chase dept. and I requested that they call me back with their decision. They never called so I just waited for the letters. About a week later I received a letter for each account stating that they were reopening my all my credit lines to their orginial limits.
That's about it. My tips are pretty much common sense: (1)Be friendly and professional when speaking to the reps. and pretend like you don't know more than they do (although in many cases you probably do). I beleive in this becuase I think these guys have a decent amount of leeway as to what they can do. (2) If you get to the documentation stage, write a nice little cover letter that clearly articulates your case, explains your proof/docs, and states what you would like them to do for you. (3)Follow the 50%/70% rules so that you don't have to deal with this!!!
The "untidiness" of my data tables: I struggled with this for awhile, as I also prefer to read clear and concise data! I had everything neatly organized in Excel data tables but I didn't know how to cut/paste it into my post without everything getting funky on me. This is the best I could up with at the time. Any tips for future usage are appreciated!!
My original credit line increases from Stage 1: I'd have to go back and look at the specifics, but I think I had about 3 or 4 lines that gave me a few $K increase per line. In addition to those, the addition of my wife's 25K MBNA Chicago Bulls card made up the bulk of my overall CL increase from Stage 1 of my AOR.
Well, I think that's it for now! I gotta get some dinner!!
steevyniu2004
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 12, 2006 @ 8:13p
Alcibiades said: Beckles said: Also, where did you even get the offers for 50k and 100k points for the Gold Rewards and Platinum cards ... and didn't you have to pay the annual fee on those ?Not sure where OP found these offers either. WRT to being assessed the annual fees on these cards, if you cancel the card AMEX has always given me a pro-rated refund such that at most I paid for just a month (1/12*AF). Sometimes they just refunded the entire annual fee.
Those AMEX deals were from targeted offers I received in the mail. The annual fees were waived for the first year. The $1200.00 profit was net of eBay discount and eBay/paypal fees. Unfortunately, I believe these offers have long since expired (but I know there is at least one other thread discussing them becuase I posted my experiences in it).
The draft of my original post also had details on which offers were targeted vs. public, the various balance transfer fees I paid, and other notes on each new card, but when I tried to post it in an actual thread, the data tables became way too convoluted, so I had to trim it all down to what you see in the OP. My overall goal was sharing the data in a very organized manner, and unfortunately, I ended up having to sacrifice some info in order to do so.
very nice job, OP...I will come back to this one several times in planning my future AORs...I guess I am another Dave H. convert, too and have paid down my balances below 50% on each card....I want to get some good mail offers!
The finance forum is littered with excruciatingly complicated and elaborate threads on credit card manipulation, but your original post here is probably the most succinct and helpful discussion of the subject that I've come across here on FW.
Although I do agree with the opinion (even though you did use "other people's money") that including all of your trading profits in the total amount earned may be a bit excessive, simply because this tactic is not reliable.
Setting that aside, however, congratulations on a job very well done.
It's always nice to see someone make a successful AOR.
merrimac1
Member
posted: Sep. 13, 2006 @ 4:20a
I'm tempted by the successful AOR story. However, I once registered in a website that blocks all the annoying credit card invitation letters and I don't remember the address any more. Does anybody know this website? I want to unblock it and let the AOR begin!
Your comment on the importance of research BEFORE doing App-O-Rama cannot be stressed enough.
RS4Rings
Back in Rehab
posted: Sep. 13, 2006 @ 6:18a
steevyniu2004 said:
As of 9/1, my profits from my first AOR are approximately……….. 275.00 from cardoffers.com bonus’ 1,500.00 HSBC savings account interest 500.00 other savings account interest 4,000.00 from stock trading 1,200.00 from unrealized mutual fund gain 1,200.00 from free gift card sales 100.00 from free iPod sale Total 8,775.00
Thanks for a very detailed post, made for an interesting read to see your breakdown of what you actually made from doing an AOR. Seems using some of that money for trading stocks gave you a nice boost but is clearly not what most here should try and copy
yorick
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 13, 2006 @ 6:53a
merrimac1 said: I'm tempted by the successful AOR story. However, I once registered in a website that blocks all the annoying credit card invitation letters and I don't remember the address any more. Does anybody know this website? I want to unblock it and let the AOR begin!
I have a couple of questions. You applied for two business cards, do you have serious business or a minimal one for BT purposes? You also got a few large initial credit lines, 30K from WaMu which I believe is the max for WaMu. Did you already have a relationship with them like a mortgage, or do you have a seriously large household income?
steevyniu2004
Senior Member
posted: Sep. 13, 2006 @ 8:49a
mhesidence said: Excellent execution and post steevyniu2004.
I have a couple of questions. You applied for two business cards, do you have serious business or a minimal one for BT purposes? You also got a few large initial credit lines, 30K from WaMu which I believe is the max for WaMu. Did you already have a relationship with them like a mortgage, or do you have a seriously large household income?
Hi mhesidence, thanks for the compliments!
To answer your questions, I do have a serious business, but it produces very inconsistent income (I am a professional that does some consulting on the side from time to time). My wife is also a professional, so we do have a very good household income.
I was very suprised by the 30K WaMu line, as I have not had a prior relationship with them. As posted in my OP, I did some steps in the Preparation stage in order to get a few credit lines over 20K in hopes that this would lead to larger lines. I also requested 15K BTs on all applications when appropriate. Beyond these factors and my high household income, I do not have an explanation on why WaMu was so generous with their CL.
Skipping 74 Messages...
eighnull
Addicted Member
posted: Jul. 8, 2007 @ 12:19p
thanks steevy! guess im gonna have to look out for the option to request check to myself on next aor.
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