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rated:
Thanks!

imbatman said:   
If you rarely travel, you're probably better off sticking to CashBack cards, and I would suggest the US Bank 5/2/1 card with rotating 5% categories. no annual fee.


I have the Cash+, using it this quarter for home improvement and Bill Pay. Might change if rumors are true, but won't be changing until at least March. But I can get 5% CB on Discover Rewards Mall and/or Chase UR website currently.

imbatman said:   How often do you fly? If you travel (and check bags) more than 2 times per year, the Delta Gold card is a no brainer because of the waived check bags fee.

I fly maybe 2-3 times a year. I might more often if I had a decent incentive--but I mostly prefer to drive.

EDIT: I'm usually checking at least one bag when I fly.

imbatman said:   Do you fly with someone else when you fly, and fly more than once per year? If so, upgrade to the Delta Platinum AMEX - $150 annual fee (signup link posted above), comes with the same waived checked bag fee, but includes an annual companion ticket.

Usually not, no. Mostly business travel.

imbatman said:   When you travel, do you have a hotel brand preference?

No brand preference. I teach at a university, so most of the time hotels will be in small college towns, not major cities.

imbatman said:   Do you ever try Priceline's choose your own price?

Not often, no. I'm often traveling on a schedule.

imbatman said:   what do you want points for? At 2-3k/year, you're looking at 10 years of card use to get a free plane ticket.

Yeah, I know! I'm looking for cycling rewards back to make it more cost effective to travel only. That's why I'm thinking of the cost/benefit of sign-up bonus vs. annual fee.

imbatman said:   I might suggest something other than the SPG AMEX card (25k pts after 5k spend in 6 months, annual fee of $65 is waived the first year, 20k SPG points can be converted to 25k airline miles)

Will check that out also.

EDIT: If SPG is just for Westin, Sheraton, etc., it's probably not as good a deal for me.

rated:
ok,
my 3 recommendations are
Delta Gold AMEX to get the free checked bag since you typically check a bag and fly delta (but not always). try logging in here https://www.deltaamexcard.com/default.aspx?et=dbu to see if you're targeted for a better offer than the public 30k offer after $500 spend. If you only use it for delta purchases, you get 2x skymiles, which means you'll earn more than the SPG card.
SPG card - SPG points are more valuable than skymiles.
PenFed travel AMEX - 5x points on airfare

another thought
Chase Sapphire Preferred - $95 annual fee (waived first year). 40,000 pts after 3k spend in 3 months. 2.14 (after 7% bonus) points earned on all travel and dining expenses. Good for CashBack or transferring to other programs.

rated:
antifaith said:   

imbatman said:   I might suggest something other than the SPG AMEX card (25k pts after 5k spend in 6 months, annual fee of $65 is waived the first year, 20k SPG points can be converted to 25k airline miles)

Will check that out also.

EDIT: If SPG is just for Westin, Sheraton, etc., it's probably not as good a deal for me.


the edit came after my response. I don't really understand what you're getting at.
you get 1 point/dollar on all purchases.
2 pts per dollar for spending at SPG properties.
you can redeem for stays at SPG properties.
you can also transfer to partner airline programs (i.e. transfer 20,000 SPG points and get 25,000 Delta skymiles).

rated:
What do you think about the CapOne Venture (the one which they're advertising the hell out of)? The card w/o annual fee is only 1.25% (not as good), but I can 'split the difference' and don't need to choose between good bonus on hotels vs. good bonus on airfare.

rated:
imbatman said:   I don't really understand what you're getting at.

Sorry, that was unclear. I mean I rarely stay at SPG hotels (since I tend to stay in smaller towns, not major cities). So I would be limited to 1 pt./$1.

rated:
antifaith said:   What do you think about the CapOne Venture (the one which they're advertising the hell out of)? The card w/o annual fee is only 1.25% (not as good), but I can 'split the difference' and don't need to choose between good bonus on hotels vs. good bonus on airfare.

others can chime in, but I don't like it. It's effectively a 2% card (in the form of points) with an annual fee. get the Fidelity 2% AMEX (and have a backup card for when AMEX isn't accepted, which isn't often for me).

The only people I know that have a venture card 1) don't care at all about CC rewards, or 2) got it when they ran massive promos to get 100k points as a signup bonus (then they never use it again).

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antifaith said:   imbatman said:   I don't really understand what you're getting at.

Sorry, that was unclear. I mean I rarely stay at SPG hotels (since I tend to stay in smaller towns, not major cities). So I would be limited to 1 pt./$1.

effectively 1.25miles/$1. Which is better for everyday spending than say, the delta skymiles card which only gives 1mile/dollar (except delta purchases).
So it depends on what you plan on using the card for, and you need to do the math for yourself to determine if you'd earn more miles with an airline card or the SPG card.

rated:
My fiance and I are getting married next month and we're looking for a new credit card. She currently uses SWA Chase Rewards and I use AMEX Platinum (my family member is primary user - they pay for my card and they keep the points).

We will spend $70K+ annually combined on our credit cards. Here is my breakdown from last year according to Mint.com

Food & Dining - 25% (mainly CostCo/FreshDirect)
Auto & Transport - 17%
Shopping - 14%
Travel - 11%
Bills & Utilities - 10%
Home - 8%
Education - 6%
Health & Fitness - 3%
Business Services - 2%
Entertainment - 1%
Personal Care - 1%
Financial - 1%

We live in NYC, so there is no single dominant airline, so there is no huge benefit there. SWA is our primary airline, but has minimal flights from NYC. We don't love a single hotel brand, we use Hotwire/Priceline when needed. We do travel a lot.

We're looking to maximize values from the amount we spend annually. Cards that are interesting:
- Chase Sapphire Preferred
- Fidelity AMEX
- AMEX Platinum (continuing status/perks, but rewards seem weak)
- Chase Palladium (we put our application on hold, fees are disturbingly high)

Thanks!!

rated:
kvs25 said:   

get chase freedom. Yes its a visa card,but the ultimate rewards program it is tied to is very nice. Also, because of your chase checking acct, you'll get bonus ultimate reward points monthly. No annual fee on the card, and it includes rotating 5% categories for even more Cash Back earning opportunities.


Thanks. Didn't know about the bonus.

rated:
Hey everyone,

I'm looking for someone to critique my set up. My reward of choice is Amazon credit. This is my current set up:

Penfed Platinum Rewards: Gas & Groceries
Citi Forward: Restaurants (have a thank you preferred for 1:1 redemption)
Priceline Visa: everything else

I currently spend about $3,000 a month $1200 going to gas/groceries/eating out and the rest general spend. I redeem all my points from the penfed and citi forward cards for Amazon gift cards, and when I get 2500 points on the Priceline visa I buy an Amazon gift card and redeem the points against the charge. Does anyone have suggestions to maximize my Amazon credit acquisition? Keep in mind since I always have Amazon credit a card that gives points on Amazon purchases won't help me much. Thanks!

rated:
If you are redeeming for Amazon credit, then you are essentially paying a 5% markup on your Amazon purchases since you are forgoing you 5X TYP if you charged it to your Forward instead. Is there a cash equivalent redemption for your Pen Fed or Priceline Visa (I don't have either, BCP for groceries, minimal gas, 2% isn't enough with sign on bonuses out there)?

If it were me I'd take your $1,800/mo of general spend and use that to earn sign on bonuses with new cards.

rated:
Spac3d said:   
We will spend $70K+ annually combined on our credit cards. Here is my breakdown from last year according to Mint.com

We live in NYC, so there is no single dominant airline, so there is no huge benefit there. SWA is our primary airline, but has minimal flights from NYC. We don't love a single hotel brand, we use Hotwire/Priceline when needed. We do travel a lot.


Are you willing to apply for lots of different cards and learn how to optimally use FF points? If so, I'd take that 70K and plan on applying for 10-20 cards this year between the two of you. Being in NYC with access to all the airlines is an advantage since if you can't get united availability, maybe AA is the plan. You won't have status, but the airline cards will generally at least let you check a bag and board early.

Cards to look at are AA (get 4 total, 2 each, each person must make make both applications on the same day to get two cards), CSP/Ink, AMEX Plat since you like the points (Mercedes version cost $25 more/yr but has double the points on the standard offer, cancel after a year and get the regular version for more points), etc.

rated:
Sesq said:   Spac3d said:   
We will spend $70K+ annually combined on our credit cards. Here is my breakdown from last year according to Mint.com

We live in NYC, so there is no single dominant airline, so there is no huge benefit there. SWA is our primary airline, but has minimal flights from NYC. We don't love a single hotel brand, we use Hotwire/Priceline when needed. We do travel a lot.


Are you willing to apply for lots of different cards and learn how to optimally use FF points? If so, I'd take that 70K and plan on applying for 10-20 cards this year between the two of you. Being in NYC with access to all the airlines is an advantage since if you can't get united availability, maybe AA is the plan. You won't have status, but the airline cards will generally at least let you check a bag and board early.

Cards to look at are AA (get 4 total, 2 each, each person must make make both applications on the same day to get two cards), CSP/Ink, AMEX Plat since you like the points (Mercedes version cost $25 more/yr but has double the points on the standard offer, cancel after a year and get the regular version for more points), etc.
I appreciate the insight, but we're really looking for a single card (or maximum of two) for daily use. We work longer hours and having to juggle credit cards is unappealing.

rated:
If your travel is by domestic air I'd get the Citi TY Premier (1.33X redemption on tix plus "flight points")and Citi Forward (5X Amazon + dining - can transfer to the premier and get 5X * 1.33X on tix).

If International - Get CSP (and Freedom for 5X categories).

CSP and Premier have annual fees waived for the first year. After a year you may want to log a call into retentions to see if they will waive. In the alternative you may consider flipping fee the cards between yourself and your spouse to avoid the fee each year.

rated:
Spac3d said:   My fiance and I are getting married next month and we're looking for a new credit card. She currently uses SWA Chase Rewards and I use AMEX Platinum (my family member is primary user - they pay for my card and they keep the points).

We will spend $70K+ annually combined on our credit cards. Here is my breakdown from last year according to Mint.com

Food & Dining - 25% (mainly CostCo/FreshDirect)
Auto & Transport - 17%
Shopping - 14%
Travel - 11%
Bills & Utilities - 10%
Home - 8%
Education - 6%
Health & Fitness - 3%
Business Services - 2%
Entertainment - 1%
Personal Care - 1%
Financial - 1%

We live in NYC, so there is no single dominant airline, so there is no huge benefit there. SWA is our primary airline, but has minimal flights from NYC. We don't love a single hotel brand, we use Hotwire/Priceline when needed. We do travel a lot.

We're looking to maximize values from the amount we spend annually. Cards that are interesting:
- Chase Sapphire Preferred
- Fidelity AMEX
- AMEX Platinum (continuing status/perks, but rewards seem weak)
- Chase Palladium (we put our application on hold, fees are disturbingly high)

Thanks!!


The categories you provided don't align with credit card categories, so it's tough to tell if you spend a lot in one category that would sway a recommendation. Can you break down Food & Dining into Groceries (excluding Costco) and Restaurants (including fast food)? From Auto & Transport, we just need to see Gas (take out insurance, car payments, etc). In Shopping, how much comes from Department Stores (i.e., Nordstrom, JCP, Macy's, Bloomingdale's), how much from Amazon?

The easiest 1-card solution is the Fidelity AMEX. But if you travel internationally regularly, you probably want to get at least 1 card that has no foreign transaction fee. If you spend a lot on dining out or Amazon, it may be worth it to get the Forward card in the mix. If you spend a lot on Groceries (non-Costco) and department stores, it would be good to get a AMEX Blue Cash Preferred in there. So it would be helpful if you can break those categories down as I described above.

rated:
Just wanted to bring up a good point: Studies show that use of "rewards" cards actually increase spending. I think the categories cards may actually do more harm than good. The best way to "save" money is to make a decision not to spend money. This is why I advocate for simplicity: The best card is the easiest one to use and pay off. Having five different credit cards for each category may hurt you more than help you financially and if you have a partner who shares cards with you it may annoy them quite a bit.

Source: http://www.chicagofed.org/digital_assets/publications/working_pa...

rated:
Medikit said:   Just wanted to bring up a good point: Studies show that use of "rewards" cards actually increase spending. I think the categories cards may actually do more harm than good. The best way to "save" money is to make a decision not to spend money. This is why I advocate for simplicity: The best card is the easiest one to use and pay off. Having five different credit cards for each category may hurt you more than help you financially and if you have a partner who shares cards with you it may annoy them quite a bit.

If you are the type of person that spends more because you're using a different credit card, then you have bigger problems to worry about. Like not sticking to a budget.

Also, please provide a link to these "studies".

rated:
Medikit said:   Just wanted to bring up a good point: Studies show that use of "rewards" cards actually increase spending. I think the categories cards may actually do more harm than good. The best way to "save" money is to make a decision not to spend money. This is why I advocate for simplicity: The best card is the easiest one to use and pay off. Having five different credit cards for each category may hurt you more than help you financially and if you have a partner who shares cards with you it may annoy them quite a bit.

Source: http://www.chicagofed.org/digital_assets/publications/working_pa...


Here's the abstract of that study (singular, not plural):
chicagofed.org said: Using a unique administrative level dataset from a large and diverse U.S. financial institution, we
test the impact of rewards on credit card spending and debt. Specifically, we study the impact of
1 percent cash-back reward on individuals before and during their enrollment in the program. We
find that the marginal increase in spending per month during the first quarter of the program is
$68. Average monthly payments decreased more than the marginal increase from cash-back
rewards resulting in card debt increasing an average of $115 during the first quarter. Evidence
from the credit bureaus confirms that consumers offset their increased spending and debt on their
rewards card by lowering their spending and debt on their other credit cards.
Segmenting the
data by different types of cardholders, we find that cardholders who do not use their card prior to
the cash-back program increase their spending and debt more than cardholders with debt prior to
the cash-back program. We also find heterogeneous responses by demographic and credit
constraint characteristics.


Bolding mine. Seems to be saying there isn't evidence of net increase in spending, just that they moved spending to the rewards card (duh). The line after that may imply that cash users shift spending from cash to credit for the rewards, but I'd have to read the whole thing to be sure.

rated:
nuugatman said:   Hey everyone,

I'm looking for someone to critique my set up. My reward of choice is Amazon credit. This is my current set up:

Penfed Platinum Rewards: Gas & Groceries
Citi Forward: Restaurants (have a thank you preferred for 1:1 redemption)
Priceline Visa: everything else

I currently spend about $3,000 a month $1200 going to gas/groceries/eating out and the rest general spend. I redeem all my points from the penfed and citi forward cards for Amazon gift cards, and when I get 2500 points on the Priceline visa I buy an Amazon gift card and redeem the points against the charge. Does anyone have suggestions to maximize my Amazon credit acquisition? Keep in mind since I always have Amazon credit a card that gives points on Amazon purchases won't help me much. Thanks!


the fact that you have a sophisticated system categorizing expenses onto optimal cards is already great. most people don't put close to this level of thought into their spending. your system seems like a pretty good long term solution, but if you could rotate this healthy monthly spending through some new cards with signup bonuses after conducting AORs, that would certainly give you a much higher return per $ spent.

you pointed out that Amazon gift cards deny you rewards of any kind on Amazon purchases. see what type of rewards you would get with an Amazon rewards card or if you simply charged your Amazon purchases on one of your other cards and found a different redemption method like statement credit or cash.

rated:
When I read that abstract, I take away that people increase their debt.
That means they're not paying off their bills in full at the end of the month. Then they're hit with typically higher interest rates that sometimes come with rewards credit cards.

AKA - you have bigger problems than what credit card you're using.

And marginal spending of $68/month on a credit card?
I make more than that in rewards in a week. We're talking about entirely different types of people

rated:
Spac3d said:   My fiance and I are getting married next month and we're looking for a new credit card. She currently uses SWA Chase Rewards and I use AMEX Platinum (my family member is primary user - they pay for my card and they keep the points).

We will spend $70K+ annually combined on our credit cards. Here is my breakdown from last year according to Mint.com

Food & Dining - 25% (mainly CostCo/FreshDirect)
Auto & Transport - 17%
Shopping - 14%
Travel - 11%
Bills & Utilities - 10%
Home - 8%
Education - 6%
Health & Fitness - 3%
Business Services - 2%
Entertainment - 1%
Personal Care - 1%
Financial - 1%

We live in NYC, so there is no single dominant airline, so there is no huge benefit there. SWA is our primary airline, but has minimal flights from NYC. We don't love a single hotel brand, we use Hotwire/Priceline when needed. We do travel a lot.

We're looking to maximize values from the amount we spend annually. Cards that are interesting:
- Chase Sapphire Preferred
- Fidelity AMEX
- AMEX Platinum (continuing status/perks, but rewards seem weak)
- Chase Palladium (we put our application on hold, fees are disturbingly high)

Thanks!!


the optimal solution is usually going to include more than just one card since you gain a higher resolution on your spending options. get 1 card which maxes out your food spending rewards (probably the costco card if you shop there a lot?), 1 with max rewards for gas, 1 which rewards general travel, 1 for general utilities, etc. do the math behind the rewards you will gain with different card combinations and you will see what you are up against. multiple cards are also good because it lowers your credit utilization and gives you more freedom for timing big purchases to be right after a statement closing date which gives you 60 days to repay without interest rather than if you had to purchase right before a statement closed and only had 30 days before you had to pay the cash. also you can get multiple signup bonuses like 40,000 frequent flyer miles, etc. i have 2-3 cards that i pretty much keep only for the status and spend almost $0 on, so you if there is a status you want, you it's ok to get the card even if you plan to spend on another card as long as any annual fees make sense.

rated:
imbatman said:   When I read that abstract, I take away that people increase their debt.
That means they're not paying off their bills in full at the end of the month. Then they're hit with typically higher interest rates that sometimes come with rewards credit cards.

AKA - you have bigger problems than what credit card you're using.


Indeed. Line from the study: "Those that do not carry debt do not increase their overall card balance as a result of participating in the Cash Back program." Meaning net spending for this category doesn't change.

rated:
mikemagik said:   imbatman said:   When I read that abstract, I take away that people increase their debt.
That means they're not paying off their bills in full at the end of the month. Then they're hit with typically higher interest rates that sometimes come with rewards credit cards.

AKA - you have bigger problems than what credit card you're using.


Indeed. Line from the study: "Those that do not carry debt do not increase their overall card balance as a result of participating in the Cash Back program." Meaning net spending for this category doesn't change.


My suspicion, however, is that the category cards may actually increase net spending even amongst those who pay off their bills every month. I haven't found any studies regarding this but I think it would be worth pursuing.

rated:
I wonder if I can get a PhD in socioeconomics by researching that.

eh. I'd rather spend my time doing things that make money.

rated:
imbatman said:   I wonder if I can get a PhD in socioeconomics by researching that.

eh. I'd rather spend my time doing things that make money.


I've seen quite a number of studies that show the majority of people who use rewards cards spend more than they would otherwise. Even those who believe they are being frugal do it, unconsciously. If you have a 2% card and you spend 2% more because you believe you are saving, then you have completely negated the effect of the card.

Credit card companies know this, which is why they offer rewards in the first place.

rated:
Argyll said:   imbatman said:   I wonder if I can get a PhD in socioeconomics by researching that.

eh. I'd rather spend my time doing things that make money.


I've seen quite a number of studies that show the majority of people who use rewards cards spend more than they would otherwise. Even those who believe they are being frugal do it, unconsciously. If you have a 2% card and you spend 2% more because you believe you are saving, then you have completely negated the effect of the card.

Credit card companies know this, which is why they offer rewards in the first place.


I don't buy it. I do believe that most people spend more because they aren't handing over physical cash. But that is a negative for all plastic, not just rewards CCs.

rated:
dukerau said:   Argyll said:   imbatman said:   I wonder if I can get a PhD in socioeconomics by researching that.

eh. I'd rather spend my time doing things that make money.


I've seen quite a number of studies that show the majority of people who use rewards cards spend more than they would otherwise. Even those who believe they are being frugal do it, unconsciously. If you have a 2% card and you spend 2% more because you believe you are saving, then you have completely negated the effect of the card.

Credit card companies know this, which is why they offer rewards in the first place.


I don't buy it. I do believe that most people spend more because they aren't handing over physical cash. But that is a negative for all plastic, not just rewards CCs.


Well, that's what a number of studies show. Even many of the people who believed they were saving unconsciously were spending more. What's in it for rewards CC companies if their customers aren't using them more? Why would they bother with rewards then?

rated:
Argyll said:   dukerau said:   Argyll said:   imbatman said:   I wonder if I can get a PhD in socioeconomics by researching that.

eh. I'd rather spend my time doing things that make money.


I've seen quite a number of studies that show the majority of people who use rewards cards spend more than they would otherwise. Even those who believe they are being frugal do it, unconsciously. If you have a 2% card and you spend 2% more because you believe you are saving, then you have completely negated the effect of the card.

Credit card companies know this, which is why they offer rewards in the first place.


I don't buy it. I do believe that most people spend more because they aren't handing over physical cash. But that is a negative for all plastic, not just rewards CCs.


Well, that's what a number of studies show. Even many of the people who believed they were saving unconsciously were spending more. What's in it for rewards CC companies if their customers aren't using them more? Why would they bother with rewards then?


To get people to use their cards over other companies'.

rated:
Argyll said:   Well, that's what a number of studies show. Even many of the people who believed they were saving unconsciously were spending more. What's in it for rewards CC companies if their customers aren't using them more? Why would they bother with rewards then?

Of course I'll use the card more, but that's "instead of" other cards, not "in addition to" my normal overall spending level.

This is exactly the same topic brought up by you years ago.

rated:
Interesting study:

"Rewards Cards Lead to More Spending, Debt

"Credit cards that give Cash Back prompt consumers to spend more and accrue more debt, according to researchers at the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago.

The initiation of a 1% cash rewards program yielded, on average, a $25 reward each month—and an increase in spending by $68 a month and in credit-card debt of $115 a month, the economists say in a paper to be presented at the American Economic Association meetings next week."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204467204576047510...

rated:
Study: Credit Cards Cause More Spending

http://www.livescience.com/culture/080907-cash-credit.html

Why We Spend More Using Credit Versus Cash

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=92178034

rated:

rated:
Argyll said:   Study: Credit Cards Cause More Spending

http://www.livescience.com/culture/080907-cash-credit.html

Why We Spend More Using Credit Versus Cash

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=92178034


That first study doesn't actually "study" credit card usage.
It asks peoples opinions ("when you buy dinner, do you estimate you spend more paying with a credit or with cash?"), then compares cash usage to gift certificate usage. The summaries do not indicate there was any research to compare actual amounts paid with credit card or with cash.

Couldn't find the actual article from Journal of Experimental Psychology to go into more detail.

rated:
Argyll said:   Interesting study:

"Rewards Cards Lead to More Spending, Debt

"Credit cards that give Cash Back prompt consumers to spend more and accrue more debt, according to researchers at the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago.

The initiation of a 1% cash rewards program yielded, on average, a $25 reward each month—and an increase in spending by $68 a month and in credit-card debt of $115 a month, the economists say in a paper to be presented at the American Economic Association meetings next week."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204467204576047510...


I JUST refuted that exact study. Please read a few posts above. a) people offset increased spending on the rewards card with less spending on other cards, and b) those who don't carry a balance don't tend to increase their total spending at all due to rewards. The numbers quoted above are out of context - they're just for the single rewards card, not for the consumers' total spending.

rated:
There are many studies and surveys that show that use of credit cards increases spending, and rewards cards even more so. The credit card companies know this, and merchants know this.

rated:
There is no point arguing with this guy. Nothing has changed in the past few years.

rated:
c3 said:   There is no point arguing with this guy. Nothing has changed in the past few years.

Huh? You honestly believe this is not the case? All the studies and surveys are wrong? The banks and financial companies are wrong as well? Yes, it's true, not a lot has changed --- these studies go back to the 70s. Merchants know about it as well and have conducted their own internal studies.

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Argyll said:   Yes, it's true, not a lot has changed --- these studies go back to the 70s.

"Nothing has changed" as in you and your (insert proper adjective) point of view have not changed. You copied and pasted what you posted two years ago, and the arguments will proceed exactly like what happend two years ago in this thread. Just read the old messages.

rated:
thoughts on MAOR - Mega Apporama?

was discussing with my friend the idea of applying for 10-20 credit cards (1-2 per bank) in one mega apporama. some of the cards would be intended for the signup bonuses then canceled, some would be to keep for rewards, some would be basic no annual fee cards to keep and let the lines of credit age for long term credit building. any thoughts on the pros and cons of this regarding long term credit building strategy instead of a standard AOR? thanks in advance for any advice.

rated:
TempName21 said:   thoughts on MAOR - Mega Apporama?

was discussing with my friend the idea of applying for 10-20 credit cards (1-2 per bank) in one mega apporama. some of the cards would be intended for the signup bonuses then canceled, some would be to keep for rewards, some would be basic no annual fee cards to keep and let the lines of credit age for long term credit building. any thoughts on the pros and cons of this regarding long term credit building strategy instead of a standard AOR? thanks in advance for any advice.


After a certain point, you will likely start getting disapproved due to too many recent inquiries. My guess is that it will be around card 10 or so.
If, in a 5-6 card AOR your scores drop 30 or so points, 20 cards may drop it 4 times as much (120 points). The score would recover after some months.

120 points is a lot and others may notice (companies that do soft pulls on your credit such as for car insurance may see it and raise your rates), so that's something to consider.

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