ahself's AOR 3/21/07 - with updates

Similar to Unbelieevable, I went ahead and took the plunge yesterday without putting up a thread beforehand. I've spent the last several weeks reading through virtually all of the recent AOR threads as well as SIS' AOR FAQ, a few of DaveHanson's FAQs about FICO, etc. I'm the type that researches stuff to death (i.e. reading the same stuff over and over again) and decided it was just time to get it done.

A big thanks to SIS, DaveHanson, and others who started useful threads and/or continue to comment on threads, as well as those with recent AOR threads (PugRanch, psychtobe, Isifhan, cyberkost, unbelieevable, edlin303, etc.).

Goals
1. Collect rewards/miles/points
2. BT 0% monies to HYS accounts
3. Acquire cards from new banks

Credit Scores Before
Trans: 772
Equifax: 759
Experian: 771

Pre-AOR Accounts
Current Cards / Limit / Age / Utilization:
AMEX Skymiles Plat. / $15,000 / 7.5 yrs / 25% (higher than usual)
BOA Worldpoints Plat. MC/ $7,500 / 10 yrs / 9%
FIA Schwab Worldpoints Visa / $5,000 / 1 yr / 0%
Citi AA MC / $11,500 / 10 mos / 0%

Other than my mortgage, I have no other revolving or installment accounts open.

Personal Info
HHI: between $75k and $100k
Mortgage: $1550
Age: 32
Length of Emp: 10 years

Cards Applied For (listed in order applied for)
( Bonus / BT Promo Info/Annual Fee/ Purchase Req /(Current Status w/CL):
Amex Business Gold Rewards Card /25,000 Rewards Points/no BT special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/1 purch for bonus (Approved)
Amex Preferred Gold Rewards /10,000 Rewards Points/no BT special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/1 purch for bonus (Immediately Approved)
CitiBusiness AAdvantage MasterCard /20,000 miles/no BT special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/$250 purch for bonus (Approved $25,000 CL)
CitiBusiness PremierPass with Thank You /15,000 TY points and $10 card offers/12month 0%, no BT fees/Ann Fee waived 1 year/1 purch for bonus (Approved $25,000 CL)
CitiProfessional with TY /15,000 TY pts/12month 0%, no BT fees/No Annual Fee/1 purch for bonus(Immediately Approved $3,000 CL)
CitiBusiness with TY /15,000 TY pts /12month 0%, no BT fees/No Annual Fee/1 purch for bonus (Approved $15,000 CL)
Chase Business United Mileage Platinum Plus / 25,000 United Miles/no special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/$250 purch for bonus (Approved $15,000 CL)
Chase United Mileage Plus Visa Signature /25,000 United Miles/no special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/$250 purch for bonus (Approved $15,000 CL)
Starwood Preferred Guest AMEX /10K SPG points, $40 card offers/no special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/1 purch for bonus (Immediately Approved $10,000 CL)
Starwood Preferred Guest Business AMEX /10K SPG points, $75 card offers/no special/Ann Fee waived 1 year/1 purch for bonus (Immediately Approved $25,000 CL)
Discover Miles / $40 card offers, 1,000 miles/month for 12 mos w/purchase each month AND 0% new purchases)/12month 0%, No fee/no ann fee/ 1 purch/month for bonus (Immediately Approved $8,000 CL)
Juniper Fly America Visa / $15 statement credit after first usage /12month, 3%, $50 cap /No ann fee/ (Immediately Approved $15,000 CL)
PNC Select Rewards Platinum Visa / $50 statement credit / 12month 0%, no BT fees/No Annual Fee/$500 purch for bonus (Immediately Approved $10,000 CL)
AT&T Universal Rewards Card (CITI) /6,000 TY pts/12month 0%, no BT fees/No Annual Fee/1 purch for bonus/ (Approved $7,500 CL)
SonyStyle Chase /$100 statement credit and 0% for new purchases/12month 0%, 3%, $75cap /No Annual Fee/1 purch for bonus (Immediately Approved $5,000 CL)
Also applied for BoA Platinum Business Card on 3/23 (targeted offer) - no rewards/9 months 0%, no BT fees /No Annual Fee (Approved $12,500 CL)

I started later in the day than I planned, about 11:00 ET (was still researching, and working) and it took a couple hours to complete (also due to work), but I was pleasantly surprised with the number of immediate approvals I received.

Total Applied for: 16 (16 Approved as of 4/2/07)
Immediate approval: 8
Deferred approval: 8
Denied: 0
Pending: 0

Total Cards by Issuer:
AMEX: 4 Total - 2 Business and 2 Personal
Citi: 5 Total - 3 Business and 2 Personal
Chase: 3 Total - 1 Business and 2 Personal
Juniper: 1 Personal
Discover: 1 Personal
PNC: 1 Personal
BoA: 1 Business

Credit Scores
Including major changes and/or updates
Date EQ EXP TU
3/20 759 771 772 (via Citi Credit monitoring)
3/21 759 771 772 (found out that Citi only updates reports/scores every 30 days?!?!)
3/22 726 719 760 (switched to True Credit)
3/23 742 725 760 (Juniper (Barclays) card showing in all three)
3/24 739 725 760
3/26 739 732 760 (Discover Card showing in all three)
3/27 726 729 766
3/28-4/01 (no changes)
4/02 726 725 760 (PNC Card now showing in EXP)
4/03 726 725 760
4/04 726 725 758
4/05 726 725 758
4/06 726 704 758 (Citi Professional card showing up in EXP)
4/07-4/09 (no changes)
4/10 750 704 758 (PNC and Citi Professional cards showing up in EQ)
4/11 750 698 758 (ATT now in EXP)
4/12 750 698 758
4/13 748 698 758 (Citi MC AA showed up closed on EXP)
4/14 748 698 758 (AT&T showed up in EQ; United personal showed up in EXP)
4/15 (didn't pull)
4/16 748 688 758 (Sony showed up in EXP with BT balance)
4/17 748 688 758 (United and Sony showed up in EQ)
4/18-4/20 (no changes)
4/21 748 678 722 (PNC, Citi Prof, ATT, United and Sony showed up in TU; Disc has BT balance in EXP)
4/22-4/23 TrueCredit down
4/24 748 676 715 (Juniper BT balance on TU and EXP; Discover BT balance on TU; United showing in EXP)
4/25 712 676 715 (Juniper and Discover BT balances in EQ)
4/26-4/30 (no changes)
5/01 745 676 715 (Starwood and AMEX Gold showing in EQ)
5/02 745 678 715 (Starwood and AMEX Gold in EXP)
5/03 745 678 715 (PNC BT balance in EXP)
5/04 745 678 706 (Starwood and AMEX Gold in TU)
5/05 745 678 702 (PNC BT balance in TU)
5/06-5/07 (no changes)
5/08 704 671 702 (PNC BT balance in EQ; Citi Prof BT balance in EXP)
5/09-5/10 (no changes)
5/11 702 671 693 (Citi Prof BT balance in EQ and TU)
5/12-5/13 (no changes)
5/14 702 668 693 (ATT BT balance in EXP)
5/15 702 668 693 (ATT BT balance in EQ; EQ Sony balance reduced to 49%)
5/16 702 668 693 (ATT BT balance in TU; TU Sony balance reduced to 49%)
5/17 702 671 693 (EXP Sony balance reduced to 49%)
5/18 715 671 693 (PNC balance paid off (temporarily) in EQ)
5/19-5/20 (no changes)
5/21 715 671 697 (2 inquires fell off TU)
5/22 715 671 697
5/23 715 671 700 (1 inquiry fell off TU)
5/24 715 671 705 (1 inquiry fell off TU; Discover balance reduced to 49% in TU)
5/25 722 671 707 (1 inquiry fell off TU; Discover balance reduced to 49% in EQ)
5/26-5/28 (didn't pull)
5/29 722 671 729 (PNC balance paid off (temporarily) in TU)
5/30-6/03 (didn't pull)
6/04 728 678 739 (Last inquiry fell off TU; Discover balance reduced to 49% in EX)
6/05 728 678 739
6/06-6/07 (no changes)
6/08 732 678 739
6/09-6/13 (no changes)
6/14 732 681 739
6/15-6/19 (no changes)
6/20 734 681 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/21 737 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/22 739 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/23 741 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/24 (didn't pull)
6/25 744 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/26 746 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/27 748 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
6/28-7/1 (no changes)
7/02 750 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/03 753 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/04 (didn't pull)
7/05 755 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/06 758 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/07 (didn't pull)
7/08 759 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/09 761 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/10 763 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/11-7/12 (no changes)
7/13 767 691 739 (1 inquiry fell of EQ)
7/14-7/31 (no changes)

Inquiries:
BRCLYSBANKDE 03/21/2007 TransUnion
CITIBANKNA 03/21/2007 Equifax
FIRST USA 03/21/2007 Equifax
CITI 03/21/2007 Equifax
ELANFINSVC 03/21/2007 Equifax
BKONE 03/21/2007 Equifax
CITI USA 03/21/2007 Equifax
CBUSA/CBSD 03/21/2007 Equifax
AMEX 03/21/2007 Experian
DISCOVER FIN 03/21/2007 Experian
FIA CSNA 03/23/2007 Equifax
BANK OF AMERICA 03/27/2007 Experian
OHIOSV ADO 04/13/2007 Equifax

Available Credit before and after AOR:
Acounts before:
AMEX Skymiles Plat. $15,000
BOA Worldpoints Plat. MC $7,500
FIA Schwab Worldpoints Visa $5,000
Citi AA MC $11,500
- Total CL Before AOR: $39,000

Accounts after AOR:
AMEX Skymiles Plat. $24,500 (CLI)
BOA Worldpoints Plat. MC $20,000 (CLI)
FIA Schwab Worldpoints Visa $10,000 (CLI)
Citi AA MC $0
AMEX Business Gold (no preset limit)
AMEX Preferred Gold (no preset limit)
CitiBusiness AA MC $2,000 (reallocated $23,000 to CitiProfessional)
CitiBusiness PremierPass $25,000
CitiProfessional $26,000 ($23k from CitiBus AA)
CitiBusiness TY $15,000
Chase United Mileage Business $15,000
Chase United Mileage $1,000 (reallocated $14,000 to Sony)
Starwood Preferred Guest $24,500 (CLI)
Starwood Preferred Guest Business $25,000
Discover Miles $8,000
Juniper Fly America $15,000
PNC Select Rewards Platinum $20,000 (CLI)
AT&T Universal Rewards $19,000 (Consolidated Citi AA into ATT)
Sony $20,000 ($14,000 from United)
BoA PLatinum Business $12,500
-Total CL After AOR: $282,500
- Total Personal CL: $162,000
- Total Business CL: $120,500

Completed Balance Transfers
Sony - $17,600 (Used BT check provided with card)
Discover - $7,040 (Used BT check mailed to me)
Citi Professional - $22,880 (Used BT check mailed to me)
Juniper - $13,200 (Used BT check provided with card)
BoA Business - $12,000 (BT over phone to Citi Professional)
Citi Business - $13,650 (Via web site; split between Sony and Juniper CCS)
PNC - $17,600 (Used BT check mailed to me)
AT&T - $16,720 (Used BT check requested via web site)
Citi Business PP - $22,250 (Via web site; split between PNC, Discover and BoA Biz)
- Totals: $142,940

Rewards/Bonuses Expected
While I'll probably use many of the points for flights, I'll put an estimated value in GCs for ease of providing a total value.
From AOR:
35,000 AMEX Rewards Pts = ~$350 in Gift Cards (received a/o 5/7/07)
51,000 Thank You Points = ~$500 in GCs (51,000 points received a/o 5/11/07)
20,000 Starwood Preferred Guest = ~$200 in GCs (received a/o 4/23/07)
$195 Card Offers Cash ($195 received a/o 7/3/07)
$165 worth of statement credits (all received a/o 4/24/07)
12,000 miles from Discover (1,000/month for 12 months) = ~$100 GC value
50,000 United Airlines Miles = ~$500 value (received a/o 4/26/07)
20,000 American Airlines Miles (for CC) = ~$200 value (received a/o 4/23/07)
Other/bank signup bonuses:
25,000 American Airlines Miles (for Fidelity account) = ~$250 value (received a/o 4/27/07)
$100 signup bonus (for Fidelity account) = (received on 4/12/07)
7,500 MyPoints (for E-LOAN account) = ~$50 GC (received 6/8/07)
-----------------------------
Total = $2,610 estimated value (~$2,510 received a/o 7/3/07)

Interesting Observations/Notes:
1) While some have mentioned the limit on CitiBusiness cards to 2, I was approved for and received 3 different CitiBusiness cards, in addition to the Citi Professional card.
2) I was able to successfully reallocate CL from the CitiBusiness AA card to the CitiProfessional card.
3) Post AOR, I've increased CLIs on existing Delta AMEX, BoA Worldpoints and Schwab, and new Starwood AMEX and PNC Personal cards.
4) I've received the following BT checks: Sony (with card), Juniper (with card), Discover (per request), Citi Professional (welcome checks), PNC (welcome checks) and BoA business (welcome checks).
5) I was able to BT from the BoA business card to the Citi Professional quasi-personal/business card.
6) Successfully BT'd from Citi Business to Sony and Juniper personal cards (via web site).
7) For BoA checking, my BT check deposits via ATM appear in account balance next day, regardless of amount. Those done via teller are put on hold.

Definitely interested in opinions or insights from others. Willing to answer questions as well.

Citi monitoring sucks, only 1 pull every 30 days.
Get something better. Did you try getting an AMEX CLI Pre-AOR?
You may have gotten higher limits if you did, and waited for it to report.

PolarDude said: Citi monitoring sucks, only 1 pull every 30 days.
Get something better. Did you try getting an AMEX CLI Pre-AOR?
You may have gotten higher limits if you did, and waited for it to report.

Yeah, didn't realize how bad it sucked until today. I didn't try the the CLI pre-AOR because I was ready to try one. In hindsight, perhaps I should've waited on my AOR, but was anxious to get started.

scott1961 said: Get TrueCredit, It will have no adverse affects. Kind of fun pulling on a daily basis to see the affects. Your score might actual go up a little at first as you show a higher credit limit. Also is good a way to see what's happening with those pending's, Many times you will find the account on TrueCredit before you get a reply from issuer

Thanks, that's what I was assuming.

ahself said: Joined TrueCredit and updated credit scores and inquiries based on new information.

Surprised the Experian score dropped so much in one day (with only two inquiries), but that could also be due to the differences in how Citi and TrueCredit calculate these scores.
TrueCredit shows Experian at 728 for me while EQ and TU our both over 780. Also I use myFICO.com for real FICO scores, Which you might also want to get, and Experian their is 787. So not sure why it's so low on TrueCredit

Good results so far!

I think you will probably get one of those CitiBusiness apps rejected (max of two). However, you can probably apply for one or two of their pesonal cards.

I hope you will be able to do some serious credit line reallocation before BT'ing. What do you plan on doing with the 0% money? Since you seem to like miles, I'd recommend using $50,000 to open up a Fidelity account, and get miles +$100.

markkundinger said: I hope you will be able to do some serious credit line reallocation before BT'ing. What do you plan on doing with the 0% money? Since you seem to like miles, I'd recommend using $50,000 to open up a Fidelity account, and get miles +$100.

Since I don't have any loans, HELOC or otherwise, to pay down, the plan is to reallocate and then put the money into an E-LOAN, ING or other high interest account or two. I'll check out the Fidelity idea...thanks.

BTW, I received an email from BOA (who I bank with) letting me know I have been preselected for a Bank of America Platinum Visa® Business Credit Card with a CL of up to $35k. "0% Introductory APR on balance transfers (not purchases or cash advances) for the first 9 billing cycles. There are no balance transfer fees with introductory transfers. No Annual Fee."

Any reason I shouldn't take them up on this? Also, would this be the perfect opportunity to request a BT to my BOA debit card (i.e. request the BT on my application)?

ahself said: BTW, I received an email from BOA (who I bank with) letting me know I have been preselected for a Bank of America Platinum Visa® Business Credit Card with a CL of up to $35k. "0% Introductory APR on balance transfers (not purchases or cash advances) for the first 9 billing cycles. There are no balance transfer fees with introductory transfers. No Annual Fee."

Any reason I shouldn't take them up on this? Also, would this be the perfect opportunity to request a BT to my BOA debit card (i.e. request the BT on my application)?

I wish my BOA card gave me that deal. Couldn't get them to waive the fee or reduce it significantly or anything. They told me that on a $20,000 BT at 3% that it would normally be $600, but they would reduce the fees to $550. HA! Forget I even asked! I even tried calling back the next day and asking with another CSR and still no dice.

I also recommend jumping on the BofA offer. Their BT offers usually aren't that great (tend to have uncapped fees), so I wouldn't expect much better than that one.

ahself said: Well, I applied for the BoA offer last night and wasn't approved immediately. It could be because I requested a BT to my debit card on my application. I chose to go this route rather than BT via checks or another option because the Ts&Cs clearly stated 0% APR on BTs for "non-check BTs". It could also be because I requested a BT of $19.5k...wasn't sure how high to go considering what they stated my limit could be. Maybe I'll still get approved. I assume I was targeted for the offer prior to my AOR because I also received the exact same offer in the mail today.

Also, my Equifax score dropped three points as the BoA inquiry showed up with them. Amazing how many of the inquiries have been with Equifax. I noticed that many of Unbelieevable's inquiries tracked similar to mine and were with Equifax while Cyberkost's appeared to be split up pretty even between Transunion and Experian. I seem to remember reading that inquiries with the different credit bureau's are related to where you live, but not sure.

BofA is notorious for offering a high credit limit(my preapproved application says upto 25K). However, when I applied, I got a measly 1.5K credit limit. Hope it's not the case for you.

Received the AMEX Gold and the Discover cards today...called and activated both.

I asked about BT options with the Discover CSR. She said that she could do it over the phone or send BT checks. Even though she said the immediate/phone option would transfer the money faster, I requested the check (wanted to write it to myself if possible). Wouldn't you know it, she offered up options for how I could use the BT check and writing one to myself and depositing it into my checking account was an option she suggested...she said it should make it easier on me in determining where I want to use the money...exactly.

I also asked the Discover CSR about a CL increase and was told that it's usually 4-6 months before I'm able to get an increase. Oh well.

Updated the OP with new scores and other info.

Updated OP with new scores and new inquiry from BoA. Somewhat interesting, albeit frustrating, that BoA decided to do a hard pull from Experian after FIA CSNA already did one from Equifax. I guess that's related to me not getting an immediate decision on that recent BoA card...BoA must have wanted to check me out further...still no decision from BoA yet.

Logged into my AMEX MRP account today and noticed that I have 20k points pending from the AMEX Business Gold Rewards card. In addition, I logged into cardoffers.com and noticed that my cash from the Starwood Preferred Guest card is there. Interesting thing is that I haven't received either card yet.

Also, I decided to check out ThankYouNetwork.com to see if I might be able to register without actually having my Citi cards in hand. Turns out you can register if you've been approved for Citi cards using your phone #, zip code and last 4 digits of SSN. I did that, was able to login and found out that I've apparently been approved for two of the CitiBusiness cards I applied for (Platinum Select and PremierPass) since they showed up in my account along with the Professional card. No points yet, but at least I know I was approved. Unfortunately, there was no mention of the AT&T card...hopefully it'll be approved too, along with the CitiBusiness AA card.

Wow, what a day at the mailbox today. I opened the mail and received the Starwood Preferred Guest, Starwood Preferred Guest Business, Sony, Citi Professional, Citi Business, Juniper, CitiBusiness AA and AMEX Business Gold. The only one I didn't know the status of was the CitiBusiness AA. (Unbelieevable will probably be jealous now that I've been approved for 3 CitiBusiness cards. )

The other surprises were the $25k CLs for the CitiBusiness AA and the Starwood Preferred Guest Business.

I also received BT checks with my Juniper and Sony cards.

Lastly, I got an approval for the AT&T Citi card via email...no CL mentioned though. That leaves me with just one card, the United Biz, that I don't know the status of.

Received my CitiBusiness PremierPass card today and it came with a $25k CL. I'm somewhat surprised at the high CLs I received on the business cards I applied for. However, it'll be nice when it's time to do some BTs.

Am I correct in understanding that the utilization on my business cards (i.e. after doing BTs) won't affect my personal credit scores? If so, do I even need to worry about staying around the 88-90% utilization mark on the biz cards?

ahself said: Wow, what a day at the mailbox today. I opened the mail and received the Starwood Preferred Guest, Starwood Preferred Guest Business, Sony, Citi Professional, Citi Business, Juniper, CitiBusiness AA and AMEX Business Gold. The only one I didn't know the status of was the CitiBusiness AA. (Unbelieevable will probably be jealous now that I've been approved for 3 CitiBusiness cards. )


Yes I am!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

where do you live? reason I ask, you got an awful lot of Equifax pulls, which is great for B. I know some believe that CUs pull based on geographic location (they used to, debatable if they still do). I tend to get way more experian, which I dislike greatly (Phx, AZ).

tooligan said: where do you live? reason I ask, you got an awful lot of Equifax pulls, which is great for B. I know some believe that CUs pull based on geographic location (they used to, debatable if they still do). I tend to get way more experian, which I dislike greatly (Phx, AZ).

I live in GA. I remember seeing a CC pull database where you can search for inquires by location or other parameters...can't seem to find it right now though. When I looked through it for GA, the results were mixed...e.g. Banks/Issuers pulling from different agencies for the same state, etc.

HappyGuy said: OP or others, are you using a software program to fill out all of your CC applications and if so which program?

I didn't use a software program to fill out my CC aplications (i.e. an autofill program); although I believe others have. I only set up an Excel file to help me keep track of the CCs I applied for, status, terms, etc.

ahself said: I've been approved for all 16 cards I applied for.

That's great!

6) Called and reallocated $23k from my CitiBiz AA card to my CitiProfessional card.
This is potentially very big. It means you just transfered CL from a business line (which does not appear on your credit report) to a professional card (which, as far as I know, DOES appear on your credit report). If it pans out, there's a lot of opportunity for -- let's be frank here -- abuse.

Coincidentally, I received three Citi Professional 0% BT welcome checks today. So far, I've received the following BT checks: Sony (with card), Juniper (with card), Discover (per request) and Citi Professional. None of them appear to have restrictions on depositing into checking.

Called PNC CS today and still no word on my CLI request...was told "it's pending approval".

Updated OP with how my new CL is shaping up.

Back to my reallocation from CitiBiz AA to Citi Professional...It's interesting to note that Citi considers the Professional card to be a business card (per others' confirmation and the fact that it states CitiBusiness on the back of the card) but their web site only allows you to register it as a personal card. I tried unsuccessfully to register it online with my other business cards, called tech support and was told that it has to be registered with my personal cards. Can someone confirm that it does appear on your personal credit report?

cardjuggler said: ahself said: Rather than wait to do a full-blown second AOR a year after the first one, I may take some of these offers along the way. Anyone else have experience with this? For example, I received a Disney rewards CC offer with 0% on purchases and BTs until 10/08 with a $50 cap on the BT fee...kind of hard to pass that up. Perhaps going somewhat conservative with the BT amounts is paying off.
Go for it! And let us know the result. Per the Dave Hanson strategy (and especially after bumping lots of inquiries), you're likely to get it with a good CL ... unless they pull EXP.

A quick update on the Disney offer. I finally got around to applying for it over the phone. Wouldn't you know it, they did pull EXP, even though the previous Chase/First USA pulls were on EQ. Regardless, I was approved for a $9k limit...not great, but the terms are good and I should be able to roll credit lines and balances (e.g. Sony) over next March when my initial 0% offers are up. The terms are as explained above, except that it's 0% thru 11/08...even better.

BTW, I was curious about the EXP score TrueCredit was giving me since it was so much lower than the other two. I had an offer for a free 12 months of EXP Triple Advantage and tried it out. It shows my EXP "Plus" score as 768. I know these are all FAKO scores, but I imagine my true EXP score is higher than the 689 that TrueCredit shows and that's why I was approved for this Disney card.