EricGo07 said:E101 said:demingy, tell me why not? I know I have to pay 2,386.42 no matter what and I know that 1.I will be prepaying more to shorten my mortgage, so now I have invested in a program that will 2. tell me how much and when so it will be able to get me out of the mortgage in 9.583 years 3. without creating a major impact on my current lifestyle and as a "side-effect" helping me become frugal in my spending because each time I make a change to the program the payoff changes dynamically showing me instantly cause of my changes either good (less time to payoff) or bad (adding more time to payoff). For me that is worth $3,500 alone not to mention the thousands I am 4. saving on interest I will not have to pay.I have bolded and numbered your post ..

1. How much ?
2. As much as you can, paid when the mortgage is due. Keep the extra money in a HYS account until that date arrives.
3. That depends how much of your discretionary income is being spent to afford your current lifestyle. Put another way, any amount above your normal monthly savings rate sent to your mortgage is lifestyle money.
4. Less than the $3500 you spent for the scam.

I can tell you Eric his results will be similar to mine. His principal paid will be $3500 more than before and interest will be around $1500-$2500 more than if he just did it on his own on a monthly basis.

His total interest paid by using the software will be $89287 + or - $500, whereas it would have been 87287 without the software.

He should have the analysis in his hand and be able to post that total interest paid number right now.

demingy said:E101 said:
Yes, I already purchased the program and yes UFF has a guarantee which is as follows:

The mortgage payoff date in your personalized Financial Analysis has a limited guaranteed by United First Financial as follows:

1. If you follow the plan as outlined and use the Money Merge Account software as it is designed, (with free help from customer service if you should need it), your mortgage will be paid off by the date shown in the Financial Analysis based on the accuracy of the data you provide for this Analysis, or your money back.

2. You will receive a Written Limited Guarantee when you sign up for your Money Merge Account.

So what good is the guarantee going to do you if the "plan as outlined" is impossible or impractical for you to follow? Their guarantee is phrased so that you cannot get your money back if it turns out that the payments expected are unreasonable, because their argument would be that if you followed their plan your mortgage would be paid off as promised.

Well, I think because the guarantee is ironclad and he cannot get a refund, he will defend it to the death. He seemed to have disregarded the concrete numbers Mike had posted.

mikef07 said:EricGo07 said:E101 said:demingy, tell me why not? I know I have to pay 2,386.42 no matter what and I know that 1.I will be prepaying more to shorten my mortgage, so now I have invested in a program that will 2. tell me how much and when so it will be able to get me out of the mortgage in 9.583 years 3. without creating a major impact on my current lifestyle and as a "side-effect" helping me become frugal in my spending because each time I make a change to the program the payoff changes dynamically showing me instantly cause of my changes either good (less time to payoff) or bad (adding more time to payoff). For me that is worth $3,500 alone not to mention the thousands I am 4. saving on interest I will not have to pay.I have bolded and numbered your post ..

1. How much ?
2. As much as you can, paid when the mortgage is due. Keep the extra money in a HYS account until that date arrives.
3. That depends how much of your discretionary income is being spent to afford your current lifestyle. Put another way, any amount above your normal monthly savings rate sent to your mortgage is lifestyle money.
4. Less than the $3500 you spent for the scam.

I can tell you Eric his results will be similar to mine. His principal paid will be $3500 more than before and interest will be around $1500-$2500 more than if he just did it on his own on a monthly basis.

His total interest paid by using the software will be $89287 + or - $500, whereas it would have been 87287 without the software.

He should have the analysis in his hand and be able to post that total interest paid number right now.I saw your post Mike, and I agree with it. I am trying to point out to E101 that he is still making unfounded assumptions and/or emphasizing a benefit that is trivial to do by oneself.

mikef07: I am glad to see you convinced that this software is certainly not financially worthwhile. Just curious, where are you getting the numbers from that you have posted recently.

demingy said:E101 said:
Yes, I already purchased the program and yes UFF has a guarantee which is as follows:

The mortgage payoff date in your personalized Financial Analysis has a limited guaranteed by United First Financial as follows:

1. If you follow the plan as outlined and use the Money Merge Account software as it is designed, (with free help from customer service if you should need it), your mortgage will be paid off by the date shown in the Financial Analysis based on the accuracy of the data you provide for this Analysis, or your money back.

2. You will receive a Written Limited Guarantee when you sign up for your Money Merge Account.

So what good is the guarantee going to do you if the "plan as outlined" is impossible or impractical for you to follow? Their guarantee is phrased so that you cannot get your money back if it turns out that the payments expected are unreasonable, because their argument would be that if you followed their plan your mortgage would be paid off as promised.
E101: Agree with demingy, looks like there is nothing in the guarantee that would help. Is there some kind of "return/refund" policy since you have not gone for the training yet? I am sure you have seen mikef07's recent numbers posted here that shows this is certainly not, financially speaking, a product to spend $3500 on.

uutxs said:mikef07 said:uutxs said:mikef07: I am glad to see you convinced that this software is certainly not financially worthwhile. Just curious, where are you getting the numbers from that you have posted recently.

I had an analysis done with their software so I got those numbers from UFF. Other numbers are from an extra mortgage payment calculator.

The point here being not one person can say my numbers are made up. These are from both camps so to speak and I did not care what the outcome was, just that the outcome was available for all to see.
The UFF numbers: Is that being provided by their sales/marketing folks to get you to buy it? In any case, given that they are outputs from UFF, these are numbers that E101 can take to the training and show them the bankrate (or any other free mortgage calculator) numbers as well. Ask the tough questions at the training and see if they will have you leave the rom for your $3500 refund!

Yes. These numbers were sent to me by them and showed how much I would pay over an 11.2 year period and a 2.9 year period. These numbers are from their sales/marketing folks.

All E101 has to do is post his total interest paid amount here and we can see if it worked out for him. That number is right on his analysis sheet and he will have that sheet for sure.

mikef07 said:I got some results for some people:

If I were to take my mortgage and pay ~$940 extra per month for 11.2 years I would end up having a paid off mortgage of $225,000 and will have paid interest in the amount of $85734 for a total out of my pocket of $310,734.

If I do the MMA and these numbers are according to them:
I would pay a total of $228,500 which is my mortgage and the software and the total interest I will have paid would be $87,304.29 after 11.2 years

The total here is $315,804.29 (This number is what the UFF MMA software spit out for me)

Total with MMA $315,804.29 > $310,734 (Done on my own).

The results do show that by using the MMA software it would cost me $5070.29 extra

I hate to say it but from a financial standpoint you will come out behind. It honestly cannot be argued after looking at this. This is using the UFF MMA software. Both scenarios are the exact same time frame of 11.2 years.

This shows that I will have paid interest of $1570.29 that I did not have to and $3500 in principal that I did not have to. This is the only post in 46 pages that has actual results from the actual software as well as real mortgage numbers.This is good, and allows us to quantitate the salary float benefit.

The system assumes 0 salary interest income without the UFF
The $3500 paid up front is worth $6,730.74 11 years later.

Since we "only" came out 5070.29 behind, and not 6,730.76, Mike's salary float earned him 1,651.45, or $8.80 every month.

I'll be interested to hear from Mike how much interest he would have made by putting his salary into a HYS account.
I estimate 6000*5/1200 = $25 month.

In summary, Mike makes 3X more in a HYS account than the HELOC float game, and saves himself $6,730 off of his 11 year amortized home repayment schedule by not buying the scam.

Hopefully these numbers will convince any reasonable person of a couple of things:

1. At $3500, this is a scam. You can NEVER recoup the initial money spent.
2. Salary float by way of a HELOC is a joke. Heck, Mike only makes $8.80 a month on 12,000 monthly salary !
3. Anyone who really really really wants salary float just has to put the money in a HYS account. Free, and about 3X the return of the HELOC way.
4. Mortgage shortening is not only 95+ from prepayments, it is 99+ from prepayments.

I could go back to page #1 of this thread where I said exactly this, but will not, because I do not want 50 over people saying the EXACT same thing.

Ellory, can we update the summary a bit, and then ask the mods to lock this bloody thread ??

mikef07 said:Yes. These numbers were sent to me by them and showed how much I would pay over an 11.2 year period and a 2.9 year period. These numbers are from their sales/marketing folks.does the "2.9 year period" mean that they were having you take out a HELOC for that long? If so, did they have you take out one big chunnk, then pay it off over that time, or was that 32 withdrawls/payments (1 per month) or a few or what?

mikef07 said:Financially I can't back it. Behaviorally I am not a supporter or detractor. If your goal was to pay off your house as fast as possible and this and only this software got you to do that then it may well be a good ~$5000 spent.

If you put a gun to my head and said do one or the other I would just send in an extra $940/month. If something else comes out that makes it different it may make sense financially, however since my numbers are actually using the software I don't honestly see how that can happen.

And this is why it is like pulling teeth to get these guys to give actual numbers. The bottom line speaks volumes.

mikef07 said:Financially I can't back it. Behaviorally I am not a supporter or detractor. If your goal was to pay off your house as fast as possible and this and only this software got you to do that then it may well be a good ~$5000 spent.

If you put a gun to my head and said do one or the other I would just send in an extra $940/month. If something else comes out that makes it different it may make sense financially, however since my numbers are actually using the software I don't honestly see how that can happen.If you include the HYS account interest you are missing out on, this program is costing you almost $10,000 (in 2018 dollars).