All the cool kids are doing AORs, so why not me

Long time lurker, sorry that some don't like to read these, so please just flame away or skip all together.

I was planning to do an AOR for a while, figured I should strike before Suze et. al. ruin it for the rest of us. I'm also doing this as a way to prevent myself from foolishly buying my neighbors townhouse (as I deep down thing the market still needs some correction)

A couple of the more recent CLIs are not reported yet, but I figured it would be better to AOR now without them, before my car loan goes on the record.

To prep, I asked for a non-hard pull CLI on all my cards, and consolidated and closed a couple of my Chase Cards.

Goals. Basic BT Arbirtage. I'm was hoping to get about 80K in BT money to put in my MMA. I'm thinking that might be a little too high a goal. This is basically a learning experiance. If that cardselect thing works (I never trust cookies), I should pick up a nice check from them.

July 31st, 2007

My info

Age: 30

Credit Score:
7/31 773 TU 785 EX 750 EQ
HHI - $115K, $56K personal
Rent, no mortgage.
14K car loan at 5.74% (not on report yet)
Roughly $58K in student loan debt (5.5%)
About $800 left on an co-signed car loan

Previous Credit
AMEX Blue 18K CL (xfered to INNYC) 10K CL 4.5K Balance at 0% for 12 more months
AMEX Gold for Business - no set credit line
Discover 11.9K CL (xferd to Miles) 1K CL, negligible balance paid in full each month
Citi Driver's Edge 9.3K CL (xfered to Pro) .5K 0 balance
Chase Freedom? 19.5K (xferd to Sony) .5K 0 balance
Nordstrom 15K 0 balance
BOA LL Bean 10K (canceled) 0 balance BOA apparently decided I didn't need this anymore (8/1)
WAMU/Providian Paypal 7K found this when I got my ESPN card registered, can't merge Credit lines with WAMU?

Total 91K, about 87K available at start of AOR

Card name, BT intro rate, intro term, BT max fee, annual fee, Status, CL, (perks)
Approved/Denied
Citi Professional 0.00% 12 0 0 Instant $9,000 (consolidated $17,800) (15K TYP w/ purchase)
CitiBusiness with TYN 0.00% 12 0 0 Approved, 8/9 $20,000 (15K TYP w/ purchase)
Citibusiness PremierPass 0.00% 12 0 75 (free 1st year) Declined, too many apps (15K bonus pts w/ purchase)
Miles by Discover 0.00% 12 75 0 Deferred-need proof of income 8/1, Approved, but shifted balance from other card $10,900 (moved 10K to Biz) $100 in miles, $40 Cardselection.com
Chase Sony Card 0.00% 12 75 0 Approved, seen online $5,500 [consolidate) up to 24.5K ($100 gift card w/ purchase)
BOA Plat Plus Visa 0.00% 12 0 0 Same day Approval, call back $15,000 ($20 Cardselection.com)
BOA Plat Visa Biz 0.00% 9 ? 0 Approved! I guess they only canceled my personal cards, $10,000
Amex Blue Cash for Biz 7.99% NA NA 0 Instant Approval, though now saying "In Process", 8/6 Now saying Approved again $4,000 (move 3K to INNYC( ($60 Cardselection.com)
AMEX IN:NYC 0.00% 6 0 0 Approved per AMEX site 8/2, 9400 (consolidated to 21400, then to 40400) ($30 Cardselection.com)
BOA Pet Rewards 0.00% 6 0 0 Canceled (too many apps) ($20 Cardselection.com
Advanta Platinum Business 0.00% 13 50 0 Approved - 8/10 NOW IT'S denied, dammit!, 8/11, nope now approved again %5,000 ($25 Cardselection.com)
Cap One Biz Visa Plat 0.00% 11 0 0 Denied, offer expired? maybe try again?
WAMU ESPN Visa 0.00% 6 0 0 Instant $7000 (5000 pts?)
Chase Plat Visa Biz 0.00% 6 (12 on app, but looks like it changed) 75 0 Approved 8/6 $10,000 (upped it to $19,500 ($30 Cardselection.com)
National City Visa 0.00% 6 0 0 Approved, $10,000
Barclays National Park 0.00% 12 50 0 Approved $10000
FIA Schwab (BOA) 1.90% 12 75 0 Canceled (too many apps) ($50 Credit w/ purchase)
ATT Universal (Citi) 0.00% 12 0 0 Denied, too many inquries
Amex SimplyCash Biz 7.99% NA NA 0 Approved per website 8/2 $4,000 (moved 3K to INNYC) upped to 20,000, moved 19K to INNYC ($60 Cardselection.com)

Baylor Alumni 0% 12 0 0 Instant Approal $25,000 Thanks LHen!
Discover Business 0.00% 12 75 0 Approved 8/1 $8,000 ($18,000 after consolidation with miles) ($40 Cardselction.com)
M&T Visa Biz Plat 0.00% 6 0 0 Deferred- Canceled, needed biz name, won't bother
BankAtlantic Rewards Business 0.00% 15 75 0 Approved 8/9 $5,000 boo (closed and reallocated to Nat Park).
FNBO Bucks Back Visa 0.00% 12 75 0 Denied 6/8

Credit Score: True Credit
Date TU EX EQ
7/31 773 785 750
8/01 773 780 730
8/02 765 771 728
8/04 754 771 747
8/05 754 772 747
8/06 754 782 747
8/09 754 781 747
8/10 749 772 745 (2 more inquiries)
8/11 748 772 728
8/15 750 771 725 (2 new weird inquiries)
8/17 753 769 725
8/18 755 746 673 And here come the balances... YIKES!
8/20 754 746 673
8/21 754 746 675
8/22 756 743 680
8/23 753 743 680
8/24 755 743 680
8/25 758 743 680
8/29 759 733 680 (starting to see some TU bumpage?)
8/30 752 734 680
9/1 733 738 690
9/5 721 717 698
9/8 721 717 687
9/11 716 712 687
9/12 716 712 674
9/16 719 712 674 (more TU bumpage)
9/19 719 712 675
9/20 722 712 675 (Only one more TU left)
9/22 722 712 679 (First EQ bump )
9/23 722 712 682 (EQ bump)
9/24 722 712 684 (EQ bump)
9/26 722 713 686 (EQ bump)
9/30 723 713 688
10/1 723 713 690 (EQ and final TU bump)
10/3 723 713 691
10/13 723 716 691
10/15 723 716 693 (back to bumping EQ, 10 left to go)
10/16 723 716 696 (9 more)
10/17 723 716 699 (8 more)
10/18 723 724 701 (7 more, a temp bump since my old SL are paid, but my new consolidated loan is not)
10/19 723 713 704 (6 more)
10/20 723 713 703 (5 more)
10/21 721 713 706 (4 more)
10/22 721 713 708 (3 more)
10/24 721 713 711 (2 more)
10/31 723 723 708 (CLI increase on AMEX for TU and EX, one more IQ on EQ for a southwest card app)
11/03 725 723 724 (EQ bump, 2 more)
12/19 745 722 717 (1 TU, 7 EX, 4 EQ)

Scores via Credit Secure

12/19 747 748 743

Inquiries

BARCLAYSBK 08/15/2007 Equifax (????)

NCBK-NCCS 08/14/2007 TransUnion (????)

CITIBANKNA 08/09/2007 Equifax (opened a Savings account

CHASE 08/08/2007 TransUnion (by CL Increase)

FNB OMAHA 08/01/2007 Equifax

NCBK-NCCS 08/01/2007 TransUnion

BANK OF AMERICA 07/31/2007 Experian

AMEX 07/31/2007 Experian

FIA CSNA 07/31/2007 Experian

CITI USA 07/31/2007 Equifax

FIA CSNA 07/31/2007 Equifax

CHASE 07/31/2007 Equifax

ADVANTA 07/31/2007 Equifax

CITI 07/31/2007 Equifax

USBK 07/31/2007 Equifax

FIRST USA 07/31/2007 Equifax

CBUSA/CBSD 07/31/2007 Equifax

CITI/CBSD 07/31/2007 TransUnion

BRCLYSBANKDE 07/31/2007 TransUnion

WASHMTL/PROV 07/31/2007 TransUnion

DISCOVER FIN 07/31/2007 TransUnion

Step by Step

1. After consolidating Chase balance (they had to leave 500 on the old card for some reason), I wrote the BT check that came with the Sony Card to myself for $12,000 ($75 fee) (8/8 still clearing BOA, planning to mail other checks straight to FNBO)
2. 1000 purchase from Chase Biz to open a BOA savings (going to try a KTC scam) No fee, and purchase are 0% too, but probably won't BT anymore unless I can get a credit line increase, seeing as the fee would be 1%, and I'd only get 2-3% return for the 6 mos).
3. Mailed BT check (into FNBO) from Juniper for $8,950, hope they don't care I didn't round. That would make 90% utilization, but I'm curious to see the impact $50 fee
4. Mailed BT check (into FNBO) from Chase Business for 15,500 (I asked them for 12 mos, hoping it works). Add that to the 1000 purchase, I should be up to 80% utilization ($75 fee)
5. BTed 8600 from AMEX IN:NYC over to Citi Professional (<50% util). I should then be able to do a BT from the Citi card for 16K, eating up the positive balance, correct?
6. Deposited a BT check from National City in BOA checking for $10,000. I will probably xfer some of my Citi money back over hear to get the balance down close to 50% util.
7. Foolishly filled out my BOA Plat. application to BT money to real old Discover, think that would get me a higher CL. I asked for 11,000 and got it. Now my old discover is totally paid off and has a 1K limit. Oops. The discover agent said a refund check should take approximately 2 weeks to get once the BT shows up on there system. So I'm losing out on a month of that really good BOA deal when I could have just xfered it to my Boa checking.
8. I did a BT of the phone with WAMU for 5K back over to that National City Card to get that back down to 50% utilization.
9. Will have to get the National City check back from BOA and return for a fresh one.
10. BTed 4300 from Advanta to BOA checking (couldn't find an address for FNBO) ($50 fee) (8/14)
11. Mailed 20K check from Baylor card to FNBO (8/14)
12. Requested Balance credit check from discover (8/14)
13. Consolidated lines to Discover business, BTed 10K over to CitiBusiness for laundering. (8/15)
14. Got my $100 Chase Sony credit (8/15)
15. Requested a Balance credit check from Citi Prof (8/15)
16. Reallocated another 4K to AMEX INNYC from the biz cards. (Might do another BT, though I may use 2K to BT to make minimum payments on some cards)
17. Got 15K TYP from CitiBiz
18. Requested a new BT check for National City for 5K, placed stop on the bad one for 10K (hopefully won't get a 30 charge) will do another 5K when it clears
19. 8/18 Dumb move # 2. I forgot that a requested a BT to my old Citi Drivers edge card when I signed up for the Disc Miles. They pushed it through for a whopping $855 ($26 fee)... Doh! I requested a Balance credit again from Citi (N00B!)
20. Got the other 15K TYP
21. Noticed my credit scores took a dive, I used that extra 2K in BT money from AMEX in NYC to get my Miles ($490) and WAMU ($1510) cards under 50%
22. Cashed in TYPs for $300 to paydown Student Loans
23. I canceled the cashout from the Citi Prof after I noticed I can BT more than my credit line
24. Deposited 11,000 overpayment check from Discover in BOA (8/20)
25. Deposited 17,240 Check from Citi Prof into BOA (8/21)
26. Requested BT check for 27,950 from Citi Biz (8/22)
27. Depostied 5K from National City (at least 5k left to go)
28. Finally got that first 10K canceled ($30 fee, maybe) from Nat. City. Once it shows, I'll pull another 5-6 K for a BT).
29. Mailed 27,950 check from Citi Biz to FNBO (9/5)
30. Requested another 5K from National City
31. I closed my bankatlantic card and reallocated the line over to the national parks. Had to make a few calls and wait on hold, but it worked. I know I should have done this in reverse, oh well next time.
32. Moving 38,000 from FNBO to Citibank ultimate savings to get below FDIC cap. Will shop for a better rate once FNBO announces what they will be doing.
33. Opened BOA DOW MMA. Funded with 1000 from BOA Plat Biz
34. After AMEX FR, moved all upped my Simply Cash to 20K, and move all but 1000 to INYC
35. Took another 5K out of Citi Professional
36. Took yet another 2K out of Citi Professional
37. BT'd 6750 from Wachovia card to MMA (see 12-19 post)

Progress

Money to the MMA

12,000 BT (Chase Sony) - Clearing BOA Checking, 8/17 moved 9000 to FNBO now, 3000 more next week, Cleared (8/23)
1,000 purchase (Chase Biz) to open Boa Saving - xfered 700 to FNBO
8,950 BT (Juniper National Parks) - Mailed to FNBO 8/9 ($50 fee) - Cleared 8/13
15,500 BT (Chase Biz) - Mailed to FNBO 8/9 ($75 fee) - Cleared 8/13 that was FAST!
20,000 BT (Baylor US BK) - Mailed to FNBO (8/13) WORRIED why the delay (8/21), It's DONE! 8/22
4,300 BT (Advanta) to BOA checking (8/13), not showing yet ($50 fee), 8/17 clearing BOA - 8/28 on it's way to FNBO, Done 9/3
11,000 BT (BOA business) Check from Discover overpayment, clearing BOA (8/20) Cleared BOA, to FNBO (8/21) , slight delay, on it's way to FNBO, Done 9/3
17,240 BT (Citi Pro) (8600, from INNYC overpayment), deposited to BOA (8/21) on it's way to FNBO, Done 9/5
27,950 BT (Citi Biz) (10K from Discover Biz) requested BT check to me (8/22), mailed 9/5, Done 9/10
5,000 BT (National City) deposited in BOA clearing (8/23) - on it's way to FNBO, Done 9/3
5,000 BT (National City) Check requested 9/5, deposited 9/14 in BOA, moved to BOA MMA (9/20)
490 To FNBO, to compensate for the INNYC payment to Miles to adjust balance. Miles will be paid off so I'm not including that.
1000 purchase, (BOA Biz) to open BOA DOW MMA
5000 BT (Citi Pro) to BOA DOW MMA
2000 BT (Citi Pro) to BOA NEA MMA
6750 BT (Wachovia) to BOA NEA MMA
Total = $141,180

Previously used FNBO, BOA DOW, Citibank Ultimate Saver as my MMA of choice
12-19 Current MMA setup, 55K in BOA NEA MMA (last month of 5.75APY promotion), 85K in SECU CD, 10K in Fidelity.

Money being laudered before going to MMA

8,600 BT (AMEX IN|NYC) to Citi Prof card (*Deposited to BOA)
11,000 BT (BOA Plat) to Original Discover (*Received and now going to BOA)
10,000 bt (Discover Business) to CitiBusiness ($75 fee) (*Check on it way)

Misc

Rebalancing
$5,000 BT (WAMU ESPN) to National Citi to lower utilization
$490 BT (INNYC) to Discover Miles
$1510 BT (INNYC) to WAMU ESPN)

Etc.
855 BT (Discover Miles) to Citi Drivers (Overpayment check on its way) ($26 fee) (will probably pay off and not put into MMA)

Redos
10,000 BT (Nat City) - Clearing BOA Checking - 8/11 dammit, check denied by BOA for some reason. (Blah, got hit with a $30 cancelation charge - maybe not (8/30)

Fees
$276 + $118 (southwest)

Bennies

$100 Chase (statement credit)
$300 in Student Loan payment from 30K Citibank TYPs
$280 Cardselection
$25 Gift Cerfitcate to ESPN, bought some spandex running shorts
$125 Selling $50 Gap gift card $100 HomeDepot gift card (eBay) from AMEX Gold MR
12 SWA RR point from AMEX Gold MR (added to the 4 I already had) to get RT ticket
$100 bonus for Citibank Ultimate Savings account
4000 Discover Miles
$40 Statement credit for not canceling AMEX Gold
$100 bonus for Fidelity Account - see 12/19 post
15K United Miles from Fidelity - see 12/19 post
32 Southwest Rapid Reward credits - See 12-19 post

yet to collect

8000 Miles from Discover miles (1000 per month)
10K United Miles from Fidelity

Cardselection
08.13.2007 American Express SimplyCashSM Business Card $60.00 Confirmed / Paid (9/4)
08.13.2007 IN:NYC® Card from American Express® $30.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)
08.13.2007 Blue Cash® for Business Credit Card $60.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)
08.13.2007 Discover® Business Card $40.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)
08.13.2007 Miles Card from Discover® $40.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)
08.13.2007 Chase Business Cash Rewards Card $30.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)
08.28.2007 Sony CardSM $20.00 Confirmed Paid (9/4)

07.31.2007 Advanta Platinum BusinessCard with Rewards $25.00 Clicked
07.31.2007 Bank of America® Platinum Plus® Visa® Card $20.00 Clicked
$45 didn't come through

i predict good things for your pending apps. instant approvals are somewhat rare.

good call on all the biz apps. depending on your inquiries, you could hit a couple of the elan biz cards (e.g., M&T, Woodforest). there's also that US Bank (elan) Baylor card with 0%, 12 months, no bt fee. discover biz?

love the thread title, btw.

VerbalK said: Booyah, Baylor just gave me $25K ... Got any more like that Hendricks?

nice! I hear MikeR397's starting a new bank with all of his fam-o-rama proceeds. maybe you can hit him up for a card with a tasty CL.

seriously, now i've got to ask some more questions about US Bank Baylor. (wife-o-rama kicks off tomorrow - you're my only data point.)

whom did they pull?
how many inquiries did you have showing?
did you request a BT with the app? if so, how much?

I didn't do a BT yet. I already hit up my citi, chase and discover card up close to there limits, and have no idea how hard it will be to get an overpayment back from Nordstrom? I think the Baylor card had some leeway as to when the BT needs to take place.

I will post my scores and inquiries tommorrow morning when my TrueCredit is open for pulling again. I'm dreading my Equifax score

VerbalK said: I fixed the Plat Plus link, yep, I got the right one. I had to make the decision on the phone since apparently 4 is too many for FIA-BOA.
Maybe four new cards, b/c I have 4 FIA-BOA cards since last Nov and nobody told me anything about that.

Yeah, I got the impression I could have been tougher with the woman on the phone. She was saying "I just want to make sure I get you the RIGHT card". I asked if it was a choice of one, and she didn't really answer, but I certainly got the impression she was eager to cancel some of them. When I get my cancelation notice, I might call then and ask for the biz card again. The other two weren't anything special.

Just an FYI, once Barclays gets a wiff of what you are doing they will shut down your card. If you have a balance on the card you should expect you credit line to follow down your balance. plan accordingly.

Technologist said: OP, great post (EVEN GREATER TITLE!).

Not sure if title was meant as sarcasm? I liked doing mine and reading these threads because I am a finance nerd and think most others doing AoR's are also. The cool kids are to busy partying, getting laid and trashing their credit buying expensive cars to do an AoR

HappyGuy said: Just an FYI, once Barclays gets a wiff of what you are doing they will shut down your card. If you have a balance on the card you should expect you credit line to follow down your balance. plan accordingly.

Wifey didn't get any adverse action from Barclay's until a month after the balance was paid off so the above is not necessarily true.

I'm worried about my AMEX cards. I did one biz and one personal in the morning, and then for some reason tacked on another biz at 6pm. The first biz was instantly approved, now it is showing as "In Process" on their app status site. Might that late night pull tipped them off?
Edit by Moderator: Thank you for participating in the forums. However, this topic has been covered in a recent post Here.

VerbalK said: First off, BOA hosed me. Not only did they cancel 2 of my personal and one of my biz apps, they also apparently closed my LL Bean card (CL 10K). I now only have the one Plat Card at 15K. Plus they hit my Equifax report 3 times.

And now the fun part.

EQ got hosed. As of 8:40 this morning

TU, EX, EQ

773 (0), 780 (-5), 730 (-20... please stop the bleeding)

C'mon, you gotta be happy they hit EQ and not EX. 2-3 months of credit monitoring subscription will heal your EQ report . Also, with your credit scores and HHI you should revise your BT money goal upward by a factor of 2 or so.

Besides cardselection.com are there any other websites you guys would recommend to get Cash Back on applications?

Thanks in advance. I searched the forums but I could not find much info

Why was my recent AOR thread promptly locked, while this one remains?

I don't have anything against this thread, but this seems unfair... Can't mine be unlocked? There doesn't seem to be much incentive to post in the consolidated thread, as nobody responds... some of us have questions embedded within a post, and appreciate the feedback.

(my post was "My first AOR: 8.1.7.....").

Thanks to the MODS for unlocking this thread!

I see Baylor Alumni card has uncapped 3% BT fee. Did I miss the fineprint or they recently changed their term?

edit: never mind, it's been addressed before. I didn't see it on "Other Fees". No BT fee for first 12 mo.

I'm getting hosed. Future note to all AORers, don't apply at the end of a month, because I'm getting bait and switched.

The Capone offer claimed to have expired, the Chase business went from 12 to 6 months intro period, and the National City Balance Cap disappeared. It's looking like I may not get out of this with more 40-50 grand in good solid B/T money. So far, I'm thinking this was a waste of time. Boo!

Yeah, that Chase biz deal is 6 months if you go through CardSelection. A friendly Chase CSR can't help you switch to a card with 12 months? Heck, you might even be able to apply for another Chase biz card and reallocate.

And don't give up on BankAtlantic. Call Barclays' credit department (look in the application status and credit card issuer faq threads) and ask 'em what's up.

Okay, I got confused, the national city still looks good with no fee.

I requested a hardpull credit upgrade from chase to make a BT worthwhile. I asked for 19K, we'll see.

I'm also considering hitting up a couple personal lines for a bit more than 50%. I won't be needing a credit score for a while, and really, they are still pretty good.

Well, Chase put me up to 19.5 CL on the business, so that one is back in play. I have a couple BT checks on the way to max out a couple cards. I'd like to see what the impact on my report would be, and then pay them down to 50% if it's major. Anyone see any issues with doing this?

So, Citi denied me for their Hilton Card... and today I get not one, not two, not three, but four pre-qualified offers for others citi cards and checking based lines of credit.

Do you think I could call up CS and see if I can parlay this into my hotel card? I'm dying to get a free night so my upcoming mega frugal vacation where I take a 4 day jaunt to San Diego with car, hotel and airfare all running me under 400 dollars.