Snuffy’s 2nd AOR

Forget the 2 Millenium Bank cards as both are issued by First National which FNBO owns and issues there credit cards from and that bank is know to be very anti App-O-Rama and more than likely even if they approve you for a card will close the card when you call to activate or within 30-60 days after and will report the card as "Closed by Issuer".

You also currently have 3 Chase cards and are applying for 7 more Chase cards as Lasalle Bank credit cards are issued by Chase. Chase has been know to close accounts without notice on people with lots of cards or carrying large balances. Also Chase has been know to close old accounts when people apply for many new Chase cards at once without even letting you know so be aware of that possibility which could result in the loss of your Sony Card which is one of older accounts.

State Farm Bank is also very anti App-O-Rama read some of the recent App-O-Rama threads people have been getting instant approval but letters in the mail stating because of the amount of inquires recently your account has been closed with 30-60 days or flat out getting rejected.

You are applying for 3 BOA cards and your old account is a BOA account. BOA also has been know to close accounts when people apply for too many cards at once without even letting you know. If you current BOA cards get closed to open a new account your credit score will tank which could result in adverse action.

Discover only allows you apply for 1 new card every 90 days you got 2 business cards listed pick 1 or other.

If you read the Adverse Action thread lately lots of people are reporting that Barclays/Juniper has been taking adverse action against people carrying larger balances on there credit reports by lowering your limit to what you owe on the card which in effect can impact your credit score and lead to other adverse action because you will card will report 100% utilization.

Just a couple of things I noticed. Not stating every adverse action will happen to you but some of the above might happen to you based on fact you really are over doing Chase with 7 apps who is a bank who is more aggressive than others at taking adverse action against people because 7 of 23 apps are from Chase if they take adverse action against you more than likely everyone else will too as your utilization across all your cards will end up being super high plus have 10+ cards listed as closed by creditor on your credit report is basically screaming at other issuers to take action against you too.

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Your list looks very good.

My only comment would be to put Bank of America® Platinum Plus® MasterCard® as your first or second application. Getting cash ACH'd to checking is very easy - they beg you to do it. It's a terrific BT laudry card.....

Good luck...

Thank you everyone for the great feedback.

dolmar said: Forget the 2 Millenium Bank cards as both are issued by First National which FNBO owns and issues there credit cards from and that bank is know to be very anti App-O-Rama and more than likely even if they approve you for a card will close the card when you call to activate or within 30-60 days after and will report the card as "Closed by Issuer".
Thanks, I removed both.

dolmar said: You also currently have 3 Chase cards and are applying for 7 more Chase cards as Lasalle Bank credit cards are issued by Chase. Chase has been know to close accounts without notice on people with lots of cards or carrying large balances. Also Chase has been know to close old accounts when people apply for many new Chase cards at once without even letting you know so be aware of that possibility which could result in the loss of your Sony Card which is one of older accounts.
Biz: Currently I have no biz cards with Chase. I have removed 2 from the list leaving 2 left. Is this a good number or should it only be 1? I am unsure if Chase looks at business cards separately

Personal: I removed both. I should leave one based on the updated list?

Would these be future candidates for paying off, consolidating and applying for later?

dolmar said: State Farm Bank is also very anti App-O-Rama read some of the recent App-O-Rama threads people have been getting instant approval but letters in the mail stating because of the amount of inquires recently your account has been closed with 30-60 days or flat out getting rejected.
Removed

dolmar said: You are applying for 3 BOA cards and your old account is a BOA account. BOA also has been know to close accounts when people apply for too many cards at once without even letting you know. If you current BOA cards get closed to open a new account your credit score will tank which could result in adverse action.
I removed one. Should I have removed 2 and only apply for 1?

dolmar said: Discover only allows you apply for 1 new card every 90 days you got 2 business cards listed pick 1 or other.
Removed 1 biz.

Now there is 1 biz and 1 personal remaining. Venturion's Biz AOR comment plus yours concerns me on this one.

dolmar said: If you read the Adverse Action thread lately lots of people are reporting that Barclays/Juniper has been taking adverse action against people carrying larger balances on there credit reports by lowering your limit to what you owe on the card which in effect can impact your credit score and lead to other adverse action because you will card will report 100% utilization.
Would this be for personal credit only? I have 1 of each (biz/personal). Haven't removed it yet because the updated list may impact this.

dolmar said: Just a couple of things I noticed. Not stating every adverse action will happen to you but some of the above might happen to you based on fact you really are over doing Chase with 7 apps who is a bank who is more aggressive than others at taking adverse action against people because 7 of 23 apps are from Chase if they take adverse action against you more than likely everyone else will too as your utilization across all your cards will end up being super high plus have 10+ cards listed as closed by creditor on your credit report is basically screaming at other issuers to take action against you too.
Thanks, I have changed the list in the OP. I also separated those I have removed rather than deleting so others can see those cards if it suits their situation.

Hope to hear how it looks now.

jackcrawfish said: bookmark... √
subscription... √
Your list looks very good.

My only comment would be to put Bank of America® Platinum Plus® MasterCard® as your first or second application. Getting cash ACH'd to checking is very easy - they beg you to do it. It's a terrific BT laudry card.....

Good luck...
Moved it to the top of the personal card pile.

lhendricks92 said:

My suggestion for handling Barclays would be to apply for 1 personal and 1 business, and reallocate all but $500 to BankATL biz.

In general, I would use this same strategy (1 personal, 1 biz (maybe 2), reallocate to biz) as much as possible. You can do this with Chase and Citi, also...

Maybe it's just me, but the info above from lhendricks92 is extremely useful. Collecting this data is a primary reason why I continue to devour AOR threads.

markkundinger said: No no, get another Sony card. You can have multiple, and get multiple bonuses.

(Personally, I close my Sony cards after 11 months so it doesn't look weird, but others have kept them open)

Sorry, I meant that the reallocation suggestion with these issuers is great.

list is looking much better, but i have a few more suggestions.

i'm counting 3 citi cards which will report as personal cards. why not knock that down to 1 or 2 and add national city? (pick up the nat city biz while you're at it.)

also, you're missing some nice elan (us bank) biz cards: m&t, woodforest.

another tip about citi: you won't be able to reallocate that existing PP until you convert it to a card that reports the CL.

good luck

lhendricks92 said: Nice job for incorporating all the excellent feedback from dolmar et al. I think people underestimate the importance of minimizing the number of personal accounts you add to your credit history to 1) keep FICO happy and 2) minimize adverse action. I often see AoRs where people reach their maximum total CL with an issuer, and the incremental personal application nets a tiny CL. I'd rather be denied than take the hit of a new useless card.
I tried some credit report services and a couple of them said my score (FAKO) would have been higher if I had more accounts. However, I don't want to surpass whatever that optimal number is.

Definitely want to avoid adverse action and that is one big reason why I started this thread. People have already filtered out what would have been a big mistake by me.

lhendricks92 said:
My suggestion for handling Barclays would be to apply for 1 personal and 1 business, and reallocate all but $500 to BankATL biz.

In general, I would use this same strategy (1 personal, 1 biz (maybe 2), reallocate to biz) as much as possible. You can do this with Chase and Citi, also.

Keep that BT debt hidden - good luck.
Excellent advice!! One of my phases before the actual BT was the reallocate phase. Your answer fills that nicely.

I think my only concern at this point is if I combine the CL's and only have the option to use a BT launder card then that card needs to have a high CL to take the BT. I recall in the past I have heard of issues in which an amount BT'ed to a card is greater than the CL therefore causing issues. Currently my largest CL is $21700 (business).

Definitely agree with keeping debt on the business when possible.

Thanks again. Also want to say I have learned a lot from your previous business card posts.

sicbp said: Great post OP, good luck. keep us up to date with results.

- Have you picked your investment vehicle for the AOR?

Are you referring to the HYS accounts I will use?

Here is a quote from the bottom of the OP:

HYS accounts:
Currently using AmTrust
Plan to open a GMAC account after apps. Read they hard inquiry.

Wasn't too happy back when I opened the AmTrust account and found out they did a hard inquiry.

I open on to HYS suggestions.....or any suggestions to improve my AOR. The FDIC limit of $100,000 may be a factor in getting more than 2 HYS accounts.

lhendricks92 said: list is looking much better, but i have a few more suggestions.

i'm counting 3 citi cards which will report as personal cards. why not knock that down to 1 or 2 and add national city? (pick up the nat city biz while you're at it.)

also, you're missing some nice elan (us bank) biz cards: m&t, woodforest.

another tip about citi: you won't be able to reallocate that existing PP until you convert it to a card that reports the CL.

Some of your post is over my head.....but I am here to learn.

It would be 3 Citi personal cards if including my 1 current account. Is that what you meant?
Edit: I just realized you are probably referring to Citi Professional. I should probably move that card to my personal list to avoid confusion.
So I suppose the amount I apply for depends on the "convert" outcome?

National City sounds familiar, but don't see it on my list. Maybe it was a 6 month offer?? I will look to find it again. I have no issue including 6 month cards if it makes sense. My concern would be getting it to my HYS quick and having the amount large enough to not only exceed the BT fee, but also make the profit worth it.

I haven't heard of those US Bank cards....will search for that too.

Not sure what you mean by the last tip. I haven't heard of that rule. By "convert" are you saying to ask Citi to report the CL?

Snuffer said: lhendricks92 said: Nice job for incorporating all the excellent feedback from dolmar et al. I think people underestimate the importance of minimizing the number of personal accounts you add to your credit history to 1) keep FICO happy and 2) minimize adverse action. I often see AoRs where people reach their maximum total CL with an issuer, and the incremental personal application nets a tiny CL. I'd rather be denied than take the hit of a new useless card.
I tried some credit report services and a couple of them said my score (FAKO) would have been higher if I had more accounts. However, I don't want to surpass whatever that optimal number is.

Definitely want to avoid adverse action and that is one big reason why I started this thread. People have already filtered out what would have been a big mistake by me.

lhendricks92 said:
My suggestion for handling Barclays would be to apply for 1 personal and 1 business, and reallocate all but $500 to BankATL biz.

In general, I would use this same strategy (1 personal, 1 biz (maybe 2), reallocate to biz) as much as possible. You can do this with Chase and Citi, also.

Keep that BT debt hidden - good luck.
Excellent advice!! One of my phases before the actual BT was the reallocate phase. Your answer fills that nicely.

I think my only concern at this point is if I combine the CL's and only have the option to use a BT launder card then that card needs to have a high CL to take the BT. I recall in the past I have heard of issues in which an amount BT'ed to a card is greater than the CL therefore causing issues. Currently my largest CL is $21700 (business).

Definitely agree with keeping debt on the business when possible.

Thanks again. Also want to say I have learned a lot from your previous business card posts.

The Pen Fed Gold Card gave me a high limit and it was really easy. I think I even bumped it up later. Ask for 24,900. You can also do a partial (depending upon the terms) to a launder card and then do another one after the first is complete...

Snuffer said: It would be 3 Citi personal cards if including my 1 current account. Is that what you meant?
Edit: I just realized you are probably referring to Citi Professional. I should probably move that card to my personal list to avoid confusion.
So I suppose the amount I apply for depends on the "convert" outcome?


AT&T is citi. So, along with Platinum Select and Professional, that's 3 citi cards that will appear on your personal report. (Any card that reports to the personal CRAs is a personal card in my book.)

Snuffer said: National City sounds familiar, but don't see it on my list. Maybe it was a 6 month offer?? I will look to find it again. I have no issue including 6 month cards if it makes sense. My concern would be getting it to my HYS quick and having the amount large enough to not only exceed the BT fee, but also make the profit worth it.

yes, they're no fee 6 month offers. People have reported requesting BT checks payable to themselves, at least with Nat City personal.

Snuffer said: I haven't heard of those US Bank cards....will search for that too.

Look in my thread for the Elan M&T biz card.

Snuffer said: Not sure what you mean by the last tip. I haven't heard of that rule. By "convert" are you saying to ask Citi to report the CL?

The PremierPass card is a "no preset spending limit" card, which is why it doesn't report the CL and also why it's a pain in the butt to reallocate. If you ask them to convert (I chose a Dividend MasterCard), you will overcome both of those limitations. You'll get a new card with a new account number, but you shouldn't lose the account history or age.

gatsu said: Correct me if I'm wrong but there is a BT fee now for Baylor with no cap.

NOOOOOOOO!

oh well, here's a replacement.

lhendricks92 said:
New accounts hurt your average credit age and a bunch all at once often freaks out the issuers. That FAKO advice to open some more accounts is suspect at best. I've read that having a "mix" of types of accounts: real estate, revolving (e.g., credit cards), and installment (e.g., car loan) can help, but just adding more credit card accounts can only hurt your score, at least in the short term.

Good point. I should gradually get cards on the personal side and focus more on business cards. Not just to hide debt, but for your reasons above. Now I am leaning more towards only a maximum of one per issuer on the personal side. Being greedy can derail my credit for future plans.

lhendricks92 said:
You can overpay your Citi Premier Pass and request a credit balance refund. Or, you can use one of your new no-fee-BT Citi cards with a high CL to launder other cards.

lhendricks92 said: The PremierPass card is a "no preset spending limit" card, which is why it doesn't report the CL and also why it's a pain in the butt to reallocate. If you ask them to convert (I chose a Dividend MasterCard), you will overcome both of those limitations. You'll get a new card with a new account number, but you shouldn't lose the account history or age.

I have just sent a message to Citi asking about converting the card. I asked some questions to verify with them the points you said above and also ask if it results in a hard inquiry. I wouldn't want a hard inquiry just before my AOR.

PS- Someone PM'ed me to let me know there is an issue with the https links in my OP. Those have now been corrected.

Have you considered this card from National City?

It has 0% on BT for 12 months.

Snuffer said: I don't think they answered any of my questions. Is this normal for them?
Completely normal. I predict that if you follow up, they will ask you to call in and speak with a csr.

markkundinger said: I also live in CA, and got a woodforest card no problem.

Most of the elan cards are identical though, so you could get one from any of a variety of banks. In my case, my parents live right next to a branch so I recognized the name.

Maybe I am missing something or found the wrong link.

Did you get your Woodforest card via internet app?

markkundinger said: Oh snap. They changed their site design to ask for state first!

Well, if you want an Elan card, I'd recommend looking at the big list on the massive-o-rama topic.


Last Monday I went through Elan cards and found a business and personal to add to the AOR that had no BT fee and a 6 month 0% BT each. I was going to add it to my AOR list, but I just looked again and noticed it no longer says no BT fee....now there is an uncapped BT fee.

I commented in my OP about a post saying Discover processes business and personal together. I found another post that says this too. So I am thinking I should remove the personal card from my AOR list. Right now I have a Discover personal card. Any thoughts?

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jleung said: I guess Discover only allows you to apply one personal card at one time. Anyway, there is no need to apply multiple cards from them. If they approve you, they will just take some CL away from your existing cards. This applies to business CC as well. When I got my Discover business CC approved, they just took some CL from my personal card.

I may look into this for my AOR list.

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lhendricks92 said: i'm especially interested in your experiences with some of the off-the-beaten-path issuers on your list: Compass Bank, BB&T, Vectra Bank, etc.

This is something I have been thinking about regarding the timing of executing the AOR. Traditionally I have read it is best to do it early to mid-week, early in the morning so it is during east coast business hours. However, I have also read that the completed apps instant go to the reporting agency and this is why it is best to submit your favorite cards first.

I thought one reason for the AOR is to flood the apps so the issuers don't have the full picture of every card applied for making it more likely to get approved. This was one reason for the early morning submission of apps. What I am getting at is, are there any significant advantages to doing this early morning or can I just do it at anytime (day of week, time of day)?

I am about ready to pull the trigger on this AOR. As always, I am open to any AOR list corrections/suggestions.