This is phase 2 of our second big AOR. Please check out the Part 1 WOR for deatils on the previous round and a little history.
Our goal is to get more 0% money to replace the money we’ve had to pay back as the previous offers expired and carry the balances to new heights, heavily leveraging business cards and existing lines; as well as trying out some new lenders and picking up some bonuses along the way where possible.
We are trying to hit up as many as possible while staying within the maximum number of applications per lender.
I would love feedback on the plan and or any great offers that I may have overlooked. Here's my scenario:
HHI: $140K (with income from WOR I may report 155 now) AGE: early 30s Mortgage (my name only) 3rd year of 30 balance = $224K Auto Loan (my name only) 3rd year of 5 balance = $17K Credit Scores (TU(inquiries) / EXP(inquiries) / EQ(inquiries)) : 788(0) / 770(7) /796(1) (10/14/07) See below for credit score impact and resulting inquiries
My Existing lines (unfortunately I've closed tons of unused lines in the past and actually many times requested credit line reductions. . . at least things are looking up now ):
Results - In Order Applied chase business - deferred / Approved - $9K chase GM Bus - deferred / Approved - $9K chase Home Improvement - Approved - $12.5K Advanta - deferred / Approved - 12.5K - called about a raise up. . . 5-30 days. . .no bump unless you fill out and submit crazy docs. Too much trouble to bother Upromise - deferred / Approved $7.5K Citi Business - deferred / Approved $7.5K Citi Prof - deferred / Declined - Already have the maximum number of cards of this type allowed - I already have a professional card BoA - Approved $8K - called about a raise up but they would only reallocate. No worries though an ACH to checking is on its way BoA Platinum Bus - deferred / Approved $13.5K Nat Park - deferred / Approved - $5K (fine since I already have 31 with them) Bank Atlantic Bus - deferred / Approved - $10K-->$50K . . .ugh. Called and submitted docs to support request for $50K Boost to 50K!!! NEA - deferred / Approved - $5K -- Took a while - showed up on BoA account list 11/14 still don't have a card AMEX CHI - deferred / Approved - $5K HSBC - deferred / Approved - $21K - Was on hold apparently missing my phone number Citi Bus PP - deferred / Declined - too many applications Citi Home - deferred / Declined - Too many recent credit inquiries were recorded on your credit bureau report Disc Bus - deferred / Approved $10.9KK Disc Miles - deferred / Approved $8K Life Spring Nat City - deferred / Approved - $12.5K - they accidentally closed this line (explains why I still haven't received a card) I talked ot them today and they will try to reopen and get back to me. They have corrected this and are sending the card 53 Bank - deferred / Approved - $15K - Called about increase and was told it could only be done in a branch but could be done. Online/phone must wait 6 months. The downside. . .no branch near me Principal - deferred / Declined - "Excessive Credit Reporting Agency Inquiries" GE - deferred / Declined - Too Many inquiried in the last 6 months!! lasalle - deferred / Approved - $5K - This took almost 4 weeks to be approved and arrive RBS - deferred / Declined - "Unable to verify credit references as provided" - Turns out this actually means too many inquiries Nat City Bus - deferred / Approved - Turns out they never got my faxed signed application resubmitted it today. Think they will go for a 38th credit pull? ESPN - deferred / Approved - $10K Peoples - deferred / Declined - "Unable to verify credit references as provided" - Turns out this actually means too many inquiries wachovia - bagged - no go not existing customer nat city pers - deferred / Approved after phone confirmation $12.5K (said they saw all the apps and I should have called them first. They could've given me a higher limit if I had called and talked to them) Vectra - deferred / Declined - "Out of service area" US Bank Phone - deferred / Declined - "Located outside of defined trade area" - Update - they only have two products avilable in FL Harley Davidson and NWA (not the rap group) BBT - bagged - no online app - interestingly just learned that there is a branch about 700 yards from my house in a direction I haven't been in a while. Oh well, maybe next time. commerce - skipped Chase Marriott Bus - deferred / Declined? Chase Marriott Pers - deferred / Approved - $25K AMEXDelta - deferred / Approved - $50K AMEX SPG - deferred / Approved - $50K Citi AA MC - deferred Declined Citi AA Bus - Approved $20K Sony - deferred / Declined GAP - deferred / Approved after phone conversation/verification - UGH $400. . . they must not want to sell me a lot of clothes Target - Approved - $300 - ugh!! I can't even buy a sale 32" LCD with that. . . AMEX Gold TD - skipped because the offer changed and no longer included 25K points. Could have done another gold app but given recent FR with AMEX I though 3 new card was probably enough.
TrueCredit Credit Scores Before and After Credit Scores (TU(inquiries) / EXP(inquiries) / EQ(inquiries)) :
Inquiries: PEOPLES 10/24/2007 Equifax NCBK-NCCS 10/24/2007 TransUnion FNB OMAHA 10/23/2007 Experian BANK OF AMERICA 10/23/2007 Experian INFIBANK 10/23/2007 Experian AMEX 10/23/2007 Experian ZIONS MANAGMENT SRVC C 10/23/2007 Experian CHASE 10/23/2007 Equifax FIRST USA 10/23/2007 Equifax ADVANTA 10/23/2007 Equifax CITI 10/23/2007 Equifax CBUSA/CBSD 10/23/2007 Equifax CITI USA 10/23/2007 Equifax FIA CSNA 10/23/2007 Equifax HSBC NV 10/23/2007 Equifax CITI 10/23/2007 Equifax GEMB/GEMON 10/23/2007 Equifax RBS CC 10/23/2007 Equifax TARGET NB 10/23/2007 Equifax GEMB/GAP 10/23/2007 TransUnion NCBK-NCCS 10/23/2007 TransUnion WASHMTL/PROV 10/23/2007 TransUnion DISCOVER FIN 10/23/2007 TransUnion BRCLYSBANKDE 10/23/2007 TransUnion BRCLYSBANKDE 10/23/2007 TransUnion
I’ve put a lot of work (although there is still some presentation cleanup needed in the list above) and research into this so far as hopefully evidenced in "Part 1" but now I am hoping for feedback on the part 2 proposal especially on the smaller issuer cards that are a little more questionable. I’m sure you guys and gals have some great ideas, other don’t miss deals, or thoughts that will help this be as successful as "Part 1".
I am also trying to figure out which of two options to go with in a couple cases. I have reasons for questioning the preference but don't want to sway opinions so I will save them for now. A HUGE Thanks to anyone's links or text that I've incorporated. Lots of these links came from you guys. I also need to add cardselection.com links for a few of them.
Thanks in advance for your help!! I'll continue to update as I can and refine as we go. Hopefully we all learn something in the process and leave some good info for those who follow in our footsteps.
Thanks for the extensive list! I'm planning an AOR shortly and would be very interested to see the results - including which CRA are being pulled and what you put for business income/years in business. Nice zeroed-out utilization - might not happen for me before the AOR, but carrying a balance may actually be helpful - if you don't show any balances, would the banks think you need "balance transfers"? Also, what about requesting BT with app vs. waiting until it's approved? Found your other thread very helpful too.
This is phase 2 of our second big AOR. Please check out the Part 1 WOR for deatils on the previous round and a little history.
Our goal is to get more 0% money to replace the money we’ve had to pay back as the previous offers expired and carry the balances to new heights, heavily leveraging business cards and existing lines; as well as trying out some new lenders and picking up some bonuses along the way where possible.
We are trying to hit up as many as possible while staying within the maximum number of applications per lender.
I would love feedback on the plan and or any great offers that I may have overlooked. Here's my scenario:
HHI: $140K (with income from WOR I may report 155 now) AGE: early 30s Mortgage (my name only) 3rd year of 30 balance = $224K Auto Loan (my name only) 3rd year of 5 balance = $17K Credit Scores (TU(inquiries) / EXP(inquiries) / EQ(inquiries)) : 788(0) / 770(7) /796(1) (10/14/07) See below for credit score impact and resulting inquiries
My Existing lines (unfortunately I've closed tons of unused lines in the past and actually many times requested credit line reductions. . . at least things are looking up now ):
I’ve put a lot of work (although there is still some presentation cleanup needed in the list above) and research into this so far as hopefully evidenced in "Part 1" but now I am hoping for feedback on the part 2 proposal especially on the smaller issuer cards that are a little more questionable. I’m sure you guys and gals have some great ideas, other don’t miss deals, or thoughts that will help this be as successful as "Part 1".
I am also trying to figure out which of two options to go with in a couple cases. I have reasons for questioning the preference but don't want to sway opinions so I will save them for now. A HUGE Thanks to anyone's links or text that I've incorporated. Lots of these links came from you guys. I also need to add cardoffers links for a few of them.
Thanks in advance for your help!! I'll continue to update as I can and refine as we go. Hopefull we all learn something in the process and leave some good info for those who follow in our footsteps.
Thisguy
DjPiLL
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 3:55a
Good luck man! I will definitely be keeping an eye on this thread.
DjPiLL
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 3:59a
Economist said: Thanks for the extensive list! I'm planning an AOR shortly and would be very interested to see the results - including which CRA are being pulled and what you put for business income/years in business. Nice zeroed-out utilization - might not happen for me before the AOR, but carrying a balance may actually be helpful - if you don't show any balances, would the banks think you need "balance transfers"? Also, what about requesting BT with app vs. waiting until it's approved? Found your other thread very helpful too.
Don't worry if you are carrying a balance. On my AOR (you can search for it in the threads here)... I carried a 24k Citi credit card balance and got over 300k in new lines. If your credit profile is good... you will do well.
No conclusive data, though I believe most people enjoyed better success with cardselection.com versus cardoffers.com. I've only used the former and had no problems on my last A-O-R with a fat $300+ bonus from them. It took about 5.5 weeks to arrive.
I'm going to mirror your A-O-R soon. We have lots of stats in common - can't wait to see how yours turns out.
[edit] I would echo the prior poster's comments on the outstanding balance. I had near 48% utilization when I did my 7/31/07 A-O-R, which resulted in 100% approval (~18 apps).
extra5
New Member
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 7:08a
Try this link for Discover for Small Business. It has an 18 month BT period. It is better than the 12 months for the card you have listed. I found the link here on Fat Wallet a few days ago.
Close your advanta account a couple days prior - then you can apply for their 0% 16-month offer. Going rate for new credit lines from them seems to be about $12500.
Your show has been renewed for the Fall Season....
The way that I've gone with [mini] AOR has been to start the AOR about 1-2 months before the expiration of BT promotional period so I have an easy/clean place to BT money for those issuers that give a hard time BTing (is that a word? ) to a bank account instead of waiting until after the expiration of the promotional BT offer period.
Let's see if you can beat "Deal or No Deal" ...
kjgco
Senior Member - 1K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 8:40a
Are you sure about the T&C on the B of A Biz card? I read it as 0% for 9 mos and no cap on the BT fee. (FWIW, my DW did get a targeted offer for 0% 12mos. no fee on this card a few months back.) Good luck!
I did both and got $10K EACH. Any reason to only do one?
[edit] PS. FYI, I consolidated the Chase GM biz, Chase Biz Rebate Visa, Amazon.com biz Visa, and the Chevy Chase Biz card into the Chase Platinum biz Visa b/c it came with a BT check.
I did both and got $10K EACH. Any reason to only do one?
[edit] PS. FYI, I consolidated the Chase GM biz, Chase Biz Rebate Visa, Amazon.com biz Visa, and the Chevy Chase Biz card into the Chase Platinum biz Visa b/c it came with a check.
Definitely try for two. Chase gave me TWO 25k business cards (one Cash Rewards and one United Miles). However my wife tried for two and only got one (she got the Cash Rewards but denied on the GM Business).
Doesn't hurt to ask!
markkundinger
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 9:53a
- When I read the fine print on both the BofA business card and the GEMB card, I see no mention of a cap on the BT fee.
- I think applying for at least two Chase business cards is probably worth a shot. However, I notice you also have a Chase Biz Marriott in there, so that plus a 0% card is probably enough.
- you seem to be hearing the siren song of FNBO and Infibank... good luck.
- You might be tapping Citibank too hard. I count 4 personal apps and 3 business. And no professional card? WTF?
- The USAA results ought to be interesting (they are usually friendly with credit lines). Bear in mind that once in a while they freak out and close accounts.
- Note that the People's United Bank card is serviced by RBS. I've usually been drawn to the Kroger RBS card, because the BT is a full 12 months, and since RBS didn't allow reallocation between my regular RBS card and the Kroger, there was really no downside in applying for it first. Course, I can't guarantee that reallocation isn't possible between PUB and RBS cards.
And finally, I'd like to be a wet blanket and recommend that you tamper your expectations just a bit. You're obviously going to get a big wad of credit for this, but I think the odds are against getting the $500k that you got in the wife-o-rama... that might have been a lightning-strikes-once kind of thing.
lhendricks92
Senior Member - 1K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 10:10a
USAA will stay happy as long as you don't use them for credit-balance laundry shenanigans.
God speed. Hope your AOR turns out as well as your wifes!
With HSBC, just do one app (it looks like that is your plan). If you get a whopping $600 CL (quite likely), call them and complain to the credit department (NOT CSR's they can't help). My pops went from $600cl to 12k CL with a phone call.
For National City, MAKE SURE TO REQUEST A GIANT BT ON THE APP. I know they give up to 35k CL for thier 6 mo business card, so you need to request that 35k BT on the app. If you don't, you will get much lower. For the personal card with them (6 mo), CL's will go to 25k, so request a 24k BT (worry about utilization later). Even if you don't get these huge limits up front (I bet you will if you request the BT's on the apps), then make sure you call and speak to their credit department and tell them you want a massive BT, they are VERY VERY BT hungry and will give great CL's. On 4 cards from them, my family has over 100k of CL from national city.
lhendricks92
Senior Member - 1K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 10:40a
markkundinger said: - When I read the fine print on both the BofA business card and the GEMB card, I see no mention of a cap on the BT fee.
Man, I hate when the promo page conflicts with the actual T&C page.
GE Money promo page says "A Transaction Fee for each Balance Transfer that posts to your Account will be charged equal to the greater of $5.00 or 3% of the amount of the Balance Transfer, but no more than $75.00."
If you hit the apply button, the T&C doesn't even mention the promotional 0% rate, and BT fees are uncapped.
markkundinger said: - When I read the fine print on both the BofA business card and the GEMB card, I see no mention of a cap on the BT fee.I've got the GE card, and did a BT about 3 months ago and it is an uncapped 3% balance transfer fee and they would notcap it. (I didn't then see any different promo). However, If you take a screenshot of thier promo page now showing a cap, and they do end up charging you, they would be obligated to cap it to $75. Just make sure you take a screenshot.
#27... Wells Fargo requires existing account relationship. Once with them, you can ACH directly to any checking account (just like BOA). A nice laundry card... Also, credit line increase requests with Wells Fargo are only taken after 9 months to avoid a hard pull. you could go sooner if you can afford a hard.
BTW... MikeR397 is the only golden child to have ever gotten an "adequate" credit line with the HSBC folks (albeit on behalf of his father). YMMV... good luck
markkundinger
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 15, 2007 @ 2:32p
Mike had to fight for his CL... but one other AOR got a decent ($8k-$12k) approval with their unsolicited HSBC app. Not impossible, just unlikely.
And I hadn't read the GEMB card's promo page... since it says right there that it's a $75 cap, I'd go for it, then fight them tooth and nail if they try to welsh.
MikeR397 said: For National City, MAKE SURE TO REQUEST A GIANT BT ON THE APP. I know they give up to 35k CL for thier 6 mo business card, so you need to request that 35k BT on the app. If you don't, you will get much lower.
Not necessarily true. I did not do a BT with the app and they gave me $50K for biz. But denied me completely for personal. Go figure.
Economist said: if you don't show any balances, would the banks think you need "balance transfers"? Also, what about requesting BT with app vs. waiting until it's approved? Found your other thread very helpful too.
The zero balance thing was more a factor of my offers expiring and finishing off forced BTs as part of the WOR.
extra5 said: Try this link for Discover for Small Business. It has an 18 month BT period. It is better than the 12 months for the card you have listed. I found the link here on Fat Wallet a few days ago.
Great! Assuming they give me a decent line this would be worth $75 for an extra 6 months. I left both links in the list though as 12 months with no fee might be more valuable for some. Thanks!
Glitch99 said: Close your advanta account a couple days prior - then you can apply for their 0% 16-month offer. Going rate for new credit lines from them seems to be about $12500.
Should I give up my existing relationship with them. I guess as a business account it is not affecting my average account age since htey are not reporting it right?
kjgco said: Are you sure about the T&C on the B of A Biz card? I read it as 0% for 9 mos and no cap on the BT fee. (FWIW, my DW did get a targeted offer for 0% 12mos. no fee on this card a few months back.) Good luck!
You're correct the link is now as you read it and I changed the app over to the platinum rewards plus link that gives 2K bonus points.
Actually for my WOR the link was 12 months but there was a BT fee. What I did was use the card to fund a new citi cavings account with $24K (had a $25K limit). This actually worked out beautifully as it went through a purchase and got no fee applied even better was that I got 24K rewards points for the transfer and adding the existing 1K bonus with the card I was able to exchange the 25K points for an extra $250 statement credit. I am going to try for this again.
I did both and got $10K EACH. Any reason to only do one?
[edit] PS. FYI, I consolidated the Chase GM biz, Chase Biz Rebate Visa, Amazon.com biz Visa, and the Chevy Chase Biz card into the Chase Platinum biz Visa b/c it came with a BT check.
Thanks for all the info and links. Good stuff. I guess I could go for both. I thought I would leave one around for a future AOR but maybe I'll just go for it. I guess account age doesn't matter for business cards right?
markkundinger said: Mike had to fight for his CL... but one other AOR got a decent ($8k-$12k) approval with their unsolicited HSBC app. Not impossible, just unlikely.
And I hadn't read the GEMB card's promo page... since it says right there that it's a $75 cap, I'd go for it, then fight them tooth and nail if they try to welsh.
I have an HSBC card already I got $10,500 when I applied. I figured same on the GE app. The internal terms don't show it but the offer page sure does. I was going to print it out but with as many apps as I'm looking at perhaps I should just save the hassle and let this one go?
thisguy said: Thanks for all the info and links. Good stuff. I guess I could go for both. I thought I would leave one around for a future AOR but maybe I'll just go for it. I guess account age doesn't matter for business cards right?Right. Plus, I believe (or maybe want to believe) that closed biz cards can be reapplied for again in future A-O-Rs. With my five closed Chase biz cards, I'm hoping to do the exact same thing again for another $50K in CL.
markkundinger said: - why are you hating on the sony card? I already have one. Can I get a second? or should I cancel my existing and apply for another?
markkundinger said: - you seem to be hearing the siren song of FNBO and Infibank... good luck. Que? Is there something I should know?
markkundinger said: - You might be tapping Citibank too hard. I count 4 personal apps and 3 business. And no professional card? WTF? No Pro because again I already have one. Should I be dropping and re-applying? This one does report for me. I can see it on my credit report I think that some might be denied but I am not sure if they treat partner cards differently. It doesn't bother me if a couple don't get through but I will apply to the most important ones first. Should it bother me???
markkundinger said: - The USAA results ought to be interesting (they are usually friendly with credit lines). Bear in mind that once in a while they freak out and close accounts. I've had great success with them for WOR currently $40K/$60K on an AMEX card BT. We'll see how it goes.
markkundinger said: - Note that the People's United Bank card is serviced by RBS. I've usually been drawn to the Kroger RBS card, because the BT is a full 12 months, and since RBS didn't allow reallocation between my regular RBS card and the Kroger, there was really no downside in applying for it first. Course, I can't guarantee that reallocation isn't possible between PUB and RBS cards. The Kroger link is now uncapped 3% for BT, otherwise I would have been going after that one. If anyone has a Kroger offer that is still uncapped I'd be glad to go for it.
markkundinger said: And finally, I'd like to be a wet blanket and recommend that you tamper your expectations just a bit. You're obviously going to get a big wad of credit for this, but I think the odds are against getting the $500k that you got in the wife-o-rama... that might have been a lightning-strikes-once kind of thing. Meh. . . sure but I can always hope
thisguy said: Glitch99 said: Close your advanta account a couple days prior - then you can apply for their 0% 16-month offer. Going rate for new credit lines from them seems to be about $12500.
Should I give up my existing relationship with them. I guess as a business account it is not affecting my average account age since htey are not reporting it right?Your existing relationship with them is pretty much worthless, and is only keeping you from taking advantage of one of the better promo offers currently out there. Worst consequence is you'll have to register a new login name for online access. So put that relationship in the 'what have you done for me lately?' category and end it.
thisguy said: Another question on filling in apps. Is roboform a good solution? What do you guys use to speed things up and/or save your finger tips? I can't imagine living without Roboform. That said, you have to check carefully after it fills out a form for you. It saves a good amount of typing, but you still have to manually read each field and often erase extraneous info liker you name 3-4 times under additional cardholders.
Among its useful features for an APR, you can define custom form fields like mother's maiden name, (household) income, employer, etc.
Rorer714
Senior Member
posted: Oct. 16, 2007 @ 2:02a
thisguy said: extra5 said: Try this link for Discover for Small Business. It has an 18 month BT period. It is better than the 12 months for the card you have listed. I found the link here on Fat Wallet a few days ago.
Great! Assuming they give me a decent line this would be worth $75 for an extra 6 months. I left both links in the list though as 12 months with no fee might be more valuable for some. Thanks! The rates and fees show 3%, 75 max for your 12mo no fee link. Am I missing something?
markkundinger
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 16, 2007 @ 2:53a
TG, you can get multiple Chase Sony and CitiProfessional cards. I personally tend to close the duplicate card before applying for another, but plenty of FWFers have multiples of each.
FNBO and Infibank (which is owned by FNBO) have a tendency to cancel acceptances when they see a lot of inquiries on a CR. A few FWFers have gotten cards through them, but I'd say more have been denied.
Sorry I gave you out of date info on the Kroger card.
Rorer714 said: thisguy said: extra5 said: Try this link for Discover for Small Business. It has an 18 month BT period. It is better than the 12 months for the card you have listed. I found the link here on Fat Wallet a few days ago.
Great! Assuming they give me a decent line this would be worth $75 for an extra 6 months. I left both links in the list though as 12 months with no fee might be more valuable for some. Thanks! The rates and fees show 3%, 75 max for your 12mo no fee link. Am I missing something?
18 months - I am in. I though I heard someone say that Discover business shows on you personal report??
PS - I was able to bump up the crappy capone miles redemption (earned at 1 mile per dollar) from .5% (if I had redeemed for a check) to 1% (by redeeming for reimbursement of two $150 hotel purchases charged on the cap one card.)
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