Thank you for your response. I plan on paying down most of my principal within the 5 yr period, so that is the reason I was focused on 5yr Easy Orange. I will look into Penfed too.
What it will actually do is put cold, hard settlement money into millions of homeowners' pockets and reduce payments in many cases.
It will accelerate foreclosures to clean out inventory and speed up short sales to get past the big logjam for underwater home sales.
And it will give the banks, like it or not, a real break in what had become a gigantic expense: legal fees. These have actually hurt the bottom line for years now. sailwind said: robertshamie said: This Mortgage Settlement Is a Big Deal
robertshamie said: What it will actually do is put cold, hard settlement money into millions of homeowners' pockets and reduce payments in many cases.
It will accelerate foreclosures to clean out inventory and speed up short sales to get past the big logjam for underwater home sales.
And it will give the banks, like it or not, a real break in what had become a gigantic expense: legal fees. These have actually hurt the bottom line for years now. sailwind said: robertshamie said: This Mortgage Settlement Is a Big Deal
Big deal for who? Sure as hell not us who pay our mortgage on time.
Are you serious. Do you really believe that or is getting more business transactions all you care about. And Jim Cramer as a reference? You're losing what little credibility you have.
This does not help the foreclosure problem that we have. It masks it, delays it, and will end up prolonging the recovery longer than it will naturally heal.
First, I would like to say this is an open forum and everyone is entitled to their own opinion without having their credibility questioned. I’ve been in this industry for a decade and paid my dues. I’ve been a VP of a Mortgage Bank for the last 6 years and track markets closely every day. I’ve won numerous awards over the years and currently lead a top producing team of seasoned loan officers, underwriters, closers, funders and processors. Jim Cramer is a market commentator for TheStreet and CNBC. He is co-founder of the TheStreet. The Street is a publisher. Cramer graduated magna cum laude from Harvard where he was the President of The Harvard Crimson. After receiving his JD in 1984 from Harvard Law School, he joined Goldman Sachs, where he working in sales and trading. In 1987, he left Goldman to start his own hedge fund. While he worked at his fund, Cramer helped start Money for Dow Jones and then in 1996, he founded TheStreet.com. I think we are both credible sources. I've personally followed Cramer for the last 5 years and his opinions are dead on the money at least 80% of the time. Unlike most commentators, he puts his reputation on the line by expressing his opinion. What exactly are your qualifications as an expert here?
To answer your question; Yes, I really do believe that an out of court settlement helps everyone. This is the first big step to putting this terrible mess behind us and beginning the healing process. One of the reasons that banks delay in making decisions on foreclosures and short sales is the unknown and difficult to quantify legal expense of the whole ordeal. With that variable removed from the equation, they will be more likely to take losses and move on. Moreover, their legal counsel and internal staff were so busy handling these robo-signing issues. I’m sure this put a delay on the approval of short sales and foreclosures causing a further decline in real estate values. I see this every day when appraisals come in all over the country.
While I’m optimistic and wish for an economic recovery led by an increase in real estate values, my posting of this article had nothing to do with “getting more business”. I simply felt that it was newsworthy and might help forum members keep up with current events in our industry.
I don’t see any merit or factual basis for your statement in which you indicate that out of court settlement with the 5 largest banks in the country will “…….not help the foreclosure problem that we have. It masks it, delays it, and will end up prolonging the recovery longer than it will naturally heal.” Perhaps you might enlighten all of us………….. on what factual or expert basis have you arrived at this conclusion?
sailwind said: robertshamie said: What it will actually do is put cold, hard settlement money into millions of homeowners' pockets and reduce payments in many cases.
It will accelerate foreclosures to clean out inventory and speed up short sales to get past the big logjam for underwater home sales.
And it will give the banks, like it or not, a real break in what had become a gigantic expense: legal fees. These have actually hurt the bottom line for years now. sailwind said: robertshamie said: This Mortgage Settlement Is a Big Deal
Big deal for who? Sure as hell not us who pay our mortgage on time.
Are you serious. Do you really believe that or is getting more business transactions all you care about. And Jim Cramer as a reference? You're losing what little credibility you have.
This does not help the foreclosure problem that we have. It masks it, delays it, and will end up prolonging the recovery longer than it will naturally heal.
For more granularity, the ponying-up consists of Ally/GMAC ($310 mil), BofA ($11.8 billion), Citi ($2.2 billion), JP Morgan ($5.3 billion), and Wells Fargo ($5.4 billion) for $25 billion. Servicers will likely provide up to an estimated $32 billion in direct homeowner relief. There will be $4.2 billion paid directly to the states and $750 million to the federal government. In addition, a comprehensive set of new standards will be implemented to protect homeowners from future abuses and an independent monitor will be appointed to ensure servicer compliance. HUD Secretary Shaun Donovan has also commented that the total cost may increase to $45bn if additional banks sign onto the settlement deal.
Of course this does little to stop future lawsuits against these piñatas of the financial world. Nothing in the agreement grants any immunity from criminal offenses and will not affect criminal prosecutions. The agreement does not prevent homeowners or investors from pursuing individual, institutional or class action civil cases against the five servicers. The pact also enables state attorneys general and federal agencies to investigate and pursue other aspects of the mortgage crisis, including securities cases. The settlement only covers servicer liability for robo-signing and improper mortgage servicing. Notably, it does not cover any wrongdoings associated with mortgage securitizations, MERS, or any criminal liability.
"Because of the complexity of the mortgage market and this agreement, which will span a three year period, borrowers in some cases may be contacted directly by one of the five included mortgage servicers regarding loan modification offers, may be contacted by a settlement administrator or their state attorney general, or may need to contact their mortgage servicer to obtain more information about specific programs and whether their loan qualifies. More information will be made available as the settlement programs are implemented."
Barclays Capital broke down the numbers. $17 billion will come in the form of principal reductions on first and second lien mortgages ($10 billion), forbearance modifications, and costs to facilitate short sales. Principal reductions will not be applied to any loans in agency MBS trusts, and for principal reductions on non-agency loans or in bank portfolios, the servicer must determine that the modification results in a higher NPV than foreclosing on the home. $3 billion of the settlement cost will come in the form of refinancings for borrowers who are current on their mortgage payments but underwater. $1.5 billion, per Barclays, will be used to provide immediate cash payments of up to $2,000 to borrowers who lost their homes to foreclosure between January 1, 2008 and December 31, 2011.
The modifications, refinancings, and borrower payments outlined in the settlement will be performed over three years, with 75% of each bank's target required to be reached within two years. Servicers will identify borrowers eligible for these benefits over the next six to nine months. Banks that fall short of their settlement targets by the deadlines will be assessed cash penalties. Joseph Smith, the former North Carolina Commissioner of Banks, has been selected as a third party monitor to provide oversight of the participating bank servicers.
As part of the settlement, the participating banks will be required to comply with new servicing standards, most of which likely have already been implemented or are in the process of being incorporated into standard servicing procedures. (They are too numerous to repeat here.)
robertshamie said: First, I would like to say this is an open forum and everyone is entitled to their own opinion without having their credibility questioned. I’ve been in this industry for a decade and paid my dues. I’ve been a VP of a Mortgage Bank for the last 6 years and track markets closely every day. I’ve won numerous awards over the years and currently lead a top producing team of seasoned loan officers, underwriters, closers, funders and processors. Jim Cramer is a market commentator for TheStreet and CNBC. He is co-founder of the TheStreet. The Street is a publisher. Cramer graduated magna cum laude from Harvard where he was the President of The Harvard Crimson. After receiving his JD in 1984 from Harvard Law School, he joined Goldman Sachs, where he working in sales and trading. In 1987, he left Goldman to start his own hedge fund. While he worked at his fund, Cramer helped start Money for Dow Jones and then in 1996, he founded TheStreet.com. I think we are both credible sources. I've personally followed Cramer for the last 5 years and his opinions are dead on the money at least 80% of the time. Unlike most commentators, he puts his reputation on the line by expressing his opinion. What exactly are your qualifications as an expert here?
I'm sure he's a smart guy, but currently he serves as an entertainer, not an informer. http://youtu.be/gUkbdjetlY8
I couldnt disagree more. The question in the video was if the caller should get his money out in terms of liquidity. He was talking about his Bear account. People were attacking him because they aren't knowledgeable about financial terminology, anyone who understands what Bear Sterns is (an investment bank) understood what that question meant and what he was saying. He was saying not to take your money out of Bear accounts--NOT the stock.
I prefer to give credit to Cramer for calling the top and bottom during the crisis. That more than makes up for this Bear Stearns (even if he was wrong).
If I were to post all the things that he was right about, there would not be room here to do so...........
Dynastar454 said: robertshamie said: First, I would like to say this is an open forum and everyone is entitled to their own opinion without having their credibility questioned. I’ve been in this industry for a decade and paid my dues. I’ve been a VP of a Mortgage Bank for the last 6 years and track markets closely every day. I’ve won numerous awards over the years and currently lead a top producing team of seasoned loan officers, underwriters, closers, funders and processors. Jim Cramer is a market commentator for TheStreet and CNBC. He is co-founder of the TheStreet. The Street is a publisher. Cramer graduated magna cum laude from Harvard where he was the President of The Harvard Crimson. After receiving his JD in 1984 from Harvard Law School, he joined Goldman Sachs, where he working in sales and trading. In 1987, he left Goldman to start his own hedge fund. While he worked at his fund, Cramer helped start Money for Dow Jones and then in 1996, he founded TheStreet.com. I think we are both credible sources. I've personally followed Cramer for the last 5 years and his opinions are dead on the money at least 80% of the time. Unlike most commentators, he puts his reputation on the line by expressing his opinion. What exactly are your qualifications as an expert here?
I'm sure he's a smart guy, but currently he serves as an entertainer, not an informer. http://youtu.be/gUkbdjetlY8
1. Do you have any opinion/idea as to how much of the settlement dollars actually represents simply nominal recognition of mortgage liabilities that the banks would have ultimately had to write down anyway? E.g. BofA's nominal participation is $11.8 billion. But if we assume $10 billion of that would have had to have been written off the books anyway, as unsecured/uncollectable debt from judgment-proof deadbeat homemoaners, then in reality the settlement is only "costing" BofA 1.8 billion, not 11.8 billion.
2. Moral hazard issue--the only homemoaners who will be pocketing cash are the worst offenders, only a small fraction of whom could actually be characterized as "victims of TFTF banks."
Is it customary for the bank to offer a home equity credit line at the same time as the mortgage commitment? Ours did, at prime with a floor of 3.75%. I don't anticipate needing it anytime soon though, so don't know whether to take it or pass. The only downsides I can see are an inactivity fee, avoidable if I use it once every 12 months, and having it show up on my credit report and I'm not sure if that's a positive or negative on my score. The rate looks pretty attractive but I'm inclined to pass since I didn't ask for it and don't need it right now.
As long as you're not being forced into it, it's not a big deal, but just consider the issues that could arise later if you take it.
You will have to subordinate this lien for future refi's and there's a cost and lengthier time for this. if you draw on it, and it eats into your LTV, even if you subordinate the heloc, it could mean higher rates. If you draw on it, and try to roll into a refi, it'll be a cash out refi and that can = higher fees and/or rate.
That said, there are some pros to heloc's too. One of my old account reps for HELOCs used to say, "nobody wants them when they can get them, and nobody can get them when they need one badly".
MortgageManNJ said: This is my once-a-month update on what to follow for mortgage rates: remember the rates are primarily based on the mortgage backed securities, not on the 10 yr treasury. 10 yr is down 17/32 (yield from 1.99 to 2.05) - however the MBS market is only down -5/32 which is why there is very little price worsening to mortgage rates today. And it is usually (not always) and inverse relationship: MBS market improves = rates drop (and vice versa).
MMNJ
MMNJ, while this is absolutely true, are there any free links for the layman (non mortgage professional) to easily access a live feed of the 30 and 15 MBS (without a paid subscription)? While the 10 yr is not the direct leading indicator it is easily accesible for someone to watch that trend on CNBC. While it is not the true MBS data, many of my clients find comfort in flipping on CNBC to get a feel for trends. If there is easy access to the true indicator (live feed MBS data) please share it. Thanks!
not really.....the livefeed MBS stuff is usually pay-for-play, but there are plenty of 20 minute delayed MBS services out there (more than adequate for the layman I would think)
tiedyed1 said: patrix said: Closing on Amerisave refinance on 2/14. $277,500 15-year fixed @ 3.25% with $3460 lender credit. Emailed loan officer directly on 1/12, locked rate immediately after application.
That sounds right, rate/pricing wise w/a rate credit of 1.25% at that time. What was their Origination Fee and costs?
I don't think Amerisave have Origination Fee. With $3460 lender credit, I have the whole refi costs covered with about $1000 going into escrow funding.
patrix said: tiedyed1 said: patrix said: Closing on Amerisave refinance on 2/14. $277,500 15-year fixed @ 3.25% with $3460 lender credit. Emailed loan officer directly on 1/12, locked rate immediately after application.
That sounds right, rate/pricing wise w/a rate credit of 1.25% at that time. What was their Origination Fee and costs?
I don't think Amerisave have Origination Fee. With $3460 lender credit, I have the whole refi costs covered with about $1000 going into escrow funding.
GFE
Line 1 Origination Fee $0 Line 2 Credit or Charge $3460 (credit) Line 3 Required services that we select $533.50 Line 4 Title Services and Title Insurance $840 Line 7 Gov't Recording Charges $138 Line 8 Transfer Taxes $925 Line 9 Initial Deposit to escrow acct $2982 Line 10 Daily Charges (if settlement is 3/2/2012 @ $24.71 per day) $741.30
patrix said: patrix said: tiedyed1 said: patrix said: Closing on Amerisave refinance on 2/14. $277,500 15-year fixed @ 3.25% with $3460 lender credit. Emailed loan officer directly on 1/12, locked rate immediately after application.
That sounds right, rate/pricing wise w/a rate credit of 1.25% at that time. What was their Origination Fee and costs?
I don't think Amerisave have Origination Fee. With $3460 lender credit, I have the whole refi costs covered with about $1000 going into escrow funding.
GFE
Line 1 Origination Fee $0 Line 2 Credit or Charge $3460 (credit) Line 3 Required services that we select $533.50 Line 4 Title Services and Title Insurance $840 Line 7 Gov't Recording Charges $138 Line 8 Transfer Taxes $925 Line 9 Initial Deposit to escrow acct $2982 Line 10 Daily Charges (if settlement is 3/2/2012 @ $24.71 per day) $741.30
Total estimated Settlement Charges $2699.80
It feels like something is missing. No one works for nothing. Your new loan amount is $277,500, right? What is your current loan payoff amount?
tiedyed1 said: patrix said: patrix said: tiedyed1 said: patrix said: Closing on Amerisave refinance on 2/14. $277,500 15-year fixed @ 3.25% with $3460 lender credit. Emailed loan officer directly on 1/12, locked rate immediately after application.
That sounds right, rate/pricing wise w/a rate credit of 1.25% at that time. What was their Origination Fee and costs?
I don't think Amerisave have Origination Fee. With $3460 lender credit, I have the whole refi costs covered with about $1000 going into escrow funding.
GFE
Line 1 Origination Fee $0 Line 2 Credit or Charge $3460 (credit) Line 3 Required services that we select $533.50 Line 4 Title Services and Title Insurance $840 Line 7 Gov't Recording Charges $138 Line 8 Transfer Taxes $925 Line 9 Initial Deposit to escrow acct $2982 Line 10 Daily Charges (if settlement is 3/2/2012 @ $24.71 per day) $741.30
Total estimated Settlement Charges $2699.80
It feels like something is missing. No one works for nothing. Your new loan amount is $277,500, right? What is your current loan payoff amount?
Good job. I had to go back to 1/12 rate sheets to see where pricing was and now it makes sense. They have structured this in a way where the pricing was at 102.25. That 2.25 was then used to extend to you the 1.25 rate credit and they are working for 1.00 point on their end (paid by lender), which is low considering no indication of any other profitable internal fees they are grabbing.
Hope your closing goes smoothly and thanks for sharing your info!
forbin4040 said: Yes I was going to say that HELOCS that are open without any money used is a pain for refi's and slows down the refi process a bit.
And for someone who mentioned Zillow, I heard that Provident works with Zillow so those rates could be from them.
I mentioned zillow.com earlier. However the zillow.com rates I was referencing were not from Provident - I would certainly not recommend Provident to anyone.
As an update on my struggles with Provident, they finally offered me a free lock extension and scheduled my closing for Monday. However, my processor told me that there's a good chance my docs will not be ready for review until right before closing. He said that they are really backed up and that they are producing all of their closing docs often minutes/hours prior to closing. The amount of advanced notice is so slim that most customers are not provided with enough time to get a certified check in advance of the closing so they have to FedEx one the next day. This sounds ridiculous, however I just want to put this whole experience behind me.
My processor also told me to be really careful with how we sign and date the documents. He said he worked in the closing department previously, and indicated that Provident often rejects docs if the signatures or dates aren't incredibly neat and/or consistent.
I am admittedly biased, but I am not seeing the benefit to go through such stressful experiences that I am hearing about. There are plenty of excellent mortgage brokers out there who provide their knowledgable expertise along with competitive pricing and superior service to make the mortgage experience a smooth one.
I am shopping around for a good rate currently, and I am looking at ~$294,000 for the purchase price.
I got pre-approval through PenFed, but it just seems that they NAIL you with the closing costs... I called to check how much in closing costs it would be, and with 10% down, they said it would be ~$8,200, plus an additional ~$2,000 in pre-pays. This seems insanely high - is this just what can be expected nowadays?
Also, @robertshamie, I just submitted a mortgage application using the FSB website . The name is Kristopher Waite. Thanks!
We just applied for a Provident loan through a broker and have numerous disclousre statements in front of us waiting for our autographs. While our GFEs (from the broker and lender) show all lendor credits (1.625 for us, 1.25 for broker), none of the disclosures forms make mention of our credit. Of course, they do mention the broker's credit. Should we expect to see our credit on these disclosures forms or is it good enough that they appear on the GFE?
tiedyed1 said: I am admittedly biased, but I am not seeing the benefit to go through such stressful experiences that I am hearing about. There are plenty of excellent mortgage brokers out there who provide their knowledgable expertise along with competitive pricing and superior service to make the mortgage experience a smooth one.
You're really only hearing the worst stories though, and in the end, you're on FWF. We'll put up with hassle to save a thousand or two.
dukerau said: tiedyed1 said: I am admittedly biased, but I am not seeing the benefit to go through such stressful experiences that I am hearing about. There are plenty of excellent mortgage brokers out there who provide their knowledgable expertise along with competitive pricing and superior service to make the mortgage experience a smooth one.
You're really only hearing the worst stories though, and in the end, you're on FWF. We'll put up with hassle to save a thousand or two.
Point taken. Depending on the real savings and what the hassle is worth is always an individual judgment call.
sauceisboss said: We just applied for a Provident loan through a broker and have numerous disclousre statements in front of us waiting for our autographs. While our GFEs (from the broker and lender) show all lendor credits (1.625 for us, 1.25 for broker), none of the disclosures forms make mention of our credit. Of course, they do mention the broker's credit. Should we expect to see our credit on these disclosures forms or is it good enough that they appear on the GFE?
There are customarily not separate disclosure forms that break down the rate credit, howveer, you may see a Form that illustrates choices of rates and the different origination charges associates with the highest and lowest rates offered.
The GFE is where it shows up and those figures on the GFE should correlate to page three of the application under the Details Of Transaction Section.
fatwallet21 said: @patrix, is AmeriSave good? I want to switch from FHA to 15-yr conventional...please advise
This is my 2nd refi with Amerisave. The 1st one I had a lot of issues but was able to close nevertheless. The 2nd refi, I contacted a loan officer that another fatwallet member recommended and things were a lot smoother.
rehtonAesoohC said: I am shopping around for a good rate currently, and I am looking at ~$294,000 for the purchase price.
I got pre-approval through PenFed, but it just seems that they NAIL you with the closing costs... I called to check how much in closing costs it would be, and with 10% down, they said it would be ~$8,200, plus an additional ~$2,000 in pre-pays. This seems insanely high - is this just what can be expected nowadays?
Also, @robertshamie, I just submitted a mortgage application using the FSB website . The name is Kristopher Waite. Thanks!
1. Its almost impossible (unless you work for them) to know exactly what B of A's actual losses on this would have been if there were not a settlement. Only they (BofA) trully have an actual number to this. My guess would be that both sides had to compromise to arrive at these figures and neither side is actually happy with it. This is the sign of a "good settlment"........when neither side is satisfied. 2. I totally agree with you on this. However, as I'm sure you know by now......LIFE IS NOT FAIR.....
marco100 said: Robert Shamie:
1. Do you have any opinion/idea as to how much of the settlement dollars actually represents simply nominal recognition of mortgage liabilities that the banks would have ultimately had to write down anyway? E.g. BofA's nominal participation is $11.8 billion. But if we assume $10 billion of that would have had to have been written off the books anyway, as unsecured/uncollectable debt from judgment-proof deadbeat homemoaners, then in reality the settlement is only "costing" BofA 1.8 billion, not 11.8 billion.
2. Moral hazard issue--the only homemoaners who will be pocketing cash are the worst offenders, only a small fraction of whom could actually be characterized as "victims of TFTF banks."
rehtonAesoohC said: I am shopping around for a good rate currently, and I am looking at ~$294,000 for the purchase price.
I got pre-approval through PenFed, but it just seems that they NAIL you with the closing costs... I called to check how much in closing costs it would be, and with 10% down, they said it would be ~$8,200, plus an additional ~$2,000 in pre-pays. This seems insanely high - is this just what can be expected nowadays?
Also, @robertshamie, I just submitted a mortgage application using the FSB website . The name is Kristopher Waite. Thanks!
What did Penfed list as their closing costs - can you break them out? Are you going with a fixed rate product - in which case there would be the automatic 1% origination fee? This is why people say that Penfed is good for the 5/5 ARM product where they cover up to $10K in closing costs.
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