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Reward Checking Accounts - Issues and Discussion Thread

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That makes sense. The cardholder can do quite a bit to prevent fraudulent PIN based transactions. However, last time I read the terms of a debit-card, even signature-based debit transactions did not have the same protections as a credit card.

Thank you to everyone who provided info and helped me think up debit purchases. Most don't fit my spending habits, but keep the suggestions coming. I will compile and add them to the front page in a few days.

Also, I apologize for the use of the term "BS". The foul language was uncalled for and unconstructive. Bogus, sham, or spurious would have been better choices to describe the $1 transactions advocated here.


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doublegammon said:
<snip>

Also, I apologize for the use of the term "BS". The foul language was uncalled for and unconstructive. Bogus, sham, or spurious would have been better choices to describe the $1 transactions advocated here.

Too bad you decided not to keep the discussion civil. "Bogus", "sham", and "spurious" aren't accurate descriptions of the $1 transactions discussed in this thread. You either don't know what those words mean (not genuine, counterfeit), which is ignorance, or you are deliberately misusing those words, which is lying.

Message edited by: glxpass on 2008-07-31 18:03:02 CDT
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Why is it uncivil to state that these $1 transactions are bogus and spurious? Yes, I am sincere in my use of those words. Those transactions are not genuine usages of a credit card; they have been created to meet the rules. They are not purchases you would normally make with another card or cash. I am not saying that they are counterfeit.

They are real transactions, but artifical purchases; they are not genuine purchases you would otherewise make. (edited wording)

You can do what you like, but I would like to think of some genuine uses for a debit card that would be acceptable to us finance-savvy types.

So far I have the following.

Daily-type activities: lunch

Machines: Redbox movies, stamps (if this counts)

Quick pick-ups: video store, fresh produce, beverages, groceries, ice-cream, pizza, take-out food, garden supplies, pet supplies, beverages, photo-printing,

Household Bills (not just part of it): phone bill, utility bill, water bill, cable bill, monthly insurance payment (renters insurance)

Online monthly auto-deduct services: NetFlix, credit monitoring (citi identitymonitor), Audible subscription

Online purchases: paypal purchases, gift card recharges

Message edited by: doublegammon on 2008-07-31 19:54:35 CDT
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I guess this needs saying. Glxpass, I think you have done a great job of hosting this thread and compiling good info. My original objection to the $1 transactions was not directed toward you or anyone else, but just thinking out loud about the ethics and alternatives of something I was personally tempted to do. Anyway, I would very much like to thank you for this thread and the constructive conversation.


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First post here, so cut me some slack if I'm missing something. My CITI esavings has tanked, so I just opened a Charter Turbo acct. I'm researching how to meet the requirements for the rewards and found this thread very helpful(the various point-of-view are interesting too).


Anyway, can itunes purchases count towards the 10 required debit card transactions?

It can't be that easy can it?

Thanks for all the help!
GOAT

Message edited by: getoutatown on 2008-07-31 21:24:49 CDT
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I don't use ITunes. Can you pay with a Visa card? If so, it should work. If you try it, please let us know. Some banks require point-of-sale transactions (in-person, at the store). However, I think most of them count internet transactions.


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I just get denied by coulee bank this month since I am using sprint online payment 10 times of $1 payment.
They told me this is "Bill Pay" not "debit card". I told them I only give debit card number to them and give them no pin (of course).
Still no go. any other quick ways to get this 10 transaction quickly? (not counting gas dipping.)


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bmx said:I just get denied by coulee bank this month since I am using sprint online payment 10 times of $1 payment.
They told me this is "Bill Pay" not "debit card". I told them I only give debit card number to them and give them no pin (of course).
Still no go. any other quick ways to get this 10 transaction quickly? (not counting gas dipping.)

This is nothing but semantics. You did use your debit card 10 separate times during the monthly cycle, right? Ask them for a reference in their Terms and Conditions where you were in violation.


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I just pulled my funds out of Coulee Rewards Checking because they screwed me out of the "bonus interest." I assumed that two test deposits made from an external account would satisfy the direct deposit requirement, since nowhere did I ever see a minimum amount mentioned, but just to be sure, I asked near the end if I had met all the requirements. Coulee told me I had, but after the statement closed they turned around and told me I hadn't. When I complained, they replied that "the rules are very strict", which is a laugh because Coulee is very vague up front about the specific requirements.


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Not sure if this has been discussed before, but I was just thinking about the APY of reward checking accounts last night, and it is in fact, not measurably higher than the interest rate for those with a balance at the cap. Most people are aware that the the APY is greater than the interest rate due to the compounding of interest, in the case of a 5.85% account that is compounded monthly to reach the 6.01% yield. However, for a balance at the cap (let's say 25k), you are not compounding at the 5.85% rate, you are compounding at the lower, 1.005% interest rate (1.01% APY). Therefore, your APY on a 25k initial deposit is actually only 5.877%. However, auto-debitting the $121.875 monthly interest from the rewards checking account to a 3.55% APY savings account will yield you an APY of 5.94%.

Corrected to reflect beethovengirl's comments, the above example is for Coulee bank, who I just signed up with.

Message edited by: elektronic on 2008-08-07 16:27:58 CDT
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wow... hardcore finance addict. Don't get me wrong - I enjoy this stuff too.... but I try to dream other dreams at night... good post - green elektronic said:Not sure if this has been discussed before, but I was just thinking about the APY of reward checking accounts last night, and it is in fact, not measurably higher than the APR for those with a balance at the cap. Most people are aware that the the APY is greater than the APR due to the compounding of interest, in the case of a 5.85% account it is compounded monthly to reach the 6.01% yield. However, for a balance at the cap (let's say 25k), you are not compounding at the 5.85% rate, you are compounding at the lower, 1.005% APR (1.01% APY). Therefore, your APY on a 25k initial deposit is actually only 5.87%. However, auto-debitting the $121.875 monthly interest from the rewards checking account to a 3.55% APY savings account will yield you an APY of 5.94%

Message edited by: jackcrawfish on 2008-08-07 15:13:16 CDT
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RudolfSchmidt said:I just pulled my funds out of Coulee Rewards Checking because they screwed me out of the "bonus interest." I assumed that two test deposits made from an external account would satisfy the direct deposit requirement, since nowhere did I ever see a minimum amount mentioned, but just to be sure, I asked near the end if I had met all the requirements. Coulee told me I had, but after the statement closed they turned around and told me I hadn't. When I complained, they replied that "the rules are very strict", which is a laugh because Coulee is very vague up front about the specific requirements.
ACH deposit must be at least $1


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elektronic said:Most people are aware that the the APY is greater than the APR due to the compounding of interest, in the case of a 5.85% account it is compounded monthly to reach the 6.01% yield. However, for a balance at the cap (let's say 25k), you are not compounding at the 5.85% rate, you are compounding at the lower, 1.005% APR (1.01% APY). Therefore, your APY on a 25k initial deposit is actually only 5.87%.
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]


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I just got hit with a $7 "eBill payer fee" from M/A-COM FCU, on my reward checking account. I called up and was told that fee is applied if you don't use the eBill payer for 3 months.

I just set up a small recurring billpay amount to one of my cards.


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beethovengirl said:
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]

So you're saying that after month 1 and an initial deposit of $25,000, I will have 25,182.88 in my account and Coulee bank will pay 5.85% interest on my balance of $25182.88?? And that they will not be paying 5.85% on 25000 and 1.005% on $182.88?


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elektronic said:beethovengirl said:
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]


So you're saying that after month 1 and an initial deposit of $25,000, I will have 25,182.88 in my account

no, I'm saying that if you keep $25,000 for one month in an account that pays 5.85% compounded monthly, you will have $25,121.88 at the end of the month. The extra $121.88 will then earn 1.01% APY the following month.


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beethovengirl said:elektronic said:beethovengirl said:
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]


So you're saying that after month 1 and an initial deposit of $25,000, I will have 25,182.88 in my account

no, I'm saying that if you keep $25,000 for one month in an account that pays 5.85% compounded monthly, you will have $25,121.88 at the end of the month. The extra $121.88 will then earn 1.01% APY the following month.

Ok, so the only thing that was wrong in my post was using APR instead of interest rate. The realized APY for a $25,000 deposit is actually 5.877% on the Coulee Checking account. Thanks for the red


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elektronic said:beethovengirl said:elektronic said:beethovengirl said:
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]


So you're saying that after month 1 and an initial deposit of $25,000, I will have 25,182.88 in my account

no, I'm saying that if you keep $25,000 for one month in an account that pays 5.85% compounded monthly, you will have $25,121.88 at the end of the month. The extra $121.88 will then earn 1.01% APY the following month.


Ok, so the only thing that was wrong in my post was using APR instead of interest rate. The realized APY for a $25,000 deposit is actually 5.877% on the Coulee Checking account. Thanks for the red

No, your original post, which you later edited, said that the realized APY for a $25,000 deposit is 5.87%, which was wrong too. Besides your math mistake and misunderstanding of APR, your post was a trivial observation that also ignored the realities of Reward Checking accounts in that there are multiple debits (and possibly a direct deposit) each month, and most people don't deposit exactly the balance cap in their Reward Checking accounts precisely because they want to obtain the 6% APY on their money. But, feel free to red my posts, which, as far as I know, contained 100% correct information.


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beethovengirl said:elektronic said:beethovengirl said:elektronic said:beethovengirl said:
Actually, for all of the nationally available 6% APY Reward Checking accounts with a $25K cap, the 6.01% APY is inclusive of balances at $25,000. And, you are confusing the concepts of APR and the interest rate. APR does not apply to deposit accounts.
Explanation of difference between APR and APY

as a side note, as far as I know, most deposit accounts compound interest daily and credit it monthly. [Coulee Bank does actually compound monthly]


So you're saying that after month 1 and an initial deposit of $25,000, I will have 25,182.88 in my account

no, I'm saying that if you keep $25,000 for one month in an account that pays 5.85% compounded monthly, you will have $25,121.88 at the end of the month. The extra $121.88 will then earn 1.01% APY the following month.


Ok, so the only thing that was wrong in my post was using APR instead of interest rate. The realized APY for a $25,000 deposit is actually 5.877% on the Coulee Checking account. Thanks for the red

No, your original post, which you later edited, said that the realized APY for a $25,000 deposit is 5.87%, which was wrong too. Besides your math mistake and misunderstanding of APR, your post was a trivial observation that also ignored the realities of Reward Checking accounts in that there are multiple debits (and possibly a direct deposit) each month, and most people don't deposit exactly the balance cap in their Reward Checking accounts precisely because they want to obtain the 6% APY on their money. But, feel free to red my posts, which, as far as I know, contained 100% correct information.

What math mistake? My math is correct, that the interest is compounds at the 1.005% interest rate, not 5.85%, yielding 5.877% APY. I truncated at 3 significant figures instead of rounding up. BFD. You are just being a pompous itch. I was trying to provide a worthwhile contribution to the Finance forum, and you got lost in the insignificant details that have no bearing on the financial outcome.

The point was to advise against leaving the interest to accrue in the account and to siphon off any balance in excess of $25k at the end of each month. It was to caution against assuming a 6.01% APY on your cap deposit.

Second, regardless of whether APR applies to deposit accounts or not, people use APR interchangeably with interest rate on this forum and your beloved investopedia. Why? Because the calculations are the same. Stop being a snotty.


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elektronic said:Second, regardless of whether APR applies to deposit accounts or not, people use APR interchangeably with interest rate on this forum and your beloved investopedia. Why? Because the calculations are the same.
You're still missing the point.
interest rate:APR for credit accounts::interest rate:APY for deposit accounts.

Using APR interchangeably with interest rate doesn't make sense [whereas using APR and APY interchangeably is forgivable]. Just b/c people sometimes make the mistake on this forum [and even that investopedia article] doesn't make it right, and it's rather out of place in a nitpicking post inaccurately attempting to report the exact APY for deposits in reward checking accounts (in which you wrongly truncated the result rather than rounding up). I don't normally correct individual posters when they make the error -- I only bring it up if the mistake is being made repeatedly in a particular thread. But, your post was nitpicking reward checking accounts, so I nitpicked your post. But, if it makes you feel better to insult me, then go right ahead. I couldn't care less [hey, wait, lots of people say, "I could care less;" I guess it must be ok then].

Message edited by: beethovengirl on 2008-08-07 19:19:57 CDT
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