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Thinking of getting a 2006 Toyota HYBRID Highlander Archived From: Finance

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The gas mileage seems to be pretty good and also the most environment friendly in SUV class..Need a 5+ seater these days as my parents will be staying with us for at least a year and we will be travelling a lot..2006 seems to be the oldest I can get as they started hybrid production on HL that year...any opinions or reviews would be great? I have a 2000 Corolla which I will be trading....

Because I want something, I use excuses to justify it as a need.

[another useless comment]

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mnsweeps said:The gas mileage seems to be pretty good and also the most environment friendly in SUV class..Need a 5+ seater these days as my parents will be staying with us for at least a year and we will be travelling a lot..2006 seems to be the oldest I can get as they started hybrid production on HL that year...any opinions or reviews would be great? I have a 2000 Corolla which I will be trading....
...and this from a senior member

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I can never tell you two apart.

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mnsweeps said:The gas mileage seems to be pretty good and also the most environment friendly in SUV class..Need a 5+ seater these days as my parents will be staying with us for at least a year and we will be travelling a lot..2006 seems to be the oldest I can get as they started hybrid production on HL that year...any opinions or reviews would be great? I have a 2000 Corolla which I will be trading....


You'd get better gas mileage and more seating from a pair of Priuses!


(yes, I know that's not true: 2 priuses = 24 mpg city, 1 highlander = 28 mpg city)

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Why not get an 03 and not worry about the price of gas? You will save >10 kilobucks right off the top.

Edit:
Does the extra gas mileage of the hybrid offset the nasty processes used to make the batteries?

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RedCelicaGT said:Why not get an 03 and not worry about the price of gas? You will save >10 kilobucks right off the top.

Edit:
Does the extra gas mileage of the hybrid offset the nasty processes used to make the batteries?

yes it offsets but for the price also the hybrid does 0-60 in 7.2 sec and will tow 3500lb lol. i would get the 03 like you said, or wait for a plug-in hybrid.

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RedCelicaGT said:
Does the extra gas mileage of the hybrid offset the nasty processes used to make the batteries?

Not only that. Consider also that those batteries cost about $7K and last about 7 years. That gives you about $1000 additional operating cost per year that good old gasoline cars do not have. At 3 bucks per gallon, 1000 bucks will buy about 7 extra gallons of gas per week. If you travel, say 250 miles per week on your hybrid, and spend, say 10 gallons on that, with 7 extra gallons you could drive the same 250 miles at ~15 miles per gallon, and it would cost you the same as driving a hybrid, not even taking into account the difference in the purchase price.
This should go to the urban myths thread. Really. Hybrids is the biggest urban myth of all.

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"Hybrids is the biggest urban myth of all."

no hydrogen ethanol are the urban myth, and if you think gas is staying at $3 gal better think again. plug-in hybrids will be norm soon.

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jimmyzshack said:

no hydrogen ethanol are the urban myth, and if you think gas is staying at $3 gal better think again.

Haha. No, gas isn't staying at $3/gal. But those nasty batteries aren't getting any cheaper either
Also, note that my calculations above are pretty rough. 250 miles per week is a lot. Most people drive less. And 15 miles/gallon is ridiculous, most gasoline cars make at least 20. And that number isn't staying put either.

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dimatkach said:250 miles per week is a lot. Most people drive less.

250 miles per week would be 13k miles per year. Since Americans average 12k to 15k miles per year, I think that number is very reasonable.

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dimatkach said:jimmyzshack said:

no hydrogen ethanol are the urban myth, and if you think gas is staying at $3 gal better think again.


Haha. No, gas isn't staying at $3/gal. But those nasty batteries aren't getting any cheaper either
Also, note that my calculations above are pretty rough. 250 miles per week is a lot. Most people drive less. And 15 miles/gallon is ridiculous, most gasoline cars make at least 20. And that number isn't staying put either.


Actually, I think the trend would show that those nasty batteries *are* getting cheaper.

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CoffeeEater said:dimatkach said:250 miles per week is a lot. Most people drive less.

250 miles per week would be 13k miles per year. Since Americans average 12k to 15k miles per year, I think that number is very reasonable.

Come on! If some croud averages at 12k per year, that means that about 2/3 or so of them probably drive less than that (because those who drive more have more weight - that's how average works, unlike median). That's what I said - 'most people drive less'.

Now if you are really interested in some statistics rather than rough guesstimate numbers that I put forward as a mere illustration, quick googling returns this page for example.

Here is says that an average american family spends $6000 per year on gasoline for two cars. That means that 1K/year extra operating cost of a hybrid amounts for 1/3 of the gasoline expenses. So, if your hybrid makes 30 miles per gallon (which most don't), it will be roughly equivalent in cost to 20 miles/gallon from a gasoline car (which most do).

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soundtechie said:

Actually, I think the trend would show that those nasty batteries *are* getting cheaper.

Does it? Where did you see that?

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dimatkach said:Come on! If some croud averages at 12k per year, that means that about 2/3 or so of them probably drive less than that (because those who drive more have more weight - that's how average works, unlike median). That's what I said - 'most people drive less'.

So if the average is 12k miles, two-thirds drive less than that? You were able to extract that information from a 12k unweighted arithmetic mean? You're fabricating information to support your regurgitated statements.

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CoffeeEater said:
So if the average is 12k miles, two-thirds drive less than that? You were able to extract that information from a 12k unweighted arithmetic mean? You're fabricating information to support your regurgitated statements.

No. You are fabricating information about my statements. I said *probably* 2/3 *or so* drive less. There is no way to tell exactly of course. It is obvios though that it is more than 1/2. Is this obvious to you or not? If it is you are fabricating the information, just like I said. If it isn't, you simply don't know what you are talking about ...
Now, since we established that more than half americans drive less, do I need to go additional miles to explain to you that "most" and "more than half" are synonyms? Or do you know at least that? I'd assume you do, if you feel comfortable using terms like regurgitated and pretend you know what they mean

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dimatkach said:No. You are fabricating information about my statements. I said *probably* 2/3 drive less. There is no way to tell exactly of course.

Right. There's no way to tell exactly, so don't pull 2/3 out of your a**. You know what happens when you assume...

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CoffeeEater said:
Right. There's no way to tell exactly, so don't pull 2/3 out of your a**. You know what happens when you assume...

I'll take this as an apology, and admission that my statement about most americans driving less than 12k a year was indeed accurate...

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Battery recycling is getting a lot better: http://www.hybridcars.com/faq.html#battery
The hybrid battery packs are designed to last for the lifetime of the vehicle, somewhere between 150,000 and 200,000 miles, probably a whole lot longer. The warranty covers the batteries for between eight and ten years, depending on the car maker.

Battery toxicity is a concern, althoug today's hybrids use NiMH batteries, not the environmentally problematic rechargeable nickel cadmium. "Nickel metal hydride batteries are benign. They can be fully recycled," says Ron Cogan, editor of the Green Car Journal. Toyota and Honda say that they will recycle dead batteries and that disposal will pose no toxic hazards. Toyota puts a phone number on each battery, and they pay a $200 "bounty" for each battery to help ensure that it will be properly recycled.

There's no definitive word on replacement costs because they are almost never replaced. According to Toyota, since the Prius first went on sale in 2000, they have not replaced a single battery for wear and tear
As for financial aspect, here are lot of good discussion:

Is 2006 a year to buy a hybrid? , in this 400+ posts thread.

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dimatkach said:I'll take this as an apology, and admission that my statement about most americans driving less than 12k a year was indeed accurate...

LOL. Let's go through your "accurate statements":

1. If unweighted arithmetic mean is X, then two-thirds of the sample fall below that mean.
2. Hybrid batteries cost $7k
3. Hybrid batteries are increasing in price.
4. Hybrids cost $1k more per year in operating costs than "good old gasoline cars"

It's obvious that you are extremely biased when you make up figures like the above. $7k for hybrid batteries? You say that hybrids don't get 30mpg while gasoline cars get over 20mpg? Which hybrids? The Prius or the giant GMC truck hybrids? You use 25mpg for hybrids in one post. Again, what hybrids? What are we comparing? You're not making any sense when you throw around fabricated numbers attached to ridiculous equations.

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