Beckles said:stook2001 said:Also described myself as a long time customer with moderate revolving balances that are PIF monthly.This statement is contradictory. If you PIF monthly, then you have zero revolving balance. Just because it's on a revolving card doesn't make it revolving debt unless it actually revolves.

You got me. Poor communication. I tend to charge a couple thousand at most and pay in full monthly. Its atypical for me to carry a balance. That is what I meant. Thanks for the clarification.

** Edit - per the below, whatever its called - ie revolving or not revolving, the above is what I do.
** Edit again - or not - Wall St Monkey removed the msg. lol

if you PIF monthly AFTER your statement generates, your reports will show a balance. makes sense to me, OP.

stook2001 said:For sure, I have way more access to credit now. BofA seems to have the right approach. A credit analyst called me a few minutes ago about my business app. She reviewed my other BofA accounts carefully. Discussed my business, my income, etc. for several minutes. Made some high level assessments of my capacity to continuing generating business income with a few pointed questions. Then made the judgement call to approve the card with 3/4 of my requested credit. Very reasonable approach in my view. Did I apply for 8 BofA accounts, no. But the process they use seems about right and they have extended about as much new credit to me as had Citi.I abuse the hell out of my relationship with BoA and they give me the highest credit lines after speaking with me and documenting income. They call when I click for a credit increase and they tell me I am one of their best customers, blah blah blah. If they are making money off of me, they can turn feces into gold and should be heavily invested in.

DavidScubadiver said:lhendricks92 said:DavidScubadiver said:Post a link where those people are complaining. I am curious to see non-gamers getting hurt by something as innocuous as 5 inquiries.

I was referring to other stories of Citi A/A in the adverse action thread.

technique, for example. 74ak, too.I wonder whether Technique had some balance transfer issues -- see Expressing opinion that BT offers should be cut, not the lines of credit.

No, I did not do any BT's with citibank... I was stating that opinion about BT offers because it seems that most people got cut off after doing a BT with them... I charged up near my credit limit one of my citi cards a week or so before they closed me down, but that was purchases, and not unusual spending for me... They never mentioned that either... Just # of inquiries...

tolamapS said:I think it helps to be using CITI cards for purchases.

Just my theories.
Can you elaborate? Do you think leaving the card idle (no BT balances) might raise a red flag?

I agree that anecdotally, Citi seems to like usage. I'd even argue that at least prior to whatever changes they've made (don't claim to know what they want anymore) they liked folks who ran the cards up to a certain point.

Separately (to all), is there any evidence that reallocations amidst new accounts might raise flags?

swishyx said:
...
I would guess that the "trigger event" was probably an automated review, and I would further guess that if his Citi accounts were older, it might not have mattered.
...

I wondered if something else caused Citi to review his report again. The reason why I say that is because SecondCor521 and I did A0Rs a few weeks earlier than stook...both of us did as many or more (in SecondCor's case) apps than stook and neither of us have seen any adverse action yet...and, we've both already BT'd quite a bit.

Looking back through stook's A0R thread, I noticed that he submitted an app for the CitiProfessional card last because he had a problem submitting it the first time, with all of the other Citi apps. His inquiries show that Citi pulled three times on 4/2 and another time on 4/3. He then gets an email on 4/4 stating he was rejected for a CitiBiz card and the reason was "too many inquiries". I assume this card was the CitiProf since it's the only CitiBiz card he shows as rejected.

So, maybe that review of his credit report, while processing the app for the CitiProf card, is what triggered this.

I know Jevon90 has chronicled his A/A experience with Citi, and I wonder if it was triggered by a review after his request to get a large credit balance refunded. However, SecondCor did that as well and hasn't posted any A/A yet.

swishyx said:tolamapS said:I think it helps to be using CITI cards for purchases.

Just my theories.
Can you elaborate? Do you think leaving the card idle (no BT balances) might raise a red flag?

I agree that anecdotally, Citi seems to like usage. I'd even argue that at least prior to whatever changes they've made (don't claim to know what they want anymore) they liked folks who ran the cards up to a certain point.

Separately (to all), is there any evidence that reallocations amidst new accounts might raise flags?

I will try to elaborate. Until the beginning of 2007, I was very conservative w/ credit card usage, having retained only 2 out of nearly 15 cards I had opened over the past 12 years. I primary used my CITI driver's edge, and MBNA called several times tryin to lure me w/ BTs, etc.

I opened a bunch of applications early 2007, and subsequently, Chase shut down my cards with them, all recent. I did not have any BTs w/ Chase. However, they did not like the number of inquiries, the number of new cards, and the recent balances.

On the other han, I took out a large BT w/ CITI Biz, and large balance w/ BofA personal.

I keep quite a bit of my purchases on CITI cards: Professional, Premier Pass, Driver's edge, basically allocating purchases where the marginal reward is the greatest.

I have also been applying for CITI cards, racking up inquiries on EX, and it has been OK. Once they rejected me for too many CITI applications w/in 60 days, and a couple of times they rejected me because EX was frozen.

I did not have such good luck w/ Chase, who shut down my 3 recently opened cards. I eventually made them re-open the cards, but had to do some b* and agree to lower credit terms. I hardly ever use the Chase cards, but I'd love to show Chase some love, if it is reciprocated. I just don't spend that much money to show love to Chase, Citi, AMEX, Discover, etc.

My situation w/ Chase seems to be similar to OPs situation w/ CITI. Looking at his cards, I think he pushed CITI too hard. Might have been OK a few months ago, but I am sure they are hurting now.

tolamapS said:I think the FWF needs to figure out a new "credit profile" to blend into. Perhaps a credit user who is in debt, but has a conservative approach and continuously rotates balances on CCS w/ hope of reducing them, while paying a little interest.

I know people who do that, and they have actual debt, and try to carefully manage the debt.
Hear hear.

Separately - I see that OP had 8 Citi apps altogether - and the adverse action kicked in within a month. The AOR thread only indicates 1 new account (which was Citi, but that's not the point) showed up on the CR as of 4/4.

That suggests to me that it was Citi-internal activity that triggered the review; they wouldn't have had the chance to see a gaggle of new accounts other than their own. So I'm changing my theory - probably not a routine account review - I can easily see an issuer flagging someone applying for 8 accounts at the same time for review, and dumping out over inquiries found during the review. Automated fraud/ID theft prevention alone would probably twitch over this.

On the flip side, the other Citi A/A reported has been hitting people who AOR-ed in February/March, I think. Those guys may be hitting other traps but winding up flagged the same way, then flagged for inquiries and booted.

Other Citi A/A folks - how many Citi accounts did you have pre-AOR, and how many did you apply for during the AOR?

A small Citi A/A tally:

stook2001 - 10 accts/apps, 2 existing / 8 new apps, no BT, max-out, or refund activity

singhonfire - 10 accts, 6 existing / 4 new, 10/07 AOR, oth circumstances unknown

Jevon90 - 5 accts, 2 existing / 3 new, large neg balance refund exceeding CL - noted no new accts on CR since Dec at time of "too many inquiries" on EQ, all were visible at app time

brushwood - 7 accts, 3 existing / 4 new, $25K BT on business side

alextan - no detail, 5 accts consolidated to 3 in Feb, $13K BT

74ak - existing count unknown, 2 new accts (in 4 years), reallocation from old to new Citi + BT, "numerous reallocations" to business side, 7 inquiries

Technique - haven't found AOR thread yet

xCarsonx - haven't found AOR thread yet

Venturion had A/A but it was in the form of non-renewal of an older card, and the non-renew didn't specifically cite inquiry count.

swishyx said:ahself said:Looking back through stook's A0R thread, I noticed that he submitted an app for the CitiProfessional card last because he had a problem submitting it the first time, with all of the other Citi apps. His inquiries show that Citi pulled three times on 4/2 and another time on 4/3. He then gets an email on 4/4 stating he was rejected for a CitiBiz card and the reason was "too many inquiries". I assume this card was the CitiProf since it's the only CitiBiz card he shows as rejected.

So, maybe that review of his credit report, while processing the app for the CitiProf card, is what triggered this.
That's pretty interesting. I'm going to have to review stook's AOR thread. Did those 4/2 and 4/3 inquiries correspond to apps or did it look like someone at Citi was probing his report to size him up?

A potential implication here - if all the inqs correspond to apps - is that maybe the amount of *Citi* activity proper is a variable, which would lead one to do fewer apps with them vs. other issuers in an AOR.

I will review this carefully as well. This is potentially a solid theory. I retrospect, I should have clearly opted out of the last citi app. Nevertheless, one additional fact to point out that was not clearly detailed in my AOR thread is that my Apps spanned past midnight. As such, it is basically impossible to ascertain at this point when whether or not they pulled a distinct report for the last app. That being said, I will review in detail my credit report once again and try to piece together each CITI app. I am on a plane in 3 hours and if I don't get to this tonight I will post tomorrow with more detail.