MikeR397's AOR 2.0 - Stage 3 of 4 Complete - Over $400k thus far

UPDATE - DAD Business O'Rama w/ Cash Back personal cards - He pretty much wants to keep his personal report clear of balances so as to be fleixible and ready to act should an opportunity to refinance come up or another opportunity present itself. So here's the planned list:

Business Cards
1) TU - Existing $27k CL - LinkJuniper - Bank Atlantic Card - Need to Consolidate to National Parks, then apply Link to App
2) EQ - Existing $30k CL - National City – Business Card Link to App Apply by phone: 1-800-622-4036 x67291
3) EQ - Previous card had $15k, closed now - Advanta Kiva - Closed previous card on 6/18, will see if I can get a new one. Link to CardSelection $50 signup bonus
4) EQ - Existing $50k Cl - Chase Business App to try that doesn't say cap but comes with a $99 cap?
5) EX - Citi Business - No Fee 0% offer w/ 15k TY Points :)

Cash Back Cards:
1) EX - Charles Schwabb 2% - need to open brokerage account also - Link to app
2)?
3)?
4) Penfed - CL up to $50k, good overall Cash Back tiers - Link

Concerns
(1) Bank Atlantic, Advanta, and National City won't let you have multiple business cards. The close and apply quickly works for Advanta, but with Bank Atlantic, Mom waited a week before reapplying and they denied her for "sufficient credit issued by Barclays" despite her card being closed. They would not reconsidered without another hardpull.
(2) Not sure about the Chase link, online terms say no cap, but it may hvae a cap when it comes. With a dormant $50k CL already, its worth a shot.

-----------------------------------------

Background… This will be my second AOR. The first one was launched in June last year and was a huge success. I started with one credit card with a $4,000 CL. My first AOR bumped me up to $130,000 in total CL’s, but I did experience several lowered limits over the course of the year. This thread is for my upcoming personal AOR only, but during my AOR 1.0, I did a family AOR with my parents as well (who got the bulk of the AOR $ given my previously weak history). Total CL’s achieved during AOR 1.0 was just over $1MM, with around $880,000 of BT $ invested over the last year. My balances are almost all at $0 now, and this is my personal AOR. The parents will be ready in about one month from now. The goal this year is to get $1.5MM+ in total credit lines.

AOR 1.0 Current Existing Lines
Current Cards / CL / Adverse Action Over Past Year’s AOR --- All have $0 Balance

Personal Cards
1) American Express – IN NYC - $500 --- Reduced from $13,000 -- UPDATE - RESTORED TO $13,000
2) American Express – IN Chicago - $500 --- Reduced from $24,900 -- UPDATE - RESTORED TO $24,900
3) Bank of America – Platinum Plus - $7,000 (Soft CLI to $12,000)
4) Chase – VW Platinum - $5,500 --- Reduced from $7,000
5) Citi – Dividend – $5,500
6) Citi – ATT - $4,000 --- Soft CLI +$500 --- $4,500
7) Discover – More - $3,000
8) GE – Money - $5,500
9) HSBC – GM Flex - $3,000
10) Juniper – National Parks - $2,000
11) National City – Personal - $5,000
12) PNC – Platinum - $4,100 -- - Reduced from $5,000
13) WAMU – ESPN - $1,613 --- Reduced from $2,000
14) Citi - Professional – $20,000

Business Cards
1) Advanta – Platinum - $4,350 --- Reduced from $5,000
2) Chase – GM Business - $8,600 --- Reduced from $10,000
3) Chase – Business Platinum - $4,400 – Reduced from $5,000
4) Citi - Business TY - $4,000

Total Existing Credit Lines – $88,563
(I also have about $35,000 of AU Credit lines reporting in addition to these cards)

AOR 2.0 Upcoming Applications:

Personal Cards (Agency Pulled for me/Issuer/ Card)
1) EX - APPROVED - $2,500 - Consolidated to $14,400- Bank of America – Platinum Plus - Link to App
2) TU - APPROVED $5,000 - Consolidated to $8,000 - Sending $7,500 to Citi Pro - 07/03/08 - Discover – Garmin Offer - Discover Garmin Offer - w/ 6 mo 0% BT FWF List of Current Discover Signup Goodies
3) TU - APPROVED - $17,000 - Consolidated to $22,500 Chase – Platinum Visa - Link to CardSelection $25 signup bonus
4) TU - DENIED- Juniper - Ifly Link to App
5) TU - DENIED - I never sent in proof of income becuase my "overall debt was less than 25% of my HHI - 07/02/08 Asked for $24,250 BT to CW Acct - US Bank – Baylor Alumni Card Link to App
6) EX - APPROVED - $4,800 CL - Citi – Cash Rewards Link to App
7) EX - APPROVED - $4,500 CL- Citi - Upromise - Link to App
8) EX - APPROVED - $20,000 CL - Citi - Associated Bank Card Link to App
9) EQ - DENIED- National City - National Quilters (thanks ahself) Link to App
10) ?? - DENIED - Wachovia – Personal Card Link to App

Business Cards
1) TU - DENIED - Juniper - Bank Atlantic Card Link to App
2) EX - APPROVED - $8,000- Citi – Business 15k TY - Link to App
3) EQ - DENIED- National City – Business Card Link to App Apply by phone: 1-800-622-4036 x67291
4) EQ – DENIED- 5/3 Business MasterCard (regular, 0% 12mo $0 BT fee) Link to App
5) EQ - APPROVED $10,000 - Consolidated to $23,000- Chase Business Cash Rebate Link to CardSelection $35 Signup Bonus
6) EQ - APPROVED $10,000 CL - Advanta - Closed previous card on 6/18, will see if I can get a new one. Link to CardSelection $30 signup bonus

TOTAL CURRENT AVAILABLE AOR 2.0 CREDIT LINES (including all Citi lines???) = $149,200

Edit: HHI for 2008 is going to be ~$250k for the family. My FICO at the beginning of AOR 1.0 was ~760, and right now with $65k of balances reporting, it is ~670. Also, I have no inquiries on TU or EQ, and 5 inquiries a year old from EX. Update: FAKO's today (with $9k of CC balances, $5k from parents AU daily spender, and $20,500 of new student loans) are 756/758/733. Not too bad considering this is $28k more debt (showing, not that I really have) than I had last year.

******************************************************************
Sister-O-Rama

Existing Cards
AMEX – In NYC – $20,200
Chase – Sony – $7,000
BOA – Platinum Plus – $12,000
Citi – ATT - $2,000
Citi – Professional - $12,000

New Applications/Status

Personal Cards
1) Bank of America – Platinum Plus - Approved - $2,500 - Consolidated to $14,500
2) Discover – More - Denied
3) Chase – Platinum Visa - Approved $7000 - Consolidated to Chase Business
4) Juniper – National Parks – Denied
5) US Bank – Baylor Alumni Card – asked $19,750 BT to Countrywide - Denied, never sent in proof of income since total debt was less than 25% of HHI.
6) Citi – Cash Rewards Link to App - Approved $25,000
7) Citi - Upromise - Link to App - Denied
8) Citi - Associated Bank Card Link to App - Approved $15,000
9) National City – Life Springs Visa – Asked $19750 BT to Countrywide - Approved - $10,000
10)Wachovia – Personal Card Link to App - Denied

Business Cards
1 Juniper - Bank Atlantic Card - Denied
2) Citi – Business 15k TY - Approved - $8000
3) National City – Business Card Link to App Apply by phone: 1-800-622-4036 x67291 - Denied
4) Chase Business Cash Rebate – Approved - $9000 - Consolidated to $24,000
5) Advanta - Approved $7,500

Total Sister-o-Rama AOR Credit Lines (including Citi credit lines???) - $118,000

RUNNING OVERALL TOTAL OF ALL CREDIT LINES - $267,200

**************************************************************
Update: 10/12/08 - Mom-o-Rama (work in progress)

Personal Cards (Agency Pulled for me/Issuer/ Card)
1) EX - APPROVED- $25,000 - Exisiting CL with BOA personal - Bank of America – Platinum Plus - Link to App
2) TU - APPROVED- $11,500 - Discover More
3) TU - APPROVED- $47,500 - Chase Disney Card - Link to App - $75 Cap
4) TU - DENIED- Asked $20k to 5/3- $2,500 exisiting - Juniper - Ifly Link to App
5) TU - APPROVED - $25,000 - Check mailed to 5/3 - US Bank – Baylor Alumni Card Link to App
6) EX - DENIED- Citi CR Card - Damn you Citi and your credit lock, still in place. Third attempt failed.
7) DENIED- People's United - RBS - 9 month, $60 cap
8) APPROVED - $15,000 + existing $5,650 CL = $20,650CL - Asked for $20k BT to 5/3 (did it go through with $15k CL originally?)- WaMu Espn Card - Link to App - 6 month, no fee

Business Cards
1) TU - DENIED LinkJuniper - Bank Atlantic Card - Need to Consolidate to National Parks, then apply Link to App
2) EQ - DENIED- National City – Business Card Link to App Apply by phone: 1-800-622-4036 x67291
3) EQ - APPROVED- $22,500 CL - Advanta Kiva - Closed previous card on 6/18, will see if I can get a new one. Link to CardSelection $50 signup bonus
4) EQ - DENIEDChase Business App to try that doesn't say cap but comes with a $99 cap?

Total New Mom O Rama Credit available for 0% BT: $146,500. Not bad, but this is less than 1/2 what she got last year. Credit crunch sucks.

Removed Apps:
M&T Bank - 6 month, $0 fee - BT FEE IS NO LONGER CAPPED.
Chase Options Express $75 capped offer - Link to App -- Still one of the two remaining capped Chase personal card apps, but Mom already has $47.5k of personal credit with them, and I don't want to push it.
AMEX - Exising $30,500 CL - Only 0% on purchases for 12 months - AMEX doesn't allow for consolidation anymore, and without consolidation, I'm not sure this 0% purchase card will help me.
Pulaski Bank - 6 month, no fee, (also no fee cash advances at 6.5% interest rate, not bad) - $35 annual fee sorta discourages me, especially since I"m not sure about the credit limits this bank typically gives.
Wachovia – Must call (866) 327-6214, 24 hours a day, seven days a week - Personal Card Link to App - Didn't want to ask mom to have to call.
Compass Bank - app over phone - Who is the issuer?
Compass Bank Business - also need to call

1) Yes, for Citi anyway. I have two Diamond Preferred's, one normal (oldest Citi card) and one with 0%-for-life. I don't think you'll have a problem here. Other issuers, not sure.

2) No, you cannot have two Advanta's. Multiple, multiple people have tried. I cancelled mine last year, before applying and being accepted for a new one, with a higher CL (10k up from 5k). Don't assume it will be higher though, some people have experienced lower CL's the second time around.

4) I have 4 Personal, 2 business, have experienced no AA yet. I've heard claims of up to eight here. I would maybe go with the best Personal and best Biz app first, then maybe delay a couple others. I'm sure you've read the recent Citi AA Approach thread, so you'll know we're all guessing right now.

May I suggest The Nuclear Option? Do the entire family's AOR all at once, and document it in one thread? It would be great fun.

1) Not completely sure about multiple RBS cards. I did, however, get a Kroger card while I already had a regular platinum card. So it's probably okay to get two identical ones? (I may find try myself in several months, let me know how it works).

4) I think the total sum of Chase/Citi cards is variable, but very large. I mean, I've had 8 or so without problems. But the as has been previously demostrated, too many new apps is more likely to be bad.

Mike, congrats on your success at round 1 with the family. $880,000 is huge! To think of all the work you would have to do to keep those rewards checking accounts going with a only $100,000 FDIC per account. I for one have appreciated all your insights about Business AORs. That has been very valuable for FWF.

On to the questions:

1) As djspray mentioned, you can usually have multiple of the same card open with a creditor. The only exception to this that I have heard of is Advanta Business. Also worth mentioning, Discover will only allow one Personal and one Business card to be opened during a time frame (I believe within a 6 month period, but not certain). It doesn't look like you will will have this problem though.

2) I am not sure how long it takes Advanta to update their system when closing out a card. I would be safe and suggest waiting a full billing cycle (30+ days after close) before applying for a new one. It might be possible to close and re-open in a single phone call though. Anyone have more info on this? I am curious as well.

3) It is generally agreed by the FWF community that consolidating lines (canceling the card to add the limit to an existing line) has a negative (or at least not a positive) effect on your credit score. The general rule is never close a card unless it is specifically requested or required when applying for a new card or loan. Instead, reallocate the lines by moving as much of the limit to the new card as you can. All cards have a specific minimum you need to keep the line open (usually $500 or $1,000). Reallocate all but the minimum and keep the card open to help provide history to your credit report, thus helping your score in the long run since an open card will take longer before it falls off than a closed card. I would usually do this after you receive your new cards before you balance transfer (if you don't request the transfer at the time of application, that is).

4) Most have reported around 8-9 cards for each City and Chase before getting denied for additional cards. Some can have up to 12, others get denied after 6, so YMMV. So (and this is an exception to #3 above) consolidating your lines down to 5-7 before applying for more cards should provide a better chance of not getting denied for too many lines.

Best of luck in your AOR and for the family!

kittenmittens said: MikeR397 said: Also, I have the RBS platinum and RBS kroger at the same time also with no probs.A bit OT, but did you ever try reallocating between the two?I've tried this during AOR 1.0, and it was a no go. Tried 3 seperate times, but they won't consolidate (or move partial CL) between the RBS platinum and the RBS kroger card. They seem to give the exact same Cl's on both though and are pretty inquiry friendly.

I also recommend waiting for your prettied up credit profile to hit the bureaus. The new cl's report after statement cycle date, except for the usual weirdness (AXP is slow, etc).

a) The Citibank Professional card is personal, in that it appears on your credit report.
b) I don't know of a Sony $100 bonus that's current.
c) If you want to maximize seperate buckets for Citibank, maybe try the Hilton or American Airlines personal card instead of the Preferred Rewards. There have been indications that those are seperate buckets. (but they are NPSL cards, which makes reallocation tougher).
d) I would personally avoid WAMU unless you had a targeted offer.
e) I would apply for a Citibank business card that has a good TYP signup bonus (either the TYP card, Premierpass, or the regular business with a "before you go" bonus.
f) Maybe give AXP a break on this one? Apply for a rewards card or two, and built up some credit that won't be slashed on the inevitable financial review.

You'll included your reported HHI and scores before you apply, right?

Corndogg said: I am not sure how long it takes Advanta to update their system when closing out a card. I would be safe and suggest waiting a full billing cycle (30+ days after close) before applying for a new one. It might be possible to close and re-open in a single phone call though. Anyone have more info on this? I am curious as well.You can re-apply virtually immediately - a day or two prior to the new application is more than necessary. When I did this last fall, the CSR asked why I was closing the account, I told him why, and he offered to take my new application right then.

DNLS said: I am curious, how are people making AORs beneficial with such low interest rates? Are you using several different rewards checking accounts to get APY of ~5%?

Why not? The added bit of effort is about 2-3% extra on upwards of a couple hundred thousand bucks? Adds up a lot over time.

CAll RBS and ask to upgrade your Plat card to the CustomCash version. It should be doable.
I got mine last Aug doing a trick found in the archive: there is a link to it where I applied, but I received the Plat. I called and asked the CustomCash instead, since I had the application printouts, and the upgrade raised no problems (printouts were never asked).
Does RBS send you regularly no-fee BT checks good for BT laundering?

g10ny said: CAll RBS and ask to upgrade your Plat card to the CustomCash version. It should be doable.
I got mine last Aug doing a trick found in the archive: there is a link to it where I applied, but I received the Plat. I called and asked the CustomCash instead, since I had the application printouts, and the upgrade raised no problems (printouts were never asked).
Does RBS send you regularly no-fee BT checks good for BT laundering?I have not received any checks from them since the original BT's. Then again, I pushed all the issuers hard with BT's given my slim history, so I'm sure they weren't inclined to give me good offer's over the last 12 months. It was worth it

MikeR397 said: DNLS said: I am curious, how are people making AORs beneficial with such low interest rates? Are you using several different rewards checking accounts to get APY of ~5%?I have 4 reward checking accounts with a $50k cap (total $200k), and was planning on opening more until they started slashing rates and max balance amounts. I'm still interested in the $50k capped accounts. At $25k cap, the extra ~1.5% after forced purchases is not worth my time as compared to dumping the bulk of the $ in 4% savings accounts. I have CW (3.75%) and Indymac (3.85%) and (AARP (4.05%) right now. I'm hoping rates will creep up over the coming months due to inflation. In any event, I'm currently a law student that has little other income, so my tax bracket is so low, I still make great profit ratios.curious.... how did you manage getting AARP account? are you over 50 (as i recall the age minimum for AARP membership)? or am I missing an obvious loophole here?

Another question: While I've disputed all the personal balances, I haven't disputed any of the balances on my D&B busienss report. Obviously this won't affect my personal apps, but how will it affect my business apps if the balances are still up (85%). I've never pulled my business reports and have no idea what is showing. I'd hate to fire off blanks with all my business apps becuase my balances are still reporting high. Does every issuer pull both the personal and D&B report when issuing a new business card? Suggestions?

MikeR397 said: Another question: While I've disputed all the personal balances, I haven't disputed any of the balances on my D&B busienss report. Obviously this won't affect my personal apps, but how will it affect my business apps if the balances are still up (85%). I've never pulled my business reports and have no idea what is showing. I'd hate to fire off blanks with all my business apps becuase my balances are still reporting high. Does every issuer pull both the personal and D&B report when issuing a new business card? Suggestions? Welcome back, Mike. I fired A0R2.0 with over $200K showing outstanding on my business credit reports. It didn't really seem to have that much impact, to be honest. That was in Feb 2008. Good luck and I'll be following on your heels as A0R1.0 balances should be coming due in late summer.

jackcrawfish said: MikeR397 said: Another question: While I've disputed all the personal balances, I haven't disputed any of the balances on my D&B busienss report. Obviously this won't affect my personal apps, but how will it affect my business apps if the balances are still up (85%). I've never pulled my business reports and have no idea what is showing. I'd hate to fire off blanks with all my business apps becuase my balances are still reporting high. Does every issuer pull both the personal and D&B report when issuing a new business card? Suggestions?per veryhungry Sep 2004 in this thread:eUpdate is the way to check your own dnb rating.

slappycakes thread has paydex score information posted by nummerkins

not many issuers report to d&b. your biz debt will really show up on EQ commercial.

my data point

lhendricks92 said: not many issuers report to d&b. your biz debt will really show up on EQ commercial.
my data pointSo do you think I need to wait for the business balances to clear off to apply for new business cards? There are only 4 business cards with $20k in balances, but the utilization is likely around 85% reporting.

RudolfSchmidt said: I thought the Citi CashReturns 5% offer was dead.Not dead, but I'm not sure that last link has been verified. I'll take a screen shot and hassel the hell out of them if they think they won't give it to me. No guarantee, but I'm very tenacious with these things.

Mike, I see you have Wachovia at the end of your personal and business lists. Do you have a relationship with the bank already? If not, it's going to be a phone app (it may be a phone app. for business cc regardless), and my experience is that they look at your credit report and discuss it with you during the call. Are you sure you'll want to have that conversation?

I don't know how a personal phone app goes. However, when I applied (in branch) for their checking account the banker made a comment indicating that he looked at the number of inquires (he was looking at TU report (I'm in NY), so the number was small). However, it's quite likely than credit card app. is dealt with by a totally different set of people.

For business (no personal experience -- just read fwf) -- iirc, they do discuss the nature of the business and seem to favor those who've been in business for a couple of years. Here's the thread with the relevant posts.

Mike,

I checked out your links for the Citi Diamond Preferred and the Citi Cash Rewards and they don't have a cap on the 0% BT. Are you just signing up for them to help your utilization or have they changed the terms recently?

I don't see anywhere mentions about BT fee for NationalCity biz card
Is it no fee BT or cap? please let me know if you see it somewhere.

Update:

Bank of America World Card Mastercard - 10,700.00 Limit - INSTANT APPROVAL