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Moonbutt's "tabula rasa" AOR 1.0: A little Juniper AA Archived From: Finance

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Yep, I just saw that. Things are changing fast. I might have to just roll the dice early and see what happens.

I plan to go through all the offers this weekend and add some biz cards... that will give me some idea of the speed at which things are moving.


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OK, I've updated the cards in the OP. Eliminated the Chase Platinum MC based on the loss of BT fee cap, and they seem to be tightening up overall (see VerbalK's AOR thread). I'm now looking for more to add.

I've also added three business cards. I'm not certain about the Advanta, as the T&C for all their business cards that I looked at, say:

"Balance transfers must be from business accounts."

Is there a way around that, considering I don't have any biz cards at present?


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Someone in another AOR thread found a personal Chase card that still has the BT cap here. There's also a thread about the Chase BT offers here. Maybe someone will find a business one that is still active.


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Advanta let me ACH to my Biz Checking. I dont know if they changed the policy though, this was a year ago.

Advanta rate jacked me, and others I hear to 35% apr. Ouch. Good thing it is 15mo 0%


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All righty, I've got all the cards except the Chase down to 0 balances, and they should all report by November 5th at the latest. I'm going to go over the offers again this weekend; the planned launch date is now November the 5th or later (right after the election ), and I'll be sticking to the original conservative approach.

There was a news item on the radio this morning about credit card offers getting more stingy; sure enough, the latest two pre--approved offers I got yesterday were worse than before -- a Wamu card with 9% on BT (but 0% on purchases until April 2010, hmmmm) and a Discover card with 1.9% BT rate, 3% uncapped.

I'm hoping that's because of the earlier balances I no longer have...

edit: Maybe not :( It's looking like oustanding balances are likely to be given more weight in their credit risk assessments.


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PolarDude said:Advanta rate jacked me, and others I hear to 35% apr. Ouch. Good thing it is 15mo 0%My Advanta statement shows a standard APR of ~18%, and when I emailed them for the exact expiration date of my promo I also asked if the 0% could be extended. They said no, once it expires on XX/XX the balance will revert to the standard 7.9% rate. That kind of confused me.


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I've added in the WAMU pre-approved offer; it indeed offers 18 months of 0% interest on purchases (needs a BT over $100, easy paydown) *and* is a rewards card that gives me 7k points after the first purchase, good for a $50 gift card.

edit... and free FICO scores too


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OK, going over the cards for this week's launch, I find the following changes:

Discover free stuff offers are GONE, and the link I cribbed from someone else's current AOR for a "More" card is reporting only 7-8 months 0%. I'm going to look for rewards-oriented Discover offers instead of BT.

The AT&T Universal card is now uncapped. There are two of these, one with TYP, so I'm going to use that one.

I also need to add a card with no FOREX fees, for trips to Canada.

Any idea why Fatwallet keeps breaking the links? All the links to https:// sites have an extra http:// inserted in them when I use them, that isn't present in the post's link text.


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Moonbutt said:Any idea why Fatwallet keeps breaking the links? All the links to https:// sites have an extra http:// inserted in them when I use them, that isn't present in the post's link text.
Use "https" or "S" instead of "http" or "L".

Common noob mistake.

Discover has been including lots of offers in junk mail and in sunday newspaper coupon sections. Some of them might be decent if you can't find a better one elsewhere (haven't reviewed them closely).


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markkundinger said:Discover has been including lots of offers in junk mail and in sunday newspaper coupon sections. Some of them might be decent if you can't find a better one elsewhere (haven't reviewed them closely).

I have a fresh Discover pre-approved offer in the mail this week, I don't recall any signup bonuses in it; I'll have to check again. Thanks for the heads up. But it seems that all the ones in the thread that collected them are all gone.

Most of the cards currently in my OP are still good, fortunately. The only thing I goofed was forgetting to pay down the Chase to below 49%. I'm going to go for it anyway, as I plan to stick to no more than 8 total apps for this first go-round.

Now another noob question: I see that others doing AOR's are doing b* immediately afterwards. If I don't plan on seeking any other credit for the next year, is that worth the effort for me?

p.s. fixed the links, thanks for the tip. The symbols here are significantly different from those on other boards I've been on.


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Moonbutt said:markkundinger said:Discover has been including lots of offers in junk mail and in sunday newspaper coupon sections. Some of them might be decent if you can't find a better one elsewhere (haven't reviewed them closely).

I have a fresh Discover pre-approved offer in the mail this week, I don't recall any signup bonuses in it; I'll have to check again. Thanks for the heads up. But it seems that all the ones in the thread that collected them are all gone.

Most of the cards currently in my OP are still good, fortunately. The only thing I goofed was forgetting to pay down the Chase to below 49%. I'm going to go for it anyway, as I'm going to stick to no more than 8 total apps for this first go-round.

Now another noob question: I see that others doing AOR's are doing b* immediately afterwards. If I don't plan on seeking any other credit for the next year, is that worth the effort for me?

p.s. fixed the links, thanks for the tip. The symbols here are significantly different from those on other boards I've been on.

One ground for adverse action after an AOR is number of inquiries. If you can bump them off, you take away that basis for a massive account closure. Of course, if your new accounts are not business, they can still see those new accounts.


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Moonbutt said:Discover free stuff offers are GONE, and the link I cribbed from someone else's current AOR for a "More" card is reporting only 7-8 months 0%. I'm going to look for rewards-oriented Discover offers instead of BT.

I think you are looking at the 0% term for purchases. Most of the Discover more offers have shorter purchase 0% terms than BT. The BT terms are usually 12 months.


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peteypablo said:One ground for adverse action after an AOR is number of inquiries. If you can bump them off, you take away that basis for a massive account closure. Of course, if your new accounts are not business, they can still see those new accounts.

I've already noted the information in the OP of the "choppage" thread. I'm going to have to read the whole thing through and make up my mind about whether I'm willing to be that dedicated -- or chicken out for now and just focus on finding a new home for the Chase debt, and a backup or two for the TrueEarnings card.

At least my current gig looks like it will extend into next summer; as it pays the best I've had yet, I can really go to town on moving towards debt-free status.

I'm going to be really busy digging in the data mines here today, especially with regards to what people are seeing in the last few weeks


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Moonbutt said:Now another noob question: I see that others doing AOR's are doing b* immediately afterwards. If I don't plan on seeking any other credit for the next year, is that worth the effort for me?
As PP noted, the main advantage would be reducing the chance of adverse action. If the bank isn't going to review your account for two months, and you can bump inquiries in one month, it might help a wee bit. Also, after a year, the inquiries won't affect FICO anymore, however, inquiries over a year old may still make prospective lenders sad for various reasons.


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Within a week, I have THREE WaMu solicitations, for the exact same offer. After noting Aquone's crappy results with them even with offer, I was thinking of striking them off the list -- but three distinct offers? Maybe I could apply for all three at once, then consolidate

In other news, tonight all cards should have reported, and everything will be in place for apps, either tomorrow or Thursday morning.

Now another n00b question: any suggestions regarding the order of apps? I'm thinking of doing the BoA card or USBank cards first, as those are the debt carrier candidates that get top priority.


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I rank in order of "desirability", whatever that is.

Debt carrierness would add to desirability.


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Just found your A0R thread... My random comments:

Nice job getting prepared with low inquiries and no recent newly opened accounts. I think you'll do well.

If you could hide that high utilized account, (even get it down into the 35%'ish area...) I'm sure you will get great results. If you can't hide it you still will probably will do well just more risk of not getting the best possible results, IMO.

Too bad you don't have a BoA credit card with the enhanced billpay feature, which can be used to pay other credit cards while maintaining grace period. That would be a great way to "float" temporarily a large balance onto a BoA card.

BoA is also really easy to reallocate and BT with.

I noticed you have three citi's: a driver's edge for rewards it seems and two BT cards. If you want to try paring that down, I hear you can BT with citi right away, pay it completely off before the end of 12 months, then you'll see the 12-mo no fee BT offer re-appear again, trigger that a second time before it expires and get another 12 months. Using that strategy could reduce the need to get two citi 0% BT cards. (Although associated bank is possibly a good strategy for extra CL buckets.) Just beware of too many citi apps. Don't do more than three.

Consider the citi platinum am ex instead of the driver's edge for a good purchases card. The 3-5 typ per dollar on everything really kicks a$$. But I hear drivers edge could do pretty well you just don't get the 3% on eBay/paypal, etc.

Looks like some nice juicy BT offers are still to be had! I see you've found lots with no BT fees, wow! Good to know they are still there!

Also, given the uncertainty with the pre-approved Wa Mu offer, if you decide to go for it (which I'll be very interested it hear about how it goes, if you do) I'd recommend putting it high up on the list! Go for the max 30k CL. Remember it will undoubtedly pull TU.

Remember that BoA and Citi report new accounts as quickly as 2-3 days after opening on EX! Be sure to get all your apps done before any new accounts hit your report.

Your discover application is invalid. (If you do apply for some other discover app though, I'd put it low on the list. They are pretty stingy with credit limits.)

Glitch99 said:The last I paid attention to it, AMEX reports the statement balance on the first day of the second month after the statement closes. So your statement closes Sept 17, that amount will be reported on/about Nov 1st. Some other issuers also report on the first of each month, but without hte extra month's lag.

To add another data point to Glitch's on Am Ex reporting, I have an Am Ex IN:LA credit card that statement cycles on the 27th of each month. This usually hits the credit reports about 2 weeks later on the 13-14th of the following month, however I found instances where it reported as quickly as the 9th and as late as the 15th.


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Moonbutt said:Within a week, I have THREE WaMu solicitations, for the exact same offer. After noting Aquone's crappy results with them even with offer, I was thinking of striking them off the list -- but three distinct offers? Maybe I could apply for all three at once, then consolidate I was also getting these offers every other day. I jumped on one of them because of the 10% gas rebate for 6mo. I received a 30k CL.


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Hi jakeru,

Re: AM3X reporting, you are right -- they haven't yet reported as of right now.. it still shows the $3.3k balance from the previous cycle instead of the credit balance it had on the 17th, when mine cycles. Blast it, that's the biggest balance I have left other than the Chase card. I need it gone.. hopefully soon. BOA plain ol' VISA reports 0, the Ducks should be so by tomorrow.

Re: "enhanced" BOA bill pay, how would I know if I have that? I use BP extensively for everything.

I'm avoiding any more AM3X for now, all that AA talk has me spooked. I like the TrueEarnings card and don't want it crunched. Besides, I have 110 miles daily commute (in a hybrid), so the driver's edge could work out quite well for me.

You are right about the Citi cardz, I noticed that you can do BT in the 11th month and still get 12 mo 0% from that date. As Citi is skittish as all get out these days, judging from other AOR threads, I'm fine with stepping back to just one personal and one biz with them.

US Bank, on the other hand, is going strong. I just got an interesting offer today from them with 0% purchase 12mo, and no-fee BT's at 3.99% for SIXTY billing cycles. Weird. It seems like the issuers are starting to do some of these odd combinations instead of straight-up 0% no-fee cards. Their cards seem to be the best no-fee 0% options after the BOA option; should I try for more than one with them (perhaps the Linux + this offer)? Or is that a bad idea seeing as I have no existing or prior relationship with them?

In any case, until the BOA and AM3X report in with zero balances, I'm on hold.


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BoA's "enhanced" billpay is called Billpay Choice, I think. Anyway you log into online banking then click billpay. It doesn't come with any BoA cc though, only certain ones. I got it grandfathered it on from my old MBNA card (acquired by BoA) which had the feature, and then some time earlier this year I found the feature got applied to all (3) of my BoA cards. Coolness. I think I recall some people have reported getting it by applying to the Fidelity card (which is serviced by FiA/BoA)
fw thread here

Since you have obviously not hit BoA's credit exposure ceiling yet (as they granted you all the last CLI you asked for without making a counter-offer, etc) you might try a cli on your plain vanilla BoA. Aim high. It only incurs a soft pull (as you probably already well aware) and I think you will end up with larger overall BoA limits if you did that first before apply for a new BoA cc (if you do end up applying for one.)


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