As I mentioned in My main AOR 3.0 Thread, I'm going to start seperate threads for different family members as the nuclear approach with everyone in one thread last year in AOR 2.0 (see here) created a mess that was difficult to follow; and I think I lost some good feedback because of it.
This thread is a work in progress. I'll update later with planned application links, but most will probably be simliar to my main AOR thread linked above.
Dad's pretty much ready to go. His biggest concern is not loosing his HELOC from 5/3 b/c its prime - 1%. Its a $188k line with $150k of balances I'm currently borrowing for simple arbitrage at a cost of 2.25% (and he gets the tax advantage). I've been trying to get him to do a full draw, but he won't listen to me that is safer to do full draw than partial draw in that they can't cut your line if you are fully drawn. The other big concern is not to push his AOR too hard that causes some massive AA. He has some crazy high CL's already, so at least overall utilization should be pretty low, but balances can add up very fast. With the HELOC balances and his mortgage, he's around a 750 FICO, but that is also b/c he had some problems with a misreported deliquent doctor's bill for $200 about 2 years ago that reports as "paid" but still really hurts his score. It used to be ~800.
Dad took AOR 2.0 off b/c he was considering refinancing his mortgage and I didn't want to push things (have to pick your battles), but we are ready for another round:
Dad's Major Existing Credit Lines:
Personal Lines: 1. Fifth Third HELOC at Prime - 1% - $188k CL, $150k balance currently used for arbitrage (trying to convince him to do full draw). 2. AMEX personal cc's - $37.2k available (anyone know a good use for this?) 3. Chase Sony $20k - considering chase consolidation is dead, doesn't look to help much here. 4. Chase Marriott - $4.6k 5. Citi Cash Returns - $19.8k (used to have about $75k, but family wide AA happened. I think his $25k Professional might be open) 6. Discover More - $12k across two cards 7. HSBC - $12.5k 8. Juniper - $22.5k across two cards (used to be $33k, $10k AA at some point I guess) 9. National City - $20k (do I need to close this to get a new card? do they consolidate?) 10. RBS - $19.5k across two cards 11. US Bank - $23k 12. USAA - $25k 13. Bank of America - $125k across Schwabb and WorldPoints cards (won't use for AOR $, are daily spender and alternative use)
Total Personal Credit: $341.1k + about $15k other small lines in total = $355k
Business Lines: 1. Bank of America - $14.5k 2. Fifth Third - $10k 3. Chase Business - $50k (anyone know of a good use for this? feel free to PM) 4. National City - $25k 5. Bank Atlantic - $27k (Do they allow two cards?)
Total Business Credit: $126.5k HELOC Line at 2.25%: $188k
Total Credit Lines: $670.5k
I think those are all his current open cards. There was probably about $100k more credit that was axed due to AA and/or closure, like Advanta and Wamu credit that was apparantly lost in the Chase converstion. It would be great to use about 2/3 total of all this, not sure if that will happen, but who knows, maybe some issuers will still give him new credit as well.
I'll update this thread and post as I make further progress. I'm hoping to have this fired off in a couple days.
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-07-21 23:36:41 CDT
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MikeR397 said: Business Lines: 3. Chase Business - $50k (anyone know of a good use for this? feel free to PM)
One use I discovered recently is that you can link a credit card to a checking account as an overdraft protection account. When you overdraw your checking account, it automatically does a cash advance against the business card at the cash advance rate, but WITHOUT any cash advance fees (normally 3%). The only charge is a $10 fixed overdraft fee. This gives two benefits: 1) if you need cash for a few days to roll a personal balance when the statement cuts and the balance is reported, or 2) to launder BT money.
I had a business card with a decent limit that was not utilized since the 0% BT offer ended. I hadn't received any BT offers in a while. I started using it for these two reasons, and a month or two later got a some BT checks for .99% for 6 months or 5.99% for 2 years. Then I cashed out the limit with the 2 year fixed BT check.
I personally believe I got the checks because I started to show some high balance activity on the card. Hope this helps.
Thanks for keeping the threads separate. (toot! toot! 2.0 on record in favor of distinct threads).
His two Juniper cards and Bank Atlantic card can be merged into a mega Juniper biz card. Apply for the biz card and call the credit department telephone number. After transferring you to a super-ninja they can draw from all of Dad's current lines & close the existing BankAtlantic line to approve a new Juni biz card.
Per teammjs comment here, it seems that you shouldn't close Dad's NatCity account(s). teammjs said "You can call to move NCity CLs between cards if approved. They'll send you out a letter to sign asking for the CL move and you send it back and they make the change."
I'm not sure whether Dad plans on applying for RBS card but consolidation between accounts is feasible as long as they are not Kroger 123 reward cards (reference).
Thanks Jack! I just called Bank Atlantic to make sure the card was still open, and I guess he got a CLI from $22.5k to $27k. Nice. So that makes $60k of existing Bank Atlantic business credit that can be used for 13 months!
Do you know if I can move business credit back to the personal side once I am done with the BT? I'm pretty sure he'll want to use his personal Juniper line again at some point, and will probably be pissed at me if he can't get access to it. I guess I should call and ask.
With National City, do you know if you can move credit across the business/personal lines? Both directions? It'd be great to get another $50k BT on the business side (although its only 6 months unfortunately).
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-07-20 12:53:22 CDT
BTW, my mom and dad have $40k of BOA business credit that neither has used for the last year. It's too bad they don't allow Bill Pay with thier business cards.
MikeR397 said:Thanks Jack! I just called Bank Atlantic to make sure the card was still open, and I guess he got a CLI from $22.5k to $27k. Nice. So that makes $60k of existing Bank Atlantic business credit that can be used for 13 months!
Do you know if I can move business credit back to the personal side once I am done with the BT? I'm pretty sure he'll want to use his personal Juniper line again at some point, and will probably be pissed at me if he can't get access to it. I guess I should call and ask.
With National City, do you know if you can move credit across the business/personal lines? Both directions? It'd be great to get another $50k BT on the business side (although its only 6 months unfortunately).lhendricks92 taught me last year to move from Barclays biz to Barclays personal. Read a few of the posts in the linked 2.0 thread of mine from last year.
I'm of no help on National City line movement between biz/personal.
1. Call and move $27k Bank Atlantic Line to Personal Juniper Card, creating a $60k personal CL. Close Bank Atlantic Card. 2. Apply for 13 mo 0% Bank Atlantic offer (hopefully getting even more credit). 3. One way or the other, move $60k from personal card to Bank Atlantic, creating a $60k+ business line. 4. Due to their $20k max BT rule, I'll have to do 3 seperate $20k BT's, at $99 each, right? I don't think there is a way around this, but I'll happily pay $99 for $20k of 0% business credit.
5. I thought I saw some prior reports about Bank Atlantic reporting to personal credit lines now? Is this true? Universal?
ETA: Crap, it looks like his personal line suffered some unnoticed AA last year, and is now down to $22.5k from $33k, leaving him with about $50k of total credit.
lhendricks92, your wishes are always most appreciated .
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-07-21 23:26:18 CDT
MikeR397 said:5. I thought I saw some prior reports about Bank Atlantic reporting to personal credit lines now? Is this true? Universal?you've contributed so much, Mike. Thanks.
Here's what I found regarding Biz to personal report (Barclays)...
jackcrawfish said:MikeR397 said:5. I thought I saw some prior reports about Bank Atlantic reporting to personal credit lines now? Is this true? Universal?you've contributed so much, Mike. Thanks.
Here's what I found regarding Biz to personal report (Barclays)...
estragon in 2007 said people at creditboards were claiming Juni Biz lines reported to personal report.
IIRC, hindustani or markkundinger reported somewhere else that they had their biz line show up AND THEY WERE CURRENT. I cannot find the post tonight. I just pulled Dad's credit and can confirm that his existing card does not show up. I looked for Barclays, Bank Atlantic, and Juniper. Nothing there. So hopefully, we can keep this $50k prospecitive balance hidden should this plan be successful. Thanks!
Just called Bank Atlantic, asked for credit management. Moved $27k to Dad's personal card, creating a ~$45k CL on his National Parks card and a $5k CL on his US Air card. Closed the Bank Atlantic card. (its awesome that they let both direction moves of credit to/from business/personal!).
In his AOR, only Barclays card he'll apply for is a new Bank Atlantic. Who knows, perhaps he'll get approved with more credit (I'm going to ask for a $20k BT with the application), but if he's denied b/c of sufficient existing credit, I'll call in ask them to approve the card by moving his personal credit to the new business card.
End goal will be to move about $42k over to a new 13 mo 0% Bank Atlantic business card and do (2) $20k BT's at $99 fee each at 0% interest (too bad they don't just let you do a $20k+ BT to save the double BT fee). I'll leave some credit ($8k) on his US Air personal card in case he wants to start using it as his daily spender. I don't really think paying a $99 fee is worth it for another ~$9k BT, and I'm sure he won't be happy if I close the US Air card.
Super thanks to Jackcrawfish and all those in his thread that made this process so easy for me .
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-07-22 15:38:43 CDT
Dad applied for Bank Atlantic. Deferred. Then, just like my sister, I checked the status online and it said denied right away. I'm goign to call them and make sure of this, since online gives an error when I try to check details. Hopefully I can convince them to change thier mind, as it'd be nice to have $40k+ out in business credit at 0% for 13 months.
Bank Atlantic told me online that I was denied a few months ago, then send me a letter congratulating me on being approved. I think something is messed up in their online system.
Reots said:If that medical bill is paid why isn't your Dad using the Hippa process to have it removed pronto?But doesn't that only help with reported items that "somehow violate his privacy" by showing up on the CRA, such as if it said "Plastic Surgeons, Inc"? His collection account says "Collection Account, $0 balance, paid, MEDICAL, paid, 3/1/2007" and nothing else. Is there still some way Hippa can help remove this entry when it just says "medical" and other basic stuff?
He's already disputed it on the CRA's before, and all that did was change the balance owed from ~$250 to $0, but the entry itself still showed up as a collection account and while his scores improved a lot, they are still a far cry from where they used to be. A subsequent request to remove the entry entirely was not granted.
Thanks for this!
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-08-16 02:17:06 CDT
joemama15 said:MikeR397 said: Business Lines: 3. Chase Business - $50k (anyone know of a good use for this? feel free to PM)
One use I discovered recently is that you can link a credit card to a checking account as an overdraft protection account. When you overdraw your checking account, it automatically does a cash advance against the business card at the cash advance rate, but WITHOUT any cash advance fees (normally 3%). The only charge is a $10 fixed overdraft fee. This gives two benefits: 1) if you need cash for a few days to roll a personal balance when the statement cuts and the balance is reported, or 2) to launder BT money.
I had a business card with a decent limit that was not utilized since the 0% BT offer ended. I hadn't received any BT offers in a while. I started using it for these two reasons, and a month or two later got a some BT checks for .99% for 6 months or 5.99% for 2 years. Then I cashed out the limit with the 2 year fixed BT check.
I personally believe I got the checks because I started to show some high balance activity on the card. Hope this helps.
Chase business 50K? I have the same card 53K limit it was chase business cash rebate. No point program. I called and figured they would offer worldpoints or something. They said no sir no points for this card. Would you like us to close it? I said leave it alone.
robertw477 said:joemama15 said:MikeR397 said: Business Lines: 3. Chase Business - $50k (anyone know of a good use for this? feel free to PM)
One use I discovered recently is that you can link a credit card to a checking account as an overdraft protection account. When you overdraw your checking account, it automatically does a cash advance against the business card at the cash advance rate, but WITHOUT any cash advance fees (normally 3%). The only charge is a $10 fixed overdraft fee. This gives two benefits: 1) if you need cash for a few days to roll a personal balance when the statement cuts and the balance is reported, or 2) to launder BT money.
I had a business card with a decent limit that was not utilized since the 0% BT offer ended. I hadn't received any BT offers in a while. I started using it for these two reasons, and a month or two later got a some BT checks for .99% for 6 months or 5.99% for 2 years. Then I cashed out the limit with the 2 year fixed BT check.
I personally believe I got the checks because I started to show some high balance activity on the card. Hope this helps.
Chase business 50K? I have the same card 53K limit it was chase business cash rebate. No point program. I called and figured they would offer worldpoints or something. They said no sir no points for this card. Would you like us to close it? I said leave it alone.
RobHis $50k business card does earn the standard 1% rewards. I've earned about 150k of them before, but that was before the Schwabb card came out . Now, this CL just idles and I have nothing to do with it. He did get some BT offer Checks In The Mail for 5 months .99%, but had an uncapped 3% fee that they refused to waive. No thanks.
Message edited by: MikeR397 on 2009-08-16 18:38:41 CDT
MikeR397 said:Dad applied for Bank Atlantic. Deferred. Then, just like my sister, I checked the status online and it said denied right away. I'm goign to call them and make sure of this, since online gives an error when I try to check details. Hopefully I can convince them to change thier mind, as it'd be nice to have $40k+ out in business credit at 0% for 13 months.FINALLY got around to calling Bank Atlantic about my Dad. They asked income stuff real quick, looked over things, and instantly offered to move $44.6k over from his National Parks personal card. They said if I want any higher than $50k total exposure (he has another Juniper card that was $15k but reduced to $5k in 2008 credit crunch), that they'd have to get income verification and further documentation for review, which I declined, saying $44,600 was adequate. I guess thier policy is that anyone who has over $50k before got cut to $50k, and if they want to go back over, docs are needed. I passed on that hassel, although I probably could have got him a little more credit (but at the expense of hasseling him more than I want to produce the docs).
I suppose I still have to do the 2x $20k transfers only at $99k each, rather than one $44k transfer? Also, I think you also can only send funds to another cc, right, as they don't give BT checks or do direct deposit?
This was a big win today for at a minimum $40k at 0% max $198 fee for 13 months. I'm glad I finally called.
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