A while back a pretty nasty hail storm came through and caused quite a bit of roof damage in my neighborhood. At first glance my roof seemed OK, but with contractors floating around the neighborhood I figured I'd flag one down and have them take a look. The front side was relatively unscathed, but the back was pretty beat up. The contractor and I talked a bit and I ended up filing a claim. Several neighbors did the same, and have since had their roofs replaced.
I on the other hand, have had nothing but trouble. The inspector looked at the roof, and said they wouldn't pay because the shingles were degraded due to age. The house is 9 years old, roughly the same age as the rest of the neighborhood. I know they are low quality shingles, but even I could see some pretty obvious hail hits on otherwise good condition shingles. Even the gutters had dents in them. I called back and asked for a re-inspection with the roofing guy present and a few days ago received a letter that said they were still going to deny the claim.
During the storm, one piece of siding on the house had a pretty nice hole knocked in it, and they did pay for that. I'm not sure if they are thinking this is enough to buy me off or what. My next door neighbor uses a small insurance company, and they redid his entire roof and both skylights with no hassle. Any ideas to get my company to cover the damage? I'm not sure what other details I need to include but let me know and I can get them.
SiGuyUWP said: A while back a pretty nasty hail storm came through and caused quite a bit of roof damage in my neighborhood. At first glance my roof seemed OK, but with contractors floating around the neighborhood I figured I'd flag one down and have them take a look. The front side was relatively unscathed, but the back was pretty beat up. The contractor and I talked a bit and I ended up filing a claim. Several neighbors did the same, and have since had their roofs replaced.
I on the other hand, have had nothing but trouble. The inspector looked at the roof, and said they wouldn't pay because the shingles were degraded due to age. The house is 9 years old, roughly the same age as the rest of the neighborhood. I know they are low quality shingles, but even I could see some pretty obvious hail hits on otherwise good condition shingles. Even the gutters had dents in them. I called back and asked for a re-inspection with the roofing guy present and a few days ago received a letter that said they were still going to deny the claim.
During the storm, one piece of siding on the house had a pretty nice hole knocked in it, and they did pay for that. I'm not sure if they are thinking this is enough to buy me off or what. My next door neighbor uses a small insurance company, and they redid his entire roof and both skylights with no hassle. Any ideas to get my company to cover the damage? I'm not sure what other details I need to include but let me know and I can get them.
This is total BS. They HAVE to cover your roof, plain and simple. If your company is Nationwide I may be able to help you out. I have many friends that work at their corporate headquarters. Shoot me a PM if it is.
kenblakely
Senior Member - 2K
posted: Oct. 26, 2009 @ 8:51p
The one-word answer for all insurance problems is USAA
Contact your state insurance commissioner and file a complaint. That might get your company moving on this. Insurance companies hate handling complaints from the insurance commissioner's office.
Document in a letter what has happened so far and threaten to file a bad-faith lawsuit if the claim is not paid immediately. And file the suit if the claim isn't paid.
Talk to your local agent first (if there is one). If no immediate results, then confirm your policy language and then go with your state insurance commission.
Everyone loves to tell you that you should get an attorney, but keep in mind - (1) the cost of that attorney might exceed the cost of your roof repairs and his services won't guarantee you a win; (2) insurance companies have departments staffed with nothing but attorneys - you threatening to sue them will only give one of those salaried attorneys something to do.
bigdaddycincinnati said: Document in a letter what has happened so far and threaten to file a bad-faith lawsuit if the claim is not paid immediately. And file the suit if the claim isn't paid. Document. Then go to the state regulators. They will know U R serious. Consider the courts only as the last resort, not the first.
Insurance companies are very wary about bad-faith claims because they can be hit with punitive damages. The repeated denial of a clear-cut homeowner's claim (which is what the OP alleges that he has) is insurer bad faith. Letting the insurer know that you understand bad-faith claims very well may result in a quick reversal of their decision.
turtlebug said: Contact your state insurance commissioner and file a complaint. That might get your company moving on this. Insurance companies hate handling complaints from the insurance commissioner's office.
The commissioners office has NO power I've been through this before in more than one state and it is a waste of time.
Get another appraiser and get a different roof guy. Start over. Then if that doesn't work get an attorney.
A year ago a major hailstorm caused replacements on 7/10 roofs in a 5 mile radius! The insurances companies bent over backwards for us and everyone around us. The one guy who had trouble was an attorney and said the word 'arbitration' that was all it took to get a new roof
wackyrabbit said: turtlebug said: Contact your state insurance commissioner and file a complaint. That might get your company moving on this. Insurance companies hate handling complaints from the insurance commissioner's office.
The commissioners office has NO power I've been through this before in more than one state and it is a waste of time.
Get another appraiser and get a different roof guy. Start over. Then if that doesn't work get an attorney.
A year ago a major hailstorm caused replacements on 7/10 roofs in a 5 mile radius! The insurances companies bent over backwards for us and everyone around us. The one guy who had trouble was an attorney and said the word 'arbitration' that was all it took to get a new roof
I'm sorry that going this route did not help in your prior situation(s), but speaking from experience, receiving a complaint from the Insurance Commissioner's office does get the company's attention. In addition to contacting his IC, the OP could also secure a couple of damage estimates verifying hail damage and submit them with photographs and a certified letter (RRR) demanding that his carrier pay his claim within "X" period of time [set a deadline, keep copies of everything and document any & all phone conversations]. If the company denies the claim in writing or fails to respond before the deadline, he may potentialy have a bad faith case.
This is just my personal opinion and is not intended as any form of legal advice. You should seek the opinion of an attorney for legal advice.
handymanforhire
Member
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 7:42a
Hi, I am in the construction industry in Atlanta area SW. Hail storms here caused a great deal of damage, and yes many roofs were and are being replaced. Often times, adjusters are hired by companies when catastrophic evens occur...even though they have no real "hail" experience. Did your adjuster walk the roof? Did your contractor walk the roof with him/her? You have the option also of hiring your own private inspector, preferably a CAT adjuster with hail damage experience. You can directly appeal the decision, with an adjuster’s inspection report. Prior to going to the Insurance Commissioners offices. Most times...a private hire adjuster works just fine. If your contractor was NOT there during the adjusters inspection, certainly request another one...and have EXPERIENCED roofing company there to meet and walk the roof. Many times...every day roofers...are not.....verbally strong with their knowledge Please use a well educated...in business for years....type of contractor...who can represent his/her company and your hail damage well. This is my first reply...hope it helps!
handymanforhire said: Hi, I am in the construction industry in Atlanta area SW. Hail storms here caused a great deal of damage, and yes many roofs were and are being replaced. Often times, adjusters are hired by companies when catastrophic evens occur...even though they have no real "hail" experience. Did your adjuster walk the roof? Did your contractor walk the roof with him/her? You have the option also of hiring your own private inspector, preferably a CAT adjuster with hail damage experience. You can directly appeal the decision, with an adjuster’s inspection report. Prior to going to the Insurance Commissioners offices. Most times...a private hire adjuster works just fine. If your contractor was NOT there during the adjusters inspection, certainly request another one...and have EXPERIENCED roofing company there to meet and walk the roof. Many times...every day roofers...are not.....verbally strong with their knowledge Please use a well educated...in business for years....type of contractor...who can represent his/her company and your hail damage well. This is my first reply...hope it helps!
Welcome to FW! Thanks for the informative post.
ziffy
Broke Member
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 9:25a
Get yourself an independent adjuster, the one that works for you. They usually charged based on the % of the $$$ that you can collect from the insurance company. If you get the good one, they usually be able to help you collect enough money to pay the adjuster and to do your complete repair. Good luck
I think about 95% of people from Cincinnati have dealt with the insurance company with regard to storm damage over the past year. I know of some friends that had some absolute horror stories in trying to get roofs repaired. The net takeaway is that it all depends on your company and coverage.
Sternforpres said: Exactly why I am dropping my wind/hail insurance this year.
You're usually covered on any standard homeowner's policy; what you're thinking of is you wind/hail optional DEDUCTIBLE on your policy. This is used to save you money, not to increase it.
Example- say your policy says Wind/Hail 5%. What that really means is that ANY wind/hail claims have a deductible of 5% of the coverage of your house. If your home coverage is for say $150,000, your deductible is $7500 for ANY claim.
Wow, thanks for all the responses. I'll try to cover all responses here. My initial plan is to call the company again (American Family). The inspector that they have sent inspected the roof once by himself, and the second time with my contractor. I'm in WI, and the inspector is from FL which I found odd but I'm not an expert in these things. I'm going to ask that a local inspector be sent this time and be sure the roofing contractor can make it as well. Should that not work out I'll look into an independent appraiser, something I hadn't thought about. I guess the next step after that would be talking to state insurance regulators, which would be easy being that live 10 minutes from the capitol.
I will get up on the roof and take some photos, that is a really good idea. Thanks a ton everyone, and if I didn't address your point feel free to yell at me and I'll get back to you. I'm going to call AmFam shortly and I'll post up the results.
whynotgo
New Member
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 12:11p
SiGuyUWP said: Wow, thanks for all the responses. I'll try to cover all responses here. My initial plan is to call the company again (American Family). The inspector that they have sent inspected the roof once by himself, and the second time with my contractor. I'm in WI, and the inspector is from FL which I found odd but I'm not an expert in these things. I'm going to ask that a local inspector be sent this time and be sure the roofing contractor can make it as well. Should that not work out I'll look into an independent appraiser, something I hadn't thought about. I guess the next step after that would be talking to state insurance regulators, which would be easy being that live 10 minutes from the capitol.
I will get up on the roof and take some photos, that is a really good idea. Thanks a ton everyone, and if I didn't address your point feel free to yell at me and I'll get back to you. I'm going to call AmFam shortly and I'll post up the results.
I had a similar situation five years ago. My neighbors were getting roofing, siding, etc. replaced and my adjuster said, "no or little damage". I wrote a very informative letter to the insurance company (I copied my local agent and all the persons I could find in the home office). I got instant positive results. I can send you the letter (with personal information omitted). Let me know (do this by a Private Message).
Pictures - Take pictures of your neighbors repairs (preferably) with contractor present.
Google Satellite Map - Get your neighborhood sat photo and annotate all the houses that got repairs with the specific repairs.
In short, you will embarrass the original adjuster and the company into doing the right thing.
In my opinion,
1. Lawyers - Great way to help lawyers collect fees, not very effective for the amount spent (bad payback).
2. State Insurance Commissioner - Make your formal complaint to the company first.
Had the same exact thing happen about 10 years ago, insurance company was State Farm. Filed complaint with state insurance commission and attorney general's office and within 2 weeks, got a call from state farm's HQ saying to have roof & shutters (yes, damage dented wood shutters) fixed. That taught me to drop SF like a hot potato (had had them for about 25 years with no claims) and get a company that was reputable. Also, found out that local agent's can't and will NOT do anything for you as they do not want to lose the gravy-train setup they enjoy. They are paid liars of the insurance companies, treat them as such. (Neighbors with Farm Bureau, AllState, etc. had no problems getting hail damage repaired.)
OP, as soon as you get the repairs done, change insurers, if they are cheap, now you know why!
Xnarg
Senior Member - 5K
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 2:12p
Mickie3 said: Had the same exact thing happen about 10 years ago, insurance company was State Farm. Filed complaint with state insurance commission and attorney general's office and within 2 weeks, got a call from state farm's HQ saying to have roof & shutters (yes, damage dented wood shutters) fixed. That taught me to drop SF like a hot potato (had had them for about 25 years with no claims) and get a company that was reputable. Also, found out that local agent's can't and will NOT do anything for you as they do not want to lose the gravy-train setup they enjoy. They are paid liars of the insurance companies, treat them as such. (Neighbors with Farm Bureau, AllState, etc. had no problems getting hail damage repaired.)
OP, as soon as you get the repairs done, change insurers, if they are cheap, now you know why! We filed one home damage claim w/ State Farm and they paid right away with no hassle at all. Their adjuster went around and found damage we didn't even know about and covered that as well.
When a family member lost his home due to a major CA fire, he was paid in full by State Farm faster than most of his neighbors who had other carriers.
Maybe YMMV when it comes to carrier responsiveness.
psyteet
New Member
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 4:19p
First please don't blast me!!! I am actually an insurance adjuster. I travel the country going from storm to storm and also work locally when there are no storms. I have handled thousands of claims and met with thousands of adjusters. There are many things you should consider on both sides.
First, it is possible that your first adjuster knew nothing about hail damage and what to look for. On the other hand its also true that your contractor may know very little about hail damage and what to look for. I have met with hundreds of contractors many of which know what damage is and many that have no idea and try to say things such as pitting and scaring is hail damage.
Second, just because your neighbor’s roof is damaged does not always mean that your roof is damaged. I have inspected whole neighborhoods before and seen every other house damaged. Hail and tornado's are crazy beasts and weather works in crazy ways sometimes. But if like you said you see dings in your gutter than likely you did get pelted. Did you point this out to the adjuster? In most cases gutters, screens and siding are good signs of how much hail you received and the size of the hail.
Third, likely if you had a second adjuster come out he probably has more experience than the original adjuster. There has to be a reason that they are denying the claim. UNLIKE POPULAR BELIEF MOST ADJUSTERS ACTUALLY MAKE MORE MONEY WHEN THERE IS MORE DAMAGE. There is really no reason an adjuster would deny it unless the damage is questionable and in such a case would leave it up to the claims office.
I have worked for all major insurance companies and there is no one company that is better than others. Switching companies does very little in most cases because everything is region by region and all companies have to follow the same laws and basically write the same HO policies across the board. Just because a company pays or denies something now does not mean they will handle it the same way with the next storm.
If you have photos send them to me and I will take a look at them and try to help you out.
I was shocked when State Farm paid for my new roof after a hail storm. I would have never asked accept that the storm chasers set up shop. Never use the storm chasers (roofers). Most are Madoff's.
dcg9381
Senior Member - 1K
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 9:15p
The lowest quality shingle I know of is the "20 year" single. They should depreciate the value of your roof, but I see no basis for denying the claim. Talk to your state dept of insurance.
dcg9381
Senior Member - 1K
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 9:20p
psyteet said: I have worked for all major insurance companies and there is no one company that is better than others. Switching companies does very little in most cases because everything is region by region and all companies have to follow the same laws and basically write the same HO policies across the board.
Having been a consumer and used several major insurance companies, I couldn't disagree more.
Several insurance carriers clearly lowballed the few auto claims I had (all not at fault). One to the tune of $4000 short. I suppose I could simply blame the adjuster... But insurance companies hire the adjusters.
USAA's response to lowball claims from other adjusters: 1) We'll send out our own appraiser and give you a written estimate on the spot. 2) Claim it with us, we won't raise your rates - you will be out the deductible until we settle it with the at-fault insurance company.
USAA appraisals of damage have *always* come in higher.. Coincidence? Perhaps... I just send their estimates to the at-fault company... We're talking total losses here, not repair estimates - so the "evaluation" shouldn't vary very much.
psyteet
New Member
posted: Oct. 27, 2009 @ 9:41p
dcg9381, The last time I checked we were talking about Homeowners insurance here. I personally am a residential and commercial property adjuster and have no ties or experience with auto policies or claims. You can disagree but please read to actually know what you are disagreeing about.
Comparing Auto policies to Home owner policies is like comparing Life insurance policies to home owner policies. The only thing they have in common is the word insurance, they are completely different and handled accordingly.
dcg9381 said: psyteet said: I have worked for all major insurance companies and there is no one company that is better than others. Switching companies does very little in most cases because everything is region by region and all companies have to follow the same laws and basically write the same HO policies across the board.
Having been a consumer and used several major insurance companies, I couldn't disagree more.
Several insurance carriers clearly lowballed the few auto claims I had (all not at fault). One to the tune of $4000 short. I suppose I could simply blame the adjuster... But insurance companies hire the adjusters.
USAA's response to lowball claims from other adjusters: 1) We'll send out our own appraiser and give you a written estimate on the spot. 2) Claim it with us, we won't raise your rates - you will be out the deductible until we settle it with the at-fault insurance company.
USAA appraisals of damage have *always* come in higher.. Coincidence? Perhaps... I just send their estimates to the at-fault company... We're talking total losses here, not repair estimates - so the "evaluation" shouldn't vary very much. He clearly said HO (Home-Owners) policies, not auto policies
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