Salary Negotiations - Helpful tips?

IMHO (I don't work in insurance) - but I have worked for large corps:
Your salary is fixed in a range for that position. It'll be tied to experience. For an internal transfer, there will be very little - if any - room to negotiate.

Negotiate on the next job (with a new employer)

Glitch99 said: mrmartin86 said: One, even during a recession, HR had to go through dozens of candidates to finally decide on "you" as the ideal candidate, so they don't necessarily want to "settle" on second-best if they don't have to Or perhaps that was the attitude of their first choice, and you're the one they are settling for....

Hmmm, haven't thought of that. But some of the people I work with currently applied and have gotten the position because they are hiring about 18 more people because they are expanding the area in which we handle. I tossed my hat into the ring late, to see if there were any openings left, Tuesday morning, had a phone interview Tuesday afternoon with the recruiter, confirmed that I would receive a face-to-face interview with 3 people (confirmed the interview for Thursday on Wednesday) with someone that does the job, the manager, and the director, and they were very easy to talk to. Asked for my writing sample Friday morning, and said would get back to me early next week because the director had a half day on Friday.

So, your point is interesting, but I don't think that is the case given the pace of things (at least it feels). The position starts next Monday, the 15th.

No particular experience with your field, but my thoughts from personal experience:

1) it's much easier to get a 'raise" when you get hired - essentially, they do want to hire you (as you indicated), so this is the time you have the most ability to dictate terms. Once you are hired, unless you have a better job offer elsewhere and your current employer wants to keep you, it is much more difficult to get better terms for yourself.

2) Salary is not the only negotiable part of a job. Would you rather work a 4-10 schedule? Have a company provided cell phone/laptop/car/whatever? Office location, ability to be transferred, even potential future minimum raises. So manypeople focus just on salary that they lose out on other options. Just make certain that anything you agree to is specifically laid out in the job offer in writing.

3) Be prepared. If you can get solid information on what people are making in that position at your company and others, you are better armed for the negotiation. Ask people. Yes, money is a taboo subject in this country, but get past that. If you have friends doing the job, find out what tehy are making.

tante said: so what are the barriers to entry for this job, is it a specific degree? From what I know, insurance companies will hire people that don't even have college degrees, so my guess is you don't have very much room to negotiate since you are essentially going up against everyone for your job. If you had a specific skill that was in high demand or the job was open for a long time while they were trying to find candidates you would have a good chance at negotiation, but I have a feeling if you push too hard your offer will get pulled and they will move on to their next candidate.

It's not a specific degree that is a barrier, but they do look for a degree and years+ experience. My friend got with job without the degree, but about 4 years experience here. The job I do currently can be drawn with paralells as to what the new job is looking for (not the same job, but both need productivity, multitaking, high degree of accuracy, and a keen eye for detail) and its shown in all my numbers and reviews. It is not that I'm looking for some rediculous amount more, I just know that when/if they give me an offer, it is the lowest they want to go for higher the best they can (who wouldn't want to buy a BMW at a Kia price?). All I want to do is not get ripped off, but don't know how to word that conversation. Thanks for the continued help.

Do you know what the average salary is for your position? Your employer might go with the philosophy of 'pay well and keep talent happy' (there are some).

Assuming your job isn't too specific, there are a few salary sites out there (e.g., payscale.com) that will give you benchmarks.

marketingmike said: mrmartin86 said: Asked for my writing sample Friday morning,

Seriously? Are you applying for some kind of technical writing position?

Kind of. It's a pre-sale analyst that deals with getting prospective clients information about the company in terms of what we can offer at what rate and price, etc. So it is a lot of work between underwriting, sales, and the legal department on what can specifically said in contracts, and how to say such things, so at times we will have to draft up language and get approval on it. It really depends what the client is looking for, and how we can meet those needs when they're selecting their carrier.

Aitchly said: Do you know what the average salary is for your position? Your employer might go with the philosophy of 'pay well and keep talent happy' (there are some).

Assuming your job isn't too specific, there are a few salary sites out there (e.g., payscale.com) that will give you benchmarks.

I know the round-about figures of where it should be around. I'm just trying to prepare myself just in case they offer me below that, I want to know how to be able to handle it correctly without going "that's not what you pay other people that were just hired." That just sounds, non-professional, I guess IMHO.

I've worked in the insurance industry for almost a decade..

Insurance companies will generally tend to pay conservatively..so, don't expect a huge jump.

First find out the low, median, high MRVs within your company and compare them with the sites like salary.com, etc.
rate yourself as a inexperienced, mid level or expert level for the position you are applying. These are for starters..

Say, you are mid level, Is the offer you received within the mid MRV? If not, list out all of your capabilities in a good document why you think you are a mid level experienced person.. (same applies to expert level).

present that to HR and the team that is trying to hire you..

Do let me know if it worked..

so were there a lot of positions that were open, or did 3 people turn this job down already.

OP, I don't know your quality of work but for me personally, if you know for sure you can deliver the result better than industry standard, never settle for less.
I started with OK pay and figured out the person I replaced got paid higher. I waited 6 months and when the feedback during casual conversations with supervisors and co-workers clearly showed I did much better job than she did, I brought that up to my boss and asked for a raise.
I got it anyway but I was very prepared to leave had he given me BS excuses.

I know a friend of mine who demanded huge raise when he jumped department to do the same job as the dude that's already there. Company offered him 7% raise, he asked them, you want me to do at least the same job if not better than him and pay me half his salary? He ended up making 5% more than the other dude, basically doubling his base salary before the transfer.

I'm not saying this will happen to you as well but my point is, know your own strengths and weaknesses and work from there.

As stated, internal hiring is usually at a set salary. Since your internal, you should have already asked around to find out the pay for the job or even brought it up to HR during the interview process. If they throw out a number add 20%.

As noted above, the big salary increases come from getting experince at your current job and then taking it elsewhere. Use your time wisely, take what they give you salarywise and start the two year clock to learn all you can and to start looking to the next insurance company for your next job. Plus use the two years to obtain your masters degree and hopefully your current company will have some tuition reminbursement programs which may offset a lower then market salary.

Are you reporting up to the same VP/GM? If so, you're boned and he's not going to give you a fatty raise. If it's a completely different department, you can get a raise to the normal pay at that position but they're not going to raise you any more than 10-20%, no matter what IMO.

Internal hiring, 18 spots at the same time, I doubt there is any room for negotiating. I would look for some other kind of perk outside of salary if possible. I suspect everyone is essentially going to get the same thing.

It doesn't hurt to ask, but don't be surprised if they quickly dismiss you asking for more money.

The factor is likely going to depend on how much you get at your current position and how much you get at the new one. The new position is likely sold to you and others as an opportunity. Maybe it is a salary bump for you, maybe not. Did you take the job only because you thought you would get more money? if that was your only concern and reason to take it, it seems like you should have already hashed that out.

So what other reasons did you take the job besides a potential salary bump?