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I had to laugh about the link you posted regarding the chinese genset generators. I wonder where this guy thought his Champion generator was made? Had he ever read his manual,If so and after looking thru all the manuals Champion Power Co. has listed on their website for all of their generators not a single one of them was made outside of China. In other words all Champion Generators are made in China,while the Predator series of generators are made and manufactured in South Africa and some assembled with the B&S engines here in the U.S.A.. Not a big deal to me but I gathered you were trying to make a point about the HF generators being a poorly made in china product when actually the opposite is true as all the generators made by Champion are imported into southern California from China while the Predator series products sold by Harbor Freight are imported from as stated South Africa an American ally and imported here to the states with the exception of those with B&S motors which are built and assembled here in the U.S.A

Just read about some needing a larger unit. the same BlackMax brand at Sams Club has a 7000 watt unit that all seem to have a Honda engine unlike the 3600 watt unit. Most have it at $999 but when I called around to 4 diffent stores , one had it priced at $700. Hope this helps some. This also seems to not be a clearance like the 3600 one.

hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?Yes under certain conditions. Consult an electrician in your area.

Edit: On second thought I pulled my original post. It really should be done by someone knowledgeable and on the spot.

hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?

Before you either kill yourself or someone at the power company contact a certified electrician as they will know how to properly set it up for you and avert possible short circuit and fire or backfeeding and electrocuting someone and winding up losing everything because you listened to someone here,just my 2 cents

If anybody is looking for a more powerful one, Harbor Freight has the 5500 watt version on sale for $470 (until 11/30)
link

Maybe those who are buying the chinese junk will in a few weeks,lol

Is this a reliable brand?

Yes, hard to beat in the price range and durability category vs others in the same price range. I have only had mine a short time,but after reading online reviews and just hearing it run vs other brands I feel confident enough to say yes to your question

EDIT: I removed a post that wasn't the best example for a do-it-yourselfer. Read your generator manual, folks. If you are using a transfer switch, have it properly installed, and use it correctly. If you aren't using a transfer switch, use high quality extension cords and don't overload the generator or the extension cords.

DON'T try to hook up your generator any other way. If you do, you risk backfeeding the power grid and killing someone - really.

comprx said:   hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?Yes, but you will need to make the cable. Q]

Actually, No.
Never "single phase" both sides of a service.
It puts too much current on the neutrals.

As someone who lives in the Northeast and has suffered through many prolonged power outages, if you are buying a generator to power your house I would go with a minimum of 7500 watts. (I purchased the Generac 7500). This powered my fridge, forced hot water heating system, microwave and 2/3 of the lighting in my house after the recent storm. It will not power the electric stove however. Again, we had an electrician install the outside connector and panel ($899 for parts and labor)in the basement. Also if your generator is running continuously for days please check the oil level. After 5 days the auto-shutoff saved me as the oil level was very low.

RobL said:   As someone who lives in the Northeast and has suffered through many prolonged power outages, if you are buying a generator to power your house I would go with a minimum of 7500 watts. (I purchased the Generac 7500). This powered my fridge, forced hot water heating system, microwave and 2/3 of the lighting in my house after the recent storm. It will not power the electric stove however. Again, we had an electrician install the outside connector and panel ($899 for parts and labor)in the basement. Also if your generator is running continuously for days please check the oil level. After 5 days the auto-shutoff saved me as the oil level was very low.

Some good thoughts, but I guess it all depends on your needs. I had what I considered a monster generator at my old house, 5500 watts continuous. It was loud and thirsty. I think over the 5k size you should look into natural gas or Diesel power and a large tank.

woowoo2 said:   comprx said:   hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?Yes, but you will need to make the cable. Q]

Actually, No.
Never "single phase" both sides of a service.
It puts too much current on the neutrals.


Too much current on what neutrals, generator or the panel? Can you elaborate?

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200196674_2001966... sale on transfer switch here, its on b/o but might be worth the wait

yakky said:   woowoo2 said:   comprx said:   hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?Yes, but you will need to make the cable. Q]

Actually, No.
Never "single phase" both sides of a service.
It puts too much current on the neutrals.


Too much current on what neutrals, generator or the panel? Can you elaborate?


A residential service panel is made to work from two hot leads that are 180 Deg. out of phase.
It is a common practice to share neutrals when wiring branch circuits.
If you feed both hot leads with the same phase,the neutral current would double.

Will it work?
Yes.
Is it safe?
Not at all

dcwilbur said:   
DON'T try to hook up your generator any other way. If you do, you risk backfeeding the power grid and killing someone - really.


This is not totally true. Installing a mechanical interlock on the panel and a backfeed breaker that you connect to an INLET on the side of your house is an approved installation method. It also has the benefits of being cheaper than the transfer switch and allows you power any circuit in your house simply by deciding which breakers to turn on/off.

buster2 said:   http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200196674_2001966... sale on transfer switch here, its on b/o but might be worth the wait$300 is pretty standard for a kit like this. Text

Jenjani said:   dcwilbur said:   
DON'T try to hook up your generator any other way. If you do, you risk backfeeding the power grid and killing someone - really.


This is not totally true. Installing a mechanical interlock on the panel and a backfeed breaker that you connect to an INLET on the side of your house is an approved installation method. It also has the benefits of being cheaper than the transfer switch and allows you power any circuit in your house simply by deciding which breakers to turn on/off.


Correct. To clarify:

JJ's description of a properly installed Interlock + Inlet w\backfeed breaker is OK.

Backfeeding with a suicide cable to an existing outlet is NOT OK.

buster2 said:   I had to laugh about the link you posted regarding the chinese genset generators. I wonder where this guy thought his Champion generator was made? Had he ever read his manual,If so and after looking thru all the manuals Champion Power Co. has listed on their website for all of their generators not a single one of them was made outside of China. In other words all Champion Generators are made in China,while the Predator series of generators are made and manufactured in South Africa and some assembled with the B&S engines here in the U.S.A.. Not a big deal to me but I gathered you were trying to make a point about the HF generators being a poorly made in china product when actually the opposite is true as all the generators made by Champion are imported into southern California from China while the Predator series products sold by Harbor Freight are imported from as stated South Africa an American ally and imported here to the states with the exception of those with B&S motors which are built and assembled here in the U.S.A

You may want to lower your flag to half mast...

April-28-2012 Briggs & Stratton spokeswoman Laura Timm says production of horizontal shaft engines and small generators currently made in Alabama will be moved to China. Timm says it is no longer profitable to make those products in the U.S. In addition to the layoffs at the Auburn plant, the company plans to cut about 210 jobs globally and halt placement of lawn and garden products at national mass retailers.

TV15 News

dcwilbur said:   buster2 said:   http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200196674_2001966... sale on transfer switch here, its on b/o but might be worth the wait$300 is pretty standard for a kit like this. Text

Really,then why do both places have it being on sale rather than a low advertised price. They are not commonly at this price level, in fact most on average are minimally $75-100 more except when a sale occurs or a large natural disaster, I searched repeatedly and could find none in this price range that had not dropped significantly in the last few months ,so I believe you are incorrect as they usually only drop in price either when colder weather is imminent or a natural disaster has recently occured. Hardly a standard by any means

You might note I said some assembled with the B&S motors, the plant you referenced are primarily focused on the aftermarket lawn equipment sector not the genrator plant located here in McDonough,Ga , http://americanmachinist.com/shop-operations/more-cutting-briggs... , flag pole raised. Also those you are referencing are B&S generators not the Predators sold by HF.

I bought this generator last year after losing power for the hundredth time. We probably lose power for over a day or two three times a year, counting hurricanes and ice storms. This is a very nice unit. It won't power ovens, dryers, furnaces, air conditioners, etc. I have it in the garage next to the doors so when I run it I can ventilate it by moving it outside. I run extension cords in through a window and power my freezer, refridgerator, the cable modem and router, and the cable box and plasma tv. I also can use it to charge phones, laptops, etc as needed. It will do this without a problem. I have gas hot water and a gas fireplace insert if I need heat. The longest I used it was with Irene and we were without power in August heat for 6 days. Wife moved in to her sister's house but I toughed it out no problem.

This unit has a small screw under the carb so after you shut off the gas to the carb (or run it dry) you unscrew the screw and can drain any remaining gas in the carb.

buster2 said:   dcwilbur said:   buster2 said:   http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200196674_2001966... sale on transfer switch here, its on b/o but might be worth the wait$300 is pretty standard for a kit like this. TextReally,then why do both places have it being on sale rather than a low advertised price. They are not commonly at this price level, in fact most on average are minimally $75-100 more except when a sale occurs or a large natural disaster, I searched repeatedly and could find none in this price range that had not dropped significantly in the last few months ,so I believe you are incorrect as they usually only drop in price either when colder weather is imminent or a natural disaster has recently occured. Hardly a standard by any meansI'm not arguing with you. That's a good price from Northern Tool. I'm just saying that this is a stock item at a number of places for around $300. There is no need to backorder it from somewhere to get this price.

Lowes - $290

Home Depot - $293

buster2 said:   You might note I said some assembled with the B&S motors, the plant you referenced are primarily focused on the aftermarket lawn equipment sector not the genrator plant located here in McDonough,Ga , http://americanmachinist.com/shop-operations/more-cutting-briggs... , flag pole raised. Also those you are referencing are B&S generators not the Predators sold by HF.

Good to hear, but it is hard to parse your claims.

Are the predators built with US made engines in a B&S plant or are they mfg'ing and assembling in a predator factory in South Africa....or is it Georgia?

Also, according to the B&S folks in Chongqing, all small engines are moving out of the US and so is all generator production. The subs over their are already spinning up.

Why don't you PM me so we can stop clogging up the thread with the global mfg stuff. BTW have you mounted your Cabelas scope yet?

woowoo2 said:   yakky said:   woowoo2 said:   comprx said:   hammer45 said:   Question for the electrical folks out there....I got the Champion generator with the 30A 120v out...the previous homeowner has a generator switch on the panel which has a 240v plug (dryer connection). Any way to feed the panel at 120V @ 30A via that plug?Yes, but you will need to make the cable. Q]

Actually, No.
Never "single phase" both sides of a service.
It puts too much current on the neutrals.


Too much current on what neutrals, generator or the panel? Can you elaborate?


A residential service panel is made to work from two hot leads that are 180 Deg. out of phase.
It is a common practice to share neutrals when wiring branch circuits.
If you feed both hot leads with the same phase,the neutral current would double.

Will it work?
Yes.
Is it safe?
Not at all


So its the branches on the panel? I'm still not following....I guess the only way I can see it if you are running a genset that is actually capable of a high load, but something that only puts out 110v is usually 20 amp or less. Most anything above that has a 240v receptacle, including the one in this deal.

Got mine today.
Time for test run.

cleek said:   buster2 said:   You might note I said some assembled with the B&S motors, the plant you referenced are primarily focused on the aftermarket lawn equipment sector not the genrator plant located here in McDonough,Ga , http://americanmachinist.com/shop-operations/more-cutting-briggs... , flag pole raised. Also those you are referencing are B&S generators not the Predators sold by HF.

Good to hear, but it is hard to parse your claims.

Are the predators built with US made engines in a B&S plant or are they mfg'ing and assembling in a predator factory in South Africa....or is it Georgia?

Also, according to the B&S folks in Chongqing, all small engines are moving out of the US and so is all generator production. The subs over their are already spinning up.

Why don't you PM me so we can stop clogging up the thread with the global mfg stuff. BTW have you mounted your Cabelas scope yet?


!.As I referenced the Predators built with B&S motors are assembled in their plant here in the US.

2.B&S manufactures and distribute's their own brand named generators, perhaps they ARE moving their generator plant to China. ,http://www.tractorsupply.com/briggs-stratton-reg-storm-responder...

3. Yes I have received my Cabela's scope and will mount it on my recently received Chinese SKS from Grabagun after I purchase a dependable mount and a thorough cleaning

buster2 said:   cleek said:   buster2 said:   You might note I said some assembled with the B&S motors, the plant you referenced are primarily focused on the aftermarket lawn equipment sector not the genrator plant located here in McDonough,Ga , http://americanmachinist.com/shop-operations/more-cutting-briggs... , flag pole raised. Also those you are referencing are B&S generators not the Predators sold by HF.

Good to hear, but it is hard to parse your claims.

Are the predators built with US made engines in a B&S plant or are they mfg'ing and assembling in a predator factory in South Africa....or is it Georgia?


As I referenced the Predators built with B&S motors are assembled in their plant here in the US.
Quoting buster2 "Really, Care to point it out!!" If you have aready provided a link, my apologies but have yet to find it. Also anyway to tell which Predators have the B&S engines without opening the crate? Maybe states it on the exterior of said crate??? Thanks


buster2 said:   http://www.powerproducts.co.za/home.htmlThanks??? The link I provided for you, directly answered your concern.

assembled in their plant here in the US
Reading that gives me a chuckle, reason is the company I work for used to lease out a area of about a 3 car garage to a guy who assembled generator kits from China, now I wished I'd paid attention and remembered how or for whom they were marketed

Champions of course

Still available,

buster2 said:   Champions of course

What is with your disdain for Champion?

Made in China and we can make these here and quit importing them, also the deal is still valid with the coupon code provided by me in the beginning as posted and showing in the newest Discover magazine as going thru 03/13/2013 still months away from being expired

Updated and no longer expired, see coupon code good for $40 off list price in 1st post, enjoy the savings till 03/13/2013

buster2 said:   Made in China and we can make these here and quit importing them, also the deal is still valid with the coupon code provided by me in the beginning as posted and showing in the newest Discover magazine as going thru 03/13/2013 still months away from being expired

I agree, we should make these here. Go ahead and get started, let me know when you have reliable enough for home use 4000 watt generators, completely made in the USA, available for under $500. I'll be the first to buy one.

Just to note on these Harbor Freight generators. A buddy of mine ordered the largest one. It was delivered with a broken air filter assembly. No option of them sending him one, he had to ship back or take back to store. I have a 4 year old Champion, 3500 watt unit. I was having a horrible gas smell in garage, found it to be a leaking fuel cock coming from tank. Went to tighten and snapped off. I checked online could not find a replacement part. Called Champion and Brian picked up, provided the part # out of the manual. Part was $5.50 with $6.00 flat rate shipping. This was the complete unit with the fuel filter etc. I commented I was surprised it was so inexpensive. He said the complete carberator on these units, ready to bolt up complete, was only $20.00. Part will ship out tomorrow out of Southern California. If availability of parts is something you value, It may be well worth the $20.00 extra for the Champion Weekender Package from Cabelas, depending on your needs for 120v vs. 240. I'm sure this is a fine generator, but parts may be an issue.

Interesting comment above, seems doubtful tho, more drama fron the chinese buyers group,lol.Why didn't he simply take it back to the store where I'm sure they would have given him a new one to replace his broken one with. Its not HF OR the Item in question that was the problem, the shipper was the problem and before you sign off to take an item you have the right to refuse it if it was apparent it was damaged or the box in which it was contained appeared to be damaged, judging from the size of the item I would suspect the box would have looked pretty roughed up in this case and refusal would not have been a second thought. They have a toll free number to call for the engines BTW and since its also just an air cleaner asembly and they sell that motor seperately I would think it would be an easy replacement part to have in stock, sorry but I'm callin BS on the above post

To each their own.



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