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Lowest price since the 4-tuner version's introduction but keep in mind it has no over-the-air tuner.

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any similar deals on one w/ a over-the-air tuner??

$ 199.98 @ bestbuy Text

But presumably requires new full price service subscription which is becoming expensive?

Any word on TiVo's doing about the six-tuner multi-room Pace XG1 version?

horizon6 said:   But presumably requires new full price service subscription which is becoming expensive?

Any word on TiVo's doing about the six-tuner multi-room Pace XG1 version?


It's $20 a month with no contract, or $15 with 1 year contract.

jaredb03 said:   horizon6 said:   But presumably requires new full price service subscription which is becoming expensive?

Any word on TiVo's doing about the six-tuner multi-room Pace XG1 version?


It's $20 a month with no contract, or $15 with 1 year contract.


Plus what your cable co. changes for the cable-card.

Multi-room requires considerable additional charges.

Lifetime subs less relevant as box outdated rather than upgraded every couple of years. SW is very good, but cable cos. are offering their own versions of Ti-Vo or their own DVRs, not quite the quality of user interface but sometimes price competitive, sometimes feature competitive.

Of course streaming may make this irrelevant down the road a little ways.

Love TiVo! Plan on ripping this open and putting a 2 TB hard drive to bump the recording to 320+ hours.
This one: http://www.amazon.com/WD-AV-GP-TB-Hard-Drive/dp/B0042AG9V8/

sdnative1 said:   Link
Lowest price since the 4-tuner version's introduction but keep in mind it has no over-the-air tuner.


I love my 2 TiVo HD's but not having OTA capability on this new model kills it for me. One of the reasons I can budget the monthly fee for having the Tivos is that I don't pay for cable. So if I were going to pay for cable, it would make more sense to use the cable company's DVR box since it would not require an equipment purchase.

Love my TiVo, and now with the TiVo Mini coming out, they are even more appealing. The mini is a media extender that will let you share that cable card all around the house.

Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

The TiVo product/service is very good. But beginning to fall behind the curve while becoming more expensive. It uses free/open software which it then "locks" in a box which discourages and tries to prohibit upgrading. Short hardware warranty; frequent hardware replacement cycle. Not the only one who uses this model. Buy the box at lower cost but then also "rent" it till you replace it. The model is beginning to show it age as multiple STBs and cable services come under challlenges. TiVo need to be as creative now with a next leap as it was when it introduced its original product and it must determine a sustainable business model. This deal is a $50 upfront discount but appears to cost $400-$500 to use with one TV for two years; at that, with limitations and not leading technology, not a hot deal.

yakky said:   Love my TiVo, and now with the TiVo Mini coming out, they are even more appealing. The mini is a media extender that will let you share that cable card all around the house.

Please say more about the TiVo Mini. Is that different from their streaming device that connects via WiFi to i.e./e.g. iP__ device or in the realm of XG1?

docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

The current monthly subscription costs (and similarly the device "lifetime" costs), unless you are able to negotiate a significant discount of some sort, is a deal breaker. Especially so when they are on top of the TiVo hardware purchase and cable card rental costs.

markbyte said:   sdnative1 said:   Link
Lowest price since the 4-tuner version's introduction but keep in mind it has no over-the-air tuner.


I love my 2 TiVo HD's but not having OTA capability on this new model kills it for me. One of the reasons I can budget the monthly fee for having the Tivos is that I don't pay for cable. So if I were going to pay for cable, it would make more sense to use the cable company's DVR box since it would not require an equipment purchase.


This doesn't make any sense at all if your cable company offers a buggy DVR like so many cable companies do. Why pay for something that doesn't work? TiVo works great.

Is there an alternative without monthly fees? I've found them for the PC, but no viable set-top boxes that can take a cablecard aside from TiVo, which is $/month. The whole idea of owning one of these boxes, for me, is to get rid of the monthly fee.

I just cancelled our Fios because the price was too high and got Comcast, bought the modem and declined the cable box (and it's fee) for the cable service I'm paying for (overall, still way lower than Fios), but would like to find something in the $150-200 range.

horizon6 said:   It uses free/open software which it then "locks" in a box which discourages and tries to prohibit upgrading.
You'll be hard pressed to find many consumer electronics devices (especially those involved with encryption) that allow or encourage you to modify the equipment.

horizon6 said:   frequent hardware replacement cycle.
The Series 3 had a number of different changes, but the software platform remained the same for nearly four years. Six years later, it also is still capable of pretty much everything you'd need to use it as a DVR. The Premiere (series 4) platform has been around for three years this April. Other than the addition of the 4-tuner model (with MOCA), there hasn't been any significant change to the hardware that would require upgrading.

horizon6 said:   This deal is a $50 upfront discount but appears to cost $400-$500 to use with one TV for two years; at that, with limitations and not leading technology, not a hot deal.
I agree that it is not an inexpensive purchase. However, if you have the money and pay the lifetime fee ($399 or $499) upfront, you're looking at a total cost of $700. The Premiere and Premiere XL (both with only 2 tuners) are frequently sold for $450-$550 on eBay...and that's two years after their release. TiVos with lifetime hold value really well and I would bet that you'd have no problem getting $400-$500 minimum out of this purchase in 2-3 years. If you can fron the money, that's a rather good investment to use the box for 2-3 year and only spend $200-300.

iamwildbill said:   horizon6 said:   It uses free/open software which it then "locks" in a box which discourages and tries to prohibit upgrading.
You'll be hard pressed to find many consumer electronics devices (especially those involved with encryption) that allow or encourage you to modify the equipment.

horizon6 said:   frequent hardware replacement cycle.
The Series 3 had a number of different changes, but the software platform remained the same for nearly four years. Six years later, it also is still capable of pretty much everything you'd need to use it as a DVR. The Premiere (series 4) platform has been around for three years this April. Other than the addition of the 4-tuner model (with MOCA), there hasn't been any significant change to the hardware that would require upgrading.

horizon6 said:   This deal is a $50 upfront discount but appears to cost $400-$500 to use with one TV for two years; at that, with limitations and not leading technology, not a hot deal.
I agree that it is not an inexpensive purchase. However, if you have the money and pay the lifetime fee ($399 or $499) upfront, you're looking at a total cost of $700. The Premiere and Premiere XL (both with only 2 tuners) are frequently sold for $450-$550 on eBay...and that's two years after their release. TiVos with lifetime hold value really well and I would bet that you'd have no problem getting $400-$500 minimum out of this purchase in 2-3 years. If you can fron the money, that's a rather good investment to use the box for 2-3 year and only spend $200-300.


I like TiVo! But its value proposition is changing and may continue to change. Technology is changing faster. You may be correct about your financial analysis, but at the same time it may resemble the less attractive proposition that confronts someone who bought a share of Apple some months ago at a cost of $700 and could sell it now in that same $400-$500 minimum range you referenced. Just let your thoughts stream on that and see in they're tuned to a certain channel.

horizon6 said:   yakky said:   Love my TiVo, and now with the TiVo Mini coming out, they are even more appealing. The mini is a media extender that will let you share that cable card all around the house.

Please say more about the TiVo Mini. Is that different from their streaming device that connects via WiFi to i.e./e.g. iP__ device or in the realm of XG1?


http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/08/tivo-mini-extender-hands-on/

docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.

elist said:   docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.


Are you then a cord-extender rather than a cord-cutter

yakky said:   horizon6 said:   yakky said:   Love my TiVo, and now with the TiVo Mini coming out, they are even more appealing. The mini is a media extender that will let you share that cable card all around the house.

Please say more about the TiVo Mini. Is that different from their streaming device that connects via WiFi to i.e./e.g. iP__ device or in the realm of XG1?


http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/08/tivo-mini-extender-hands-on/


Thank you for that link which I had missed when announced last week. Interesting, but TiVo may be missing the boat. That, Stream, limited functionality added with Premier -- too many products to buy/rent/replace from them that it seems they're becoming another company just trying to lock you in with the razor blade model but no longer a leading edge.

horizon6 said:   elist said:   docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.


Are you then a cord-extender rather than a cord-cutter




We don't have cable or satellite. Only OTA antenna, Hulu+, Amazon Prime streaming and a couple other legal streaming sources.

It started as an experiment to see if we could get enough content legally without cable/satellite. We've now been cable/satellite free for about 2 years and are pretty satisfied.

I'm also looking at alternatives to cable and satellite and came across the Channel Master CM7400 at $400 which is more than I wanted to pay up front but there are no monthly fees. Has anyone any experience with the electronic programming guide and TV guide used? I like the eSATA connection which I assume is used for additional storage or maybe, just maybe, for playing ones own MKV, AVI etc. recordings.

elist said:   horizon6 said:   elist said:   docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.


Are you then a cord-extender rather than a cord-cutter




We don't have cable or satellite. Only OTA antenna, Hulu+, Amazon Prime streaming and a couple other legal streaming sources.

It started as an experiment to see if we could get enough content legally without cable/satellite. We've now been cable/satellite free for about 2 years and are pretty satisfied.


Thanks for the clarification. Can you comment more on
1. Your choice of antenna
2. Your including Hulu+ and Amazon Prime and excluding Netflix
Thanks

horizon6 said:   elist said:   Thanks for the clarification. Can you comment more on
1. Your choice of antenna
2. Your including Hulu+ and Amazon Prime and excluding Netflix
Thanks


I used a ClearStream2 HD antenna... plugged it in in the attic where the cable line used to come in from. It works amazing... all the other antenna's I've had really sucked, this one does great.

I also use Amazon prime for all the kid shows my daughter likes to watch.

horizon6 said:   elist said:   horizon6 said:   elist said:   docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.


Are you then a cord-extender rather than a cord-cutter




We don't have cable or satellite. Only OTA antenna, Hulu+, Amazon Prime streaming and a couple other legal streaming sources.

It started as an experiment to see if we could get enough content legally without cable/satellite. We've now been cable/satellite free for about 2 years and are pretty satisfied.


Thanks for the clarification. Can you comment more on
1. Your choice of antenna
2. Your including Hulu+ and Amazon Prime and excluding Netflix
Thanks


1. The antenna I'm using is a 12 foot VHF/UHF I have mounted in the attic. I picked it up from a Radio Shack that was closing for $12. While the antenna is important, your home's distance to the towers are more important. I have a buddy that uses a $5 Wal-Mart bunny ears antenna and still gets full HD OTA perfectly. Check out http://www.antennaweb.org/ for where your towers are in relation to your home.

2. We have had Netflix in the past, and likely will again in the future. Amazon Prime is cheaper per month than Netflix. Amazon's content has a lot of overlap with Netflix even though Amazon doesn't have nearly the depth of content. It is not bad for TV shows we want (Star Trek, West Wing, and quite a few sitcoms). When we run out of content or if there is something specific that is on Netflix, we'll subscribe for a month, watch what we want, then drop Netflix again.

elist said:   horizon6 said:   elist said:   horizon6 said:   elist said:   docjoo said:   Seems like monthly subscription fee is too expensive. Isn't it cheaper just to get Hulu Plus subscription and stream shows whenever or wherever I am?

As a cordcutter and Hulu+ subscriber myself I appreciate the sentiment, but TiVo and Hulu+ address TV watching in very different ways.

Hulu+ isn't a replacement for a PVR, but it is a great supplement in my opinion. First, OTA and Cable TiVo users can access quite a bit of content that Hulu+ users can't. Many channels have no content agreement with Hulu. Some that do have very restrictive terms (Web only, no Roku/Cell phone access). Even if the content IS on Hulu it might not be there for very long. One other thing to consider is internet bandwidth. If you have cheap and plentiful bandwidth Hulu can be a good fit. If you are on a slow connection or share the line with many household members then Hulu might not be as enjoyable experience.

As a TiVo (PVR) user, if you receive a channel, you know you can record anything that shows on that channel. Once recorded you know that show will be there until you delete it (or you run out of space). The requirement is of course, that you must choose what to record beforehand. This last step isn't necessary for streaming like Hulu.

To each their own. Our household has both Hulu+ and TiVo.


Are you then a cord-extender rather than a cord-cutter




We don't have cable or satellite. Only OTA antenna, Hulu+, Amazon Prime streaming and a couple other legal streaming sources.

It started as an experiment to see if we could get enough content legally without cable/satellite. We've now been cable/satellite free for about 2 years and are pretty satisfied.


Thanks for the clarification. Can you comment more on
1. Your choice of antenna
2. Your including Hulu+ and Amazon Prime and excluding Netflix
Thanks


1. The antenna I'm using is a 12 foot VHF/UHF I have mounted in the attic. I picked it up from a Radio Shack that was closing for $12. While the antenna is important, your home's distance to the towers are more important. I have a buddy that uses a $5 Wal-Mart bunny ears antenna and still gets full HD OTA perfectly. Check out http://www.antennaweb.org/ for where your towers are in relation to your home.

2. We have had Netflix in the past, and likely will again in the future. Amazon Prime is cheaper per month than Netflix. Amazon's content has a lot of overlap with Netflix even though Amazon doesn't have nearly the depth of content. It is not bad for TV shows we want (Star Trek, West Wing, and quite a few sitcoms). When we run out of content or if there is something specific that is on Netflix, we'll subscribe for a month, watch what we want, then drop Netflix again.


Thanks for the additional info. You point out well two things:
1. Information on specific antennas for OTA in one's particular location is somewhat limited as it is not a subject of wide reviews nor are there many next door neighbors yet to ask about their experience in the location.
2. Content guides for cord-cutting are still in their infancy and content from various sources, including cable/satellite company regularly changes. Wonder when the time might come that one can have a standard IP streaming device, a guide to content, and subscribe to "channels" or purchase wanted program on demand direct from the "production company" rather than MSOs or over-the-top companies in the middle.

Completely YMMV but I called directly to TiVo last month, after one of our TivoHD had been whacked out since Sandy. I asked about the TiVo Premiere, they were trying to upsell me to the 4. I told them I wasn't interested because I didn't need all the tuners, so next they offered a deal I couldn't refuse... I got the Premiere4 with lifetime service for $399+tax; which basically worked out to getting a free box (although their words were discount on the service).
I also had a new old S2 that was never activated and they gave me lifetime service on that one for $49. I had to get a free digital adapter from comcast for it to work since it's too ancient for a cable card

Tried to get in on Gizmo's offer but was told that 1) no such offer exists on Premiere 4s and 2) I wasn't eligible for the $399 w/ lifetime for the basic Premier offer since I currently have TivoHDs. Bummer.

horizon6 said:   
2. Content guides for cord-cutting are still in their infancy and content from various sources, including cable/satellite company regularly changes. Wonder when the time might come that one can have a standard IP streaming device, a guide to content, and subscribe to "channels" or purchase wanted program on demand direct from the "production company" rather than MSOs or over-the-top companies in the middle.


I wouldn't say infancy, but rather adolescence. If money and time are no object, all popular shows and a huge amount of less popular shows are available from legitimate sources now. Your point about a standard IP streaming device stand, however. There is no single box that does EVERYTHING without using a full blown PC and various software applications (which, not coincidentally, is what I personally use). This isn't a failure of technology, but of media companies struggling to adapt to the changing market.

"channels" are an old way of thinking. A channel is where you go when you have someone else make the choice of what you want to watch. Instead you can now seek out the genre or even specific show you're looking for. Hulu has done well with this part. If I want to watch a TV drama, I really don't care what broadcaster it airs on. I see a screen will all TV Dramas listed and can then choose on subject matter or other refinements. Searching by favorite actors, directors, or writers are also possible most of the time.

horizon6 said:   
I like TiVo! But its value proposition is changing and may continue to change. Technology is changing faster. You may be correct about your financial analysis, but at the same time it may resemble the less attractive proposition that confronts someone who bought a share of Apple some months ago at a cost of $700 and could sell it now in that same $400-$500 minimum range you referenced. Just let your thoughts stream on that and see in they're tuned to a certain channel.


I don't think you can really compare APPL stock (or any stock) with the price of consumer electronics devices. Stocks are much more volatile. A better comparison would be to look at the cost of an Apple computer. Both a TiVo and an Apple computer hold their value pretty well and really only drop in value as new generations come out. I agree that there are going to be big changes in the future of TV, but at this time you're pretty safe for at least the next 4-5 years. It's entirely possible that by that 5th year there will be other options out there, but the concept of the "television channel" (as opposed to something on-demand or app based) will still be in existence. When you factor in the cost savings versus renting a similar box from your cable company (conservative savings of $10 a month after factoring in the cost of a cable card), you're $700 investment will earn $120 a year each year you use it. Let's assume that for some strange reason it retains NO resale value after five years due to outdated technology, and you're looking at a long-term cost of AT MOST $100 for a system that most would agree is leaps and bound above any cable box on the market today.

pspitalnic said:   Tried to get in on Gizmo's offer but was told that 1) no such offer exists on Premiere 4s and 2) I wasn't eligible for the $399 w/ lifetime for the basic Premier offer since I currently have TivoHDs. Bummer.

worth a shot but too bad, it existed last month (or maybe exists as ymmv per rep?) - as I said it wasn't anything I was looking for when I called.

Just got an email from TiVo for the Premiere 4 with Lifetime for $599.98 direct from TiVo. Not a bad deal. Use promo code: BigGame when checking out at TiVo.com

elist said:   horizon6 said:   
2. Content guides for cord-cutting are still in their infancy and content from various sources, including cable/satellite company regularly changes. Wonder when the time might come that one can have a standard IP streaming device, a guide to content, and subscribe to "channels" or purchase wanted program on demand direct from the "production company" rather than MSOs or over-the-top companies in the middle.


I wouldn't say infancy, but rather adolescence. If money and time are no object, all popular shows and a huge amount of less popular shows are available from legitimate sources now. Your point about a standard IP streaming device stand, however. There is no single box that does EVERYTHING without using a full blown PC and various software applications (which, not coincidentally, is what I personally use). This isn't a failure of technology, but of media companies struggling to adapt to the changing market.

"channels" are an old way of thinking. A channel is where you go when you have someone else make the choice of what you want to watch. Instead you can now seek out the genre or even specific show you're looking for. Hulu has done well with this part. If I want to watch a TV drama, I really don't care what broadcaster it airs on. I see a screen will all TV Dramas listed and can then choose on subject matter or other refinements. Searching by favorite actors, directors, or writers are also possible most of the time.


You make good points.

I won't question infancy or adolescence and adulthood may not even be desirable. Lets say that contents guides and search for programming still are an area for development and of course we're not yet at the point where the monitor with know and display what we want as we enter the room including if we want to watch nothing.

Yes, "channels" are old schools, and put in quotes for that reason. But it is still a commonly used method of organization and selling of content. It may remain a useful way of paying. One might have a choice of purchasing particular content on demand or pay one price for a year of access to all content from a particular distributor.

There are clearly two paths to grow - one is technology and the other is how its financed. And yes, advertising revenue is a financial method. Interesting times.

iamwildbill said:   horizon6 said:   
I like TiVo! But its value proposition is changing and may continue to change. Technology is changing faster. You may be correct about your financial analysis, but at the same time it may resemble the less attractive proposition that confronts someone who bought a share of Apple some months ago at a cost of $700 and could sell it now in that same $400-$500 minimum range you referenced. Just let your thoughts stream on that and see in they're tuned to a certain channel.


I don't think you can really compare APPL stock (or any stock) with the price of consumer electronics devices. Stocks are much more volatile. A better comparison would be to look at the cost of an Apple computer. Both a TiVo and an Apple computer hold their value pretty well and really only drop in value as new generations come out. I agree that there are going to be big changes in the future of TV, but at this time you're pretty safe for at least the next 4-5 years. It's entirely possible that by that 5th year there will be other options out there, but the concept of the "television channel" (as opposed to something on-demand or app based) will still be in existence. When you factor in the cost savings versus renting a similar box from your cable company (conservative savings of $10 a month after factoring in the cost of a cable card), you're $700 investment will earn $120 a year each year you use it. Let's assume that for some strange reason it retains NO resale value after five years due to outdated technology, and you're looking at a long-term cost of AT MOST $100 for a system that most would agree is leaps and bound above any cable box on the market today.


Not intended to be a direct comparison. Simply, that projected future costs and prices are simply that, projections. Feel free to substitute the national debt as an example instead of AAPL

horizon6 said:   jaredb03 said:   horizon6 said:   But presumably requires new full price service subscription which is becoming expensive?

Any word on TiVo's doing about the six-tuner multi-room Pace XG1 version?


It's $20 a month with no contract, or $15 with 1 year contract.


Plus what your cable co. changes for the cable-card.

Multi-room requires considerable additional charges.

Lifetime subs less relevant as box outdated rather than upgraded every couple of years. SW is very good, but cable cos. are offering their own versions of Ti-Vo or their own DVRs, not quite the quality of user interface but sometimes price competitive, sometimes feature competitive.

Of course streaming may make this irrelevant down the road a little ways.


TiVo Lifetime subbed boxes retain 60-80% of their value 3-4 years after purchase, so getting the newest model every 3-4 years costs only about $100-$150 after you sell the old one. Very cheap way to have the latest plug in and play DVR tech always.

horizon6 said:   The TiVo product/service is very good. But beginning to fall behind the curve while becoming more expensive. It uses free/open software...

Not completely true anymore. They put Adobe Flash on top of the Linux kernel for the Premiere.

pspitalnic said:   Tried to get in on Gizmo's offer but was told that 1) no such offer exists on Premiere 4s and 2) I wasn't eligible for the $399 w/ lifetime for the basic Premier offer since I currently have TivoHDs. Bummer.

TiVoHD is eligible for the $550 Lifetime premiere with 4 tuners deal. Also the $399 2 tuner premiere is a refurb, where the Premiere 4 tuner offer is new. It's going on until the 23rd.

gaijin4life said:   horizon6 said:   jaredb03 said:   horizon6 said:   But presumably requires new full price service subscription which is becoming expensive?

Any word on TiVo's doing about the six-tuner multi-room Pace XG1 version?


It's $20 a month with no contract, or $15 with 1 year contract.


Plus what your cable co. changes for the cable-card.

Multi-room requires considerable additional charges.

Lifetime subs less relevant as box outdated rather than upgraded every couple of years. SW is very good, but cable cos. are offering their own versions of Ti-Vo or their own DVRs, not quite the quality of user interface but sometimes price competitive, sometimes feature competitive.

Of course streaming may make this irrelevant down the road a little ways.


TiVo Lifetime subbed boxes retain 60-80% of their value 3-4 years after purchase, so getting the newest model every 3-4 years costs only about $100-$150 after you sell the old one. Very cheap way to have the latest plug in and play DVR tech always.



In the past TiVo Lifetime subbed boxes retain(ed) 60-80% of their value 3-4 years after purchase. This is not a guarantee for the future as bigger technological leaps may obsolete equipment and new competition may have a greater affect. An interesting bet, but perhaps 3-4 years from now that $100ish savings difference on a consumer discretionary item might not fetch many buyers.

Skipping 16 Messages...
Toddler said:   There are software retry commands as well as firmware retry commands. You may wish to convince yourself otherwise, but there are differences between the drives.

Of course there are differences between the drives -- the streaming commands. I have no idea why you're bringing up software retries. The regular and streaming retries are both implemented in the drive firmware/hardware.



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