cameronj said:Good point - so is a good quality upconverting DVD player and 5 movies a good deal at $80 with rebates?

I just get the feeling that this deal is being defended by people because they like HD DVD, not because it's a good deal on its merits.

Well, that really depends... if you think you will ONLY use it as an upconverter, then IMO, no. Looking at it strictly as an SD player compared to other upconverters, the big difference you will notice is speed... the A3 is slow to boot up (as are most HD players, including BD players, although the PS3 is decent). BUT, if you are looking at this as a machine that will enable you to take advantage of good deals on HD-DVDs, then I'd consider it a good deal if you have the room to use it along side a BD player. Considering the free HD-DVDs, the player is nearly free, and you may be able to get a lot of HD titles you want in HD-DVD cheaper than you'll be able to get them on BD (and for many titles, certainly faster... who knows how long it will take all the current HD-DVD titles to be released in BD).

That's just my opinion... I have both an A3 and a PS3. Both have their pros and cons. But assuming you have the space and available inputs, I fail to see the downside of getting HD-DVD at these prices.

Be warned, these Toshiba players WILL lock up on you quite frequently. I own one, and for this rerason alone, I for one am very happy to switch opver to Blu ray, even at 2-3x the cost of the player. I have hardly 'truly' enjoyed any movies with HD-DVD because of the constant lockups, sometimes twice per movie... insane! And yes, I did have the latest firmware upgrades all along. Shame on Toshiba for delivering such unreliable players, even if the upconversion is stellar. Who cares!

cameronj said:How can it be a good deal if it basically is a hundred dollar device that won't play movies that come out in the future?
I am frankly amazed that fanboys continue to utterly misunderstand the general public's attitude toward this entire issue.

Most of the general public sees very little difference between true hi-def vs. upconverted DVD, and is not willing to pay significantly for that slight difference. If/when a hi-def format drops to the price of an upconverted DVD player, and its disks drop to the price of regular DVDs, the general public will begin to buy en masse. Until then, hi-def is only for aficionados.

I am the only person I know to have bought a hi-def DVD player at all, and I did so only because the price was only $108 and included 7 free movies. I mentioned the deal to family and friends--no one else was interested even at that price. (Yes, that was prior to Warner's treachery, and no one cited any interest in Blu-Ray either.)

I don't think DVD is obsolete technology since you can upconvert the source. Why would i need to re-buy american psycho or Napolean Dynamite on Blu-ray when it looks almost the same? you only really need to re-buy the eyefests like fifth element or 2001. Flat picture movies that weren't really remastered don't look that great in BLu-ray. ALso, VHS had a shelf life of 20 years and a new format didn't take over til DVD. DVD will have a shelf life of another ten years but at least it won't degrade like VHS. DVD is forever really. the next format will be 4k but that will be another ten years and you'd need to get new HDTV's with that. the probable next small leap is 3D HDTV but I think it will be a niche format. after that, 4k Ultra HDTV you probably won't ever to have worry about re-buying film movies cause back catalog films won't get any better than 4k so you are safe with that cause that will be the de facto standard. The question is will it be released as optical media or hologram chips? After that Film won't be used anymore and everyone will be shooting in 16k Digital, but that's a hypothetical 50 years from now. so you've got nothing to worry about because you'll be DEAD!

cameronj said:How can it be a good deal if it basically is a hundred dollar device that won't play movies that come out in the future?

How can you have the intellectual ability to cause your fingers to strike keys on the keyboard and actually make words appear on the screen, yet post a question this mindbogglingly moronic? One would think that being smart enough to type would require at least a 75 or so IQ.

Is this a good time to mention that I still have a laserdisc player? Even if LDs are gone, it still plays CDs. BUT I still have a lot of laserdiscs, right next to all the LPs I have.

lousygolfer said:cameronj said:How can it be a good deal if it basically is a hundred dollar device that won't play movies that come out in the future?

How can you have the intellectual ability to cause your fingers to strike keys on the keyboard and actually make words appear on the screen, yet post a question this mindbogglingly moronic? One would think that being smart enough to type would require at least a 75 or so IQ.

Here's another great example. This guy clearly thinks that anyone posting on this thread reads and argues about this with their friends all the time. When you're so deep in your passionate arguments that you forget that there are "normal" people in the "real world" who are not like you, you have a problem.

I maintain - there's no point in spending even $10 on a DVD player that will not see new releases in the future. While there is the argument that using it to upconvert DVDs, if this thing takes as long as people say to start up, and locks up even one time in ten, then it's not worth owning. Further, anyone who plans to participate in high definition DVDs will need a Blu Ray player sometime soon as well. So you're spending $100 on something that will very quickly be turned into a paperweight.

It's just not what FW is for. People are here talking about how to spend their money wisely.

cameronj said:lousygolfer said:cameronj said:How can it be a good deal if it basically is a hundred dollar device that won't play movies that come out in the future?

How can you have the intellectual ability to cause your fingers to strike keys on the keyboard and actually make words appear on the screen, yet post a question this mindbogglingly moronic? One would think that being smart enough to type would require at least a 75 or so IQ.

Here's another great example. This guy clearly thinks that anyone posting on this thread reads and argues about this with their friends all the time. When you're so deep in your passionate arguments that you forget that there are "normal" people in the "real world" who are not like you, you have a problem.

I maintain - there's no point in spending even $10 on a DVD player that will not see new releases in the future. While there is the argument that using it to upconvert DVDs, if this thing takes as long as people say to start up, and locks up even one time in ten, then it's not worth owning. Further, anyone who plans to participate in high definition DVDs will need a Blu Ray player sometime soon as well. So you're spending $100 on something that will very quickly be turned into a paperweight.

It's just not what FW is for. People are here talking about how to spend their money wisely. The only people who think this is a great deal seem to be total partisans who think everyone is out to get them.

Oh I didn't want to get into this, I really didn't.....

Take HD/Blu-Ray off the table, lose it, OK. Almost EVERYONE who is going out to buy a regular old DVD player today (and doesn't care one whit about any sort of HD format) will buy an upconverting one with HDMI. There are FAR more of these folks than there are people interested in HD or BD. There is NOT a better upconverter anywhere that you can buy for this price, period. The fact that it comes with 7 movies (HD or not, good movies or not) is a bonus. The fact that it will play HD-DVD is icing.

As for lockups, mine has never locked up, not once. On the other hand, some of the junkier ones I've owned in the past that cost the same as this have had problems. And, anyone who can't wait 37 seconds to start watching a 2 hour movie has their priorities messed up.

OK, I'm done.

gnolivos said:Be warned, these Toshiba players WILL lock up on you quite frequently. I own one, and for this rerason alone, I for one am very happy to switch opver to Blu ray, even at 2-3x the cost of the player. I have hardly 'truly' enjoyed any movies with HD-DVD because of the constant lockups, sometimes twice per movie... insane! And yes, I did have the latest firmware upgrades all along. Shame on Toshiba for delivering such unreliable players, even if the upconversion is stellar. Who cares!

Because you have a defective player, you draw th conclusion that all HD DVD players are bad? Mine has never locked up except on defective rental disks and one new defective new disk. I see lots of posts with people who have issues with Blu Ray players as well. That does not mean they are all bad. Remember you can return it to Costco if you get a bad one, and there is a year warranty on the Costco model. And have your lockups been just on HD DVD movies or DVD's. Remember, we are talking about this being a good deal to upconvert DVD's, which should be more reliable. Let's forget the whole HD DVD/Blu Ray arguement for this deal. It is a good deal on a great upconverting player with 7 free movies.

Its ridiculous that people are buying HD-DVD player to use it for upconverting..

Here are 4 reasons to go with Philips:

1) Divx
2) USB
3) Very fast loading - HD-DVD players take their own sweet time to initialize and it sucks
4) Region Free !!!!!!

I have HD-A3 & Philips 5982 and trust me.. 5982 is equally good in upconverting plus all the above benefits !!!

move on ppl.. dont get tempted to buy this player and then it becomes a door stop after a year !!!