• Text Only
Voting History
rated:
Some local Safeways (Vons ) are now requiring ID for credit card purchases over $50.  Has anyone else encountered this in their store? 

It appears to run against the Visa / Mastercard network rules which prohibit ID checks for card transactions (unless also required for cash, etc). 

My guess is that Safeway is now eating more fraud since the EMV liability shift.  I haven't seen any EMV implementation to accept chip cards in their stores, which means they are automatically responsible for any fraud that occurs with an EMV card.   But the solution should be to get EMV rolling, not violate rules that prohibit ID checks. 

In other news Safeway also seems to be prohibiting the sale of gift cards and prepaid cards from the self checkout.  (This never worked well anyway, since someone would have to come over to activate the card, negating any time save with self checkout.

Member Summary
Most Recent Posts
If you are trying to buy a lot of plant fertilizer and nitroglycerin anonymously, you deserve a visit from the FBI.

Glitch99 (Aug. 26, 2016 @ 7:17a) |

CVS requires ID for buying plastic, even when paying with cash. Merchants apparently are allowed to require ID for Visa... (more)

DTASFAB (Aug. 26, 2016 @ 9:47a) |

What section of PCI are you claiming is violated by checking ID for a purchase?

NEDeals (Aug. 26, 2016 @ 1:59p) |

Staff Summary
Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

A couple months or so ago, my local Safeway started asking to see customers' credit cards for some charges (I don't know if $50 is the cutoff).

I believe they then enter the last four digits of the card separately.

But, to my knowledge, they've never asked anyone for a driver's license or any other kind of ID.

Is it really against the rules? I've been carded in big box stores frequently (Macy's, Target, Best Buy)

sfchris said:   Is it really against the rules? I've been carded in big box stores frequently (Macy'sTarget, Best Buy)
  
This is what I found (https://usa (dot) visa.com/dam/VCOM/download/merchants/card-acceptance-guidelines-for-merchants.pdf)

"When should you ask a cardholder for an official government ID? Although Visa Rules do not preclude merchants from asking for cardholder ID except in the specific circumstances discussed in this guide, merchants cannot make an ID a condition of acceptance. Therefore, merchants cannot as part of their regular card acceptance procedures refuse to complete a purchase transaction because a cardholder refuses to provide ID. It is important that merchants understand that the requesting of a cardholder ID does not change the merchant’s liability for chargebacks. However, it can slow down a sale and annoy the customer. In some cases, it may even deter the use of the Visa card and result in the loss of a potential sale. Visa believes merchants should not ask for ID as part of their regular card acceptance procedures. Laws in several countries also make it illegal for merchants to write a cardholder’s personal information, such as an address or phone number, on a sales receipt. If you are suspicious, follow recommended steps listed above under Unsigned Cards."

It seems Visa recommends they don't ask for ID, but I doubt Visa will side with a customer who complains about being carded. Unless someone here can provide an instance in which they actually managed to change a retail store practice of asking for ID by complaining to Visa/MC/etc that is.

 

MasterCard prohibits checking identification as a condition of paying with a card.

Enforcing that is another matter. 

When a store asks for ID for a credit card transaction I say "no, thank you" and about half the time that's the end of it (yes, really). If they still insist I'll show them.

I used to make a big deal about how it was against their merchant agreement with the credit card network and offer to let them compare my signatures, but let's be honest, the cashier has no power over the store's policy and the management has no incentive to comply with that rule.
noelandres said:   I doubt Visa will side with a customer who complains about being carded. Unless someone here can provide an instance in which they actually managed to change a retail store practice of asking for ID by complaining to Visa/MC/etc that is. 
 


I did complain to Mastercard once when the cashier and store manger were real jerkbags about it, but of course nothing happened and never would. (Joke's on them, my wife's blood sugar went low while we were shopping so she opened and ate some of the food we were planning on purchasing; I made a good-faith effort to pay for it, but they refused to accept my credit card).

doveroftke said:    (Joke's on them, my wife's blood sugar went low while we were shopping so she opened and ate some of the food we were planning on purchasing; I made a good-faith effort to pay for it, but they refused to accept my credit card).
  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IJCFc_qkHw




Report a Problem Shopping | Merchant Violations
Disclaimer
Mastercard merchant violations including requiring ID can be reported here:

https://www.mastercard.us/en-us/consumers/get-support/report-problem-shopping.html
 (not auto linked to foil Mastercard getting Fatwallet referrer info)

So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?

atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.
 

atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  Wrong.  Also visible on the DL is the DL ID number, full name, address, and DOB.  Combined with the credit card number, that can be more than enough information to social-engineer identity theft.  Or even to targ.et the house for burglary if there was a very large electronics purchase (that's getting into tin-foil hat area though, IMO).  But, it's not tin foil hat to not give out personal information to third parties when not necessary and when not compensated.

Also, people get credit cards primarily for convenience.  It's not convenient if every individual "merchant" is allowed to come up with arbitrary add-on conditions for use rather than having a standard set of rules for usage (which are defined in the merchant agreements).  If Merchant A can arbitrarily decide they need a DL, then merchant B can decide they want a birth certificate, merchant C requires you wear a red sweater, or merchant D can decide you have to sing "I'm a little teapot" to use a credit card.


Q: Purchaseing Gift Cards with cash required a DL - Displaying message 19013075
Disclaimer
imbatman said:   If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.
If you're dropping $5K at a time on GC's, you should be able to afford the investment in a US Passport Card (which does not contain your address).  That's a Govt issued ID card (where I've yet to be denied a GC purchase on the basis of showing that as my ID).

Also previously discussed in this thread (if my direct post doesn't open up, search for my 1st reply in that thread):
https://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1436328/m19013075/#m1901...

  

those don't work at CVS

It's not just gift card purchases that require ID. The new Safeway policy is all purchases paid with a credit card over $50. While I haven't seen Safeway trying to scan the 3d barcode on IDs, other stores do that as much as possible, especially stores that use the Retail Equation database of purchases and returns, and use that multiple store database to block any return that they don't like at any store. Target will scan your license information into their database for cold medicine or a bottle of wine.  They also build a comprehensive database record on every customer using whatever information they can get at each transaction.

As far as I know, the only state that explicitly blocks stores from storing state ID information is New Hampshire, and even then the attorney general has to get involved if compliance is desired

Anytime you have to give your ID to a clerk, you lose control how they that information. The passport card is better, but is still a unique ID that the store can use to track your purchases (when, where, what, how often). If the current/future passport card barcode contains bio information, than the store gets that too.

Lately at Vons after I'm rung up I'm asked for the last 4 digits of the cc I just used. Guess they're looking for scammers that just change the tape not the card.

zapjb said:   Lately at Vons after I'm rung up I'm asked for the last 4 digits of the cc I just used. Guess they're looking for scammers that just change the tape not the card.
  
Stores do that as a safeguard against using stolen magstripe data on a different piece of plastic.  Of course, someone can take note of the number stored on their card before they walk into the store so they can provide it...very rarely does the cashier actually look at the card instead of just asking.

If Vons{forums-storename-auto-jlinks} just started this, it also points to Safeway/Vons experiencing higher fraud losses after the liability shift last October. If they are smart, they are scrambling to implement EMV like Home DepotWalMart, and Target have already done on a wide scale.

imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.

  Someone bright enough to remember all the into on your DL isn't going to be working as a cashier.

I didn't say bright. you can have a photographic memory and still be lazy/incompetent.

tinfoil hat.

imbatman said:   those don't work at CVS
If you're saying that CVS doesn't accept a US PASSPORT CARD as a valid ID, that, IMO, deserves escalation to their corporate offices. Of course, if your CVS remains MS friendly, then I can understand not wanting to rock the boat (as doing so may kill the MS friendliness).

atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.

  Someone bright enough to remember all the into on your DL isn't going to be working as a cashier.

  
Why bother remembering anything when the 3D barcode contains all of that same information--license number, eye color, height, hair color, weight, classes, birthday, address, donor status, etc.  One quick scan and everything is in the store's computer databases, and any other databases they share information with (e.g. Retail Equation), and any other databases THEY store information with. 

 

In Seattle area, Safeway has been requiring ID for gift card purchases on CC for at least 5 years.

Bend3r said:   
atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  Wrong.  Also visible on the DL is the DL ID number, full name, address, and DOB.  Combined with the credit card number, that can be more than enough information to social-engineer identity theft.  Or even to targ.et the house for burglary if there was a very large electronics purchase (that's getting into tin-foil hat area though, IMO).  But, it's not tin foil hat to not give out personal information to third parties when not necessary and when not compensated.

Also, people get credit cards primarily for convenience.  It's not convenient if every individual "merchant" is allowed to come up with arbitrary add-on conditions for use rather than having a standard set of rules for usage (which are defined in the merchant agreements).  If Merchant A can arbitrarily decide they need a DL, then merchant B can decide they want a birth certificate, merchant C requires you wear a red sweater, or merchant D can decide you have to sing "I'm a little teapot" to use a credit card.

  You sir, sound like one of those folks who whenever they list a car on eBay or Craigslist, always blank out their license plate in the pictures. Am I right?

Safeway started asking me to see my credit card to enter the last four digits a few weeks ago but, no ID requests.

It's location by location. The Riteaid, Walgreen, and Safeway here all either require ID or pay by cash for GC purchases but not at the same store 6 miles away. There seems to be organized ring around here doing GC frauds.

I think biometric is the ultimate answer to security verification, right now. it's one band-aid after another.

btw. my pukepal account got compromised yesterday with a very strong password. I still don't know how that happened but someone in OT pointed to this article:

http://krebsonsecurity.com/2015/12/2016-reality-lazy-authenticat...

imbatman said:     If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.
  
Dude, everyone already knows your address is Wayne Manor, Gotham.  

atikovi said:   
Bend3r said:   
atikovi said:   
imbatman said:   
atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
People want their privacy.
I'm going to go put my aluminum foil hat back on.

  Got nothing to do with privacy. It's security. Comparing the name on the credit card to the name on the DL doesn't invade on anyone's privacy. Yes put the foil hat back on.

  Wrong.  Also visible on the DL is the DL ID number, full name, address, and DOB.  Combined with the credit card number, that can be more than enough information to social-engineer identity theft.  Or even to targ.et the house for burglary if there was a very large electronics purchase (that's getting into tin-foil hat area though, IMO).  But, it's not tin foil hat to not give out personal information to third parties when not necessary and when not compensated.

Also, people get credit cards primarily for convenience.  It's not convenient if every individual "merchant" is allowed to come up with arbitrary add-on conditions for use rather than having a standard set of rules for usage (which are defined in the merchant agreements).  If Merchant A can arbitrarily decide they need a DL, then merchant B can decide they want a birth certificate, merchant C requires you wear a red sweater, or merchant D can decide you have to sing "I'm a little teapot" to use a credit card.

  You sir, sound like one of those folks who whenever they list a car on eBay or Craigslist, always blank out their license plate in the pictures. Am I right?

  I haven't listed a car on craigslist, but also the license plate gives out no personal information, so there's no reason to blank out the license plate unless you stole the vehicle you're trying to sell....  I have bought and sold on eBay.  Not sure why/how you would block out the address in that case.  The difference between the two circumstances is that when I sell something on eBay the address is necessary and useful for facilitating the transaction, and it's part of the established rules for eBay /Paypal.  

If some buyers or sellers would instead arbitrarily demand that I send a photocopy of my ID with the eBay sale or purchase,  I obviously would not....  That would be the relevant comparison to demanding an ID when making a $50 purchase at a grocery store.

I also don't give out checks to various third parties (checks have the whole account number/routing number on them and there is no other security built into the checking system except policies individual banks implement to flag potentially fraudulent transactions).  My checking account info only goes to other banks for funds transfers.  So, you have me there.  Instead I use primarily credit cards (because they're cheaper to use due to rebates and no interest when PIF, plus they're much more convenient and slightly more secure) or cash (inconvenient).   And I also used a cashier's check at closing for my house purchase, as the title co and realtors have no need of my checking account number.  Of course I do provide my information to companies that pay me, like my SS# to creditkarma and my payment information to FW/ebates/etc.

You sir, sound like someone who signs up all their personal information to various third parties for no reason "Enter to win a new car!  Just give us your name address and birth-date so we can sell it to people to send you targeted spam mail! *(Odds: 1 in 150million)", maybe you've also replied to some Nigerian princes who email you asking to help them out?  

TJtv said:   
imbatman said:     If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.
  
Dude, everyone already knows your address is Wayne Manor, Gotham.  

  red , that is where bruce wayne lives. batman lives in the night.

rufflesinc said:   
TJtv said:   
imbatman said:     If a cashier has a photographic memory, they now know where I live. Which some might have a problem with if they just purchased $5,000 in gift cards.
  
Dude, everyone already knows your address is Wayne Manor, Gotham.  

  red , that is where bruce wayne lives. batman lives in the night.

  
I can't believe people still get me confused with that billionaire pretty boy

atikovi said:   So other than it taking 10 seconds of your life away to pull out a DL, why is there a problem with this?
 

  As with many other mysterious Fatwallet concerns, I'm sure it boils down to MS or other gameification.

Add me to the list of people that doesn't understand the problem with showing ID when making a LARGE credit card purchase. I've got NO problems showing Id with buying large amounts on my credit card.

raceman73 said:   Add me to the list of people that doesn't understand the problem with showing ID when making a LARGE credit card purchase. I've got NO problems showing Id with buying large amounts on my credit card.
  
You're happy to let $10/hr retail employee know where to find that really expensive thing you just bought? M'kay.

A high school friend went to jail for credit card fraud. This is his scam, he worked retail:

Keep a copy of the credit card information (this was back in the carbon copy days).
Either obtain during the sale, or later research the home address.
Call a camera shop and order a high end camera for delivery using this info.
Call back 30 mins later saying "my son will be driving by, he'll just pick it up"
Go pick up camera. Sell camera. Rinse and repeat (until caught).

raceman73 said:   Add me to the list of people that doesn't understand the problem with showing ID when making a LARGE credit card purchase. I've got NO problems showing Id with buying large amounts on my credit card.
  
$50 is a "LARGE" credit card purchase?   You want the store to have all of your personal information to share/use as they please, deny future returns at all companies they share data with, etc for each $50 purchase? 

I'm not worried when I can easily cover up my address and simply show them my photo and my name.

raceman73 said:   I'm not worried when I can easily cover up my address and simply show them my photo and my name.
  
Stores that work with the Retail Equation shared database typically won't accept your ID unless they can scan the 3D barcode which has your name, birthday, height, weight, hair color, address, license number, donor status, classes, medical restrictions, etc. 

Chip card w PIN would be a better (not perfect) solution. IMO

ganda said:   
raceman73 said:   Add me to the list of people that doesn't understand the problem with showing ID when making a LARGE credit card purchase. I've got NO problems showing Id with buying large amounts on my credit card.
  
You're happy to let $10/hr retail employee know where to find that really expensive thing you just bought? M'kay.
 

  About the only time anyone asks me for ID is at the bank when I take out a few hundred or more cash. Should I now be worried the $12/hr teller knows my address and will come over to rob me?

The entire concept of mandatory ID presentation is unamerican. It implies that the person is guilty of doing something wrong until they prove themselves innocent. It's also an invasion of privacy. But most of all, like being assigned a social security number, it's dehumanizing because the ID card becomes more important than the person depicted on it.

I'm not a thief and I am not responsible for the rampant fraud that has necessitated the distrust that has developed within society. It is a violation of my rights, at least in the spirit if not the letter of the law, for government and corporate institutions to treat me like a common criminal. For this reason I will not be shopping at Safeway.

Skipping 48 Messages...
piratekim said:    The business merchant agreements clearly state that ID is NOT required for using credit cards. Any store that does this is in violation of the PCI compliance
 

  
What section of PCI are you claiming is violated by checking ID for a purchase?



Disclaimer: By providing links to other sites, FatWallet.com does not guarantee, approve or endorse the information or products available at these sites, nor does a link indicate any association with or endorsement by the linked site to FatWallet.com.

Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

While FatWallet makes every effort to post correct information, offers are subject to change without notice.
Some exclusions may apply based upon merchant policies.
© 1999-2017