• filter:
  • Text Only
  • Search this Topic »
Voting History
rated:
Hey guys, I'm an avid bullion collector, mostly from an investment perspective. I currently store this in my Liao banks Safe Deposit box. I know the bank will not guarantee or provide any protection for any of the valuables I store in my box. My insurance agent also does not seem to know much about what options I may have for private coverage, as he continues to say he is "looking into this". Does anyone on here have any experience with insuring their personal Safe Boxes for bullion or other pricey valuables? And if so, what types of costs did you incur?

Member Summary
Most Recent Posts
My banker told me the same thing

alamo11 (Nov. 02, 2016 @ 8:01p) |

Besides a bogus auction, another way to lose your safe deposit box contents is for the bank to lose your safe deposit bo... (more)

Revike (Nov. 02, 2016 @ 9:40p) |

For those advising buying ETFs as an alternative, I have to disagree.

If you look at the prospectus for these ETFs, they ... (more)

defjukie (Nov. 03, 2016 @ 12:15p) |

Staff Summary
Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

rated:
What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

rated:
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

rated:
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.
  If homeowners covers it at home, they should cover it at the bank as well.

rated:
I consider it a risk low enough not to worry about. Otherwise, I'd just buy GLD and rely on sipc insurance.

rated:
romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  Why don't you divide it among 10 banks, then if the worst were to happen, you'd only lose 10%

rated:
Hide it in plain sight at home.

rated:
I'd get a better insurance agent. Part of that premium is supposed to be paying him for good advice.

rated:
romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  What more risk is there at home, especially if you store it in a safebox? Fire? It may melt but isn't going to be consumed. Flood? Water won't hurt it. Hurricane? About he same risk as at the bank if it's nearby.

rated:
romnet said:   The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives.Or a divorce.

rated:
My Dad's gold railroad approved pocket watch could be "replaced" from eBay for about $1000. It would not be covered on my renter's insurance without being specifically added. The insurance quote was significantly lower if it was in my safety deposit box, rather than in my apartment.

I wouldn't be working with an agent who had to get back to me about this kind of information.

rated:
rufflesinc said:   
romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  Why don't you divide it among 10 banks, then if the worst were to happen, you'd only lose 10%

  I think this is the best option otherwise I'd say it'd be a very hard insurance claim to collect on. So if the value is worth X different bank boxes vs pita insurance to collect or even close I'd go the different banks route.

rated:
romnet said:   
  Oh, it happens.

rated:
May have to rethink keeping gold in a safe deposit box, at least at Chase:

Chase safe deposit box policy


“Contents of the box: You agree not to store any cash or coins other than those found to have a collectible value.”

Another change is that signatures will no longer be accepted to access the box. The next time they go in they have to bring two forms of ID and they will be issued a four-digit pin number that will be used to access the box then and in the future.

I have read the letter from Chase and it does say this, and they did require me to have the ID and create a PIN for access. I don't know if they can or will enforce this, or what the penalty is if you did keep bullion in the safe deposit box. I can see other banks doing this as well, since they all follow the same banking guidelines.

rated:
You shouldn't show them what you keep in the box, so no, they won't know. It's probably for insurance purposes -- they won't be liable for your bullion.

rated:
kenmoreland said:   My Dad's gold railroad approved pocket watch could be "replaced" from eBay for about $1000. It would not be covered on my renter's insurance without being specifically added. The insurance quote was significantly lower if it was in my safety deposit box, rather than in my apartment.

I wouldn't be working with an agent who had to get back to me about this kind of information.

  
A $1,000 piece of jewelry should be included in a basic policy, or covered for almost nothing.  What is significantly lower?

rated:

rated:
Marvinomatic said:   FYI
http://www.punny.org/money/how-to-save-your-safe-deposit-box-fro...

  Referenced some snarky FWF suggestions for the "seize your safe deposit box for abandonment" problem too.

rated:
xerty said:   
Marvinomatic said:   FYI
http://www.punny.org/money/how-to-save-your-safe-deposit-box-fro...

  Referenced some snarky FWF suggestions for the "seize your safe deposit box for abandonment" problem too.

  BBB was funny if nothing else.  That's actually a brilliant idea.

rated:
Lloyds of London...they'll insure anything under the sun.  May not be cheap but there you have it.  Alternatively, Metropolitan Safety Deposit boxes in London's boxes are insured up to 10k British Pounds but you'll have to go to London each time you want to access your box.

rated:
ach1199 said:   Lloyds of London...they'll insure anything under the sun.  May not be cheap but there you have it.  Alternatively, Metropolitan Safety Deposit boxes in London's boxes are insured up to 10k British Pounds but you'll have to go to London each time you want to access your box.
I once dated an English woman...

rated:
rufflesinc said:   romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  Why don't you divide it among 10 banks, then if the worst were to happen, you'd only lose 10%


That means I'll have to not only establish accounts but also pay annual fees at 10 banks to maintain a safe box. I get mine for free since I have a premiere account and maintain a direct deposit over a certain threshold. Otherwise the manual fee for my box would be $70 per month.

rated:

rated:
romnet said:   
rufflesinc said:   
romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  Why don't you divide it among 10 banks, then if the worst were to happen, you'd only lose 10%


That means I'll have to not only establish accounts but also pay annual fees at 10 banks to maintain a safe box. I get mine for free since I have a premiere account and maintain a direct deposit over a certain threshold. Otherwise the manual fee for my box would be $70 per month.

  ummm how much gold are you storing? $840 a year is a lot for a SDB

rated:
romnet said:   
rufflesinc said:   
romnet said:   
atikovi said:   What point is there to keep bullion in safe deposit box when there is no guarantee of protection? If the only risk is theft you might as well keep it at home, your homeowners policy should cover it, albeit with a rider.

Although the bank provides no guarantee, it is a much more secure than keeping it at home. The only risk with keeping my gold in a safe box at the bank is risk of the bank being robbed and the safe box lock being drilled open by theives... The chances are slim to none of that ever happening, never the less, I want to ensure I'm 100% protected if the worst were to happen.

  Why don't you divide it among 10 banks, then if the worst were to happen, you'd only lose 10%


That means I'll have to not only establish accounts but also pay annual fees at 10 banks to maintain a safe box. I get mine for free since I have a premiere account and maintain a direct deposit over a certain threshold. Otherwise the manual fee for my box would be $70 per month.

  $70 a month? Must be huge. Here average sizes are ~$70 a year.

rated:
Dig a small trench in your backyard. Hide the gold bullion there. Cover the trench back with the excavated soil. Plant a bush. Simple and peace of mind.

rated:
cnonline said:   Dig a small trench in your backyard. Hide the gold bullion there. Cover the trench back with the excavated soil. Plant a bush. Simple and peace of mind.
No, dig your trench in my backyard 

Make sure your homeowners covers it.  Mine didn't.  In a fire, remember the yellow stuff melts so if you later see groundhogs with gold teeth in the neighborhood, you were warned.

rated:
If you look around the forums frequented by other "avid bulion collectors", it seems that the most popular storage method is installing a safe at home and sleeping next to it with a loaded AR-15.

Most conventional insurance policies won't cover it, even with a rider, for the same reasons they won't insure a pile of cash in your house. You'd have to go with a specialty company, like Lloyds of London as somebody mentioned above, but it is most likely out of your price range.

rated:
There's a key point that most people fail to see whenever these discussions about physical bullion pop up every now and then. There are only two reasons to buy physical rather than ETFs. One is avoidance of paying capital gains taxes when the value goes up and you take the profits. The downside to that is you can't deduct losses when the value goes down and you take the losses, at least not without attracting a lot of unwanted attention from Joe Q. Auditor at the IRS.

The main reason to keep physical bullion is because the bullion IS insurance. You don't need insurance for your insurance. Bottled water, canned food, gas masks, precious metals, and guns are what you need for when the SHTF, since there will be no more government, no more law enforcement, and cash will be worthless. You expect insurance to cover you if martial law gets declared and a SWAT team busts down your door and takes your bullion from you by force? The last thing you're going to be thinking about is filing paperwork for an insurance claim, whether from Lloyd's of London or anywhere else.  For this reason, the coins you should stockpile would be 1 oz silver coins and 1/10 oz gold coins.  Your collection of gold coins heaver than 1/10 oz should be limited, because they can only be used in big bartering transactions.  You'll need smaller coins to trade for smaller items like bread and ammo.

If your reason for owning physical bullion doesn't fit into one of the above categories, you're better off opening a brokerage account and buying GLD or some other ETF of your choice.

rated:
I always wonder why people are buying large quantities of gold and putting it in a safe deposit box to begin with. I have never understood why people do this and every time I ask on FWF the goldbugs get mad at me, red me, and give nonsensical answers. If you are buying physical gold, you believe that some sort of economic collapse is likely. Because if you just wanted some sort of hedge against inflation, you'd be buying GLD as a small percentage of your portfolio. Yet in an economic collapse, you won't be able to get to the bank. The banks will be closed. Your shiny bars will be useless to you because you can't get them. More likely during a collapse, roving bands of idiots with guns might just take everything int he bank. But yet again, in that scenario no one will be around to pay out your gold bar insurance claim.

Given all this, what sane reason could anyone have for buying physical gold and (1) putting it in a safe deposit box but (2) wanting insurance on it.

rated:
We should start a gold insurance business. Take money for policies now and pay out after doomsday in worthless dollars.

rated:
magika said:   I always wonder why people are buying large quantities of gold and putting it in a safe deposit box to begin with. I have never understood why people do this and every time I ask on FWF the goldbugs get mad at me, red me, and give nonsensical answers. If you are buying physical gold, you believe that some sort of economic collapse is likely. Because if you just wanted some sort of hedge against inflation, you'd be buying GLD as a small percentage of your portfolio. Yet in an economic collapse, you won't be able to get to the bank. The banks will be closed. Your shiny bars will be useless to you because you can't get them. More likely during a collapse, roving bands of idiots with guns might just take everything int he bank. But yet again, in that scenario no one will be around to pay out your gold bar insurance claim.

Given all this, what sane reason could anyone have for buying physical gold and (1) putting it in a safe deposit box but (2) wanting insurance on it.

I think this is the first time I've ever given you green.  Granted, it's for basically regurgitating what I posted just above, but still, first time is first time.  

There is no sane reason for the exact scenario you described.  If someone wanted to keep a modest amount of physical bullion coins in a somewhat accessible place away from a bank that would be unknown to the rest of the world, that might not be so insane.  There's risk involved, but some might say the risk is no greater than not having any physical bullion at all.

The most sane reason of all would be a combination of all the reasons - diversification of portfolio, tax evasion, hedge against inflation, and physical coins available for bartering when WWIII hits.

rated:

rated:
khakuda said:   In a fire, remember the yellow stuff melts so if you later see groundhogs with gold teeth in the neighborhood, you were warned.
  Ground doesn't burn.

rated:
DTASFAB said:   There's a key point that most people fail to see whenever these discussions about physical bullion pop up every now and then. There are only two reasons to buy physical rather than ETFs. One is avoidance of paying capital gains taxes when the value goes up and you take the profits. The downside to that is you can't deduct losses when the value goes down and you take the losses, at least not without attracting a lot of unwanted attention from Joe Q. Auditor at the IRS.

The main reason to keep physical bullion is because the bullion IS insurance. You don't need insurance for your insurance. Bottled water, canned food, gas masks, precious metals, and guns are what you need for when the SHTF, since there will be no more government, no more law enforcement, and cash will be worthless. You expect insurance to cover you if martial law gets declared and a SWAT team busts down your door and takes your bullion from you by force? The last thing you're going to be thinking about is filing paperwork for an insurance claim, whether from Lloyd's of London or anywhere else.  For this reason, the coins you should stockpile would be 1 oz silver coins and 1/10 oz gold coins.  Your collection of gold coins heaver than 1/10 oz should be limited, because they can only be used in big bartering transactions.  You'll need smaller coins to trade for smaller items like bread and ammo.

If your reason for owning physical bullion doesn't fit into one of the above categories, you're better off opening a brokerage account and buying GLD or some other ETF of your choice.


You nailed it spot on. My whole point of investing 5% or less of my entire portfolio in Gold Bullion is for those very reasons. It not only is a great way to hedge against bear market, but also a great security measure in the event a dooms day type of event were to ever occur, financial meltdown or any other of the scenarios above! My ideal scenario would be to built a professional vault into the structure of my home where it can be hidden behind a wall or stairway etc... Only problem is I wouldn't be able to trust to contractor I hire to build it...

rated:
romnet said:   You nailed it spot on. My whole point of investing 5% or less of my entire portfolio in Gold Bullion is for those very reasons. It not only is a great way to hedge against bear market, but also a great security measure in the event a dooms day type of event were to ever occur, financial meltdown or any other of the scenarios above! My ideal scenario would be to built a professional vault into the structure of my home where it can be hidden behind a wall or stairway etc... Only problem is I wouldn't be able to trust to contractor I hire to build it...
Build it yourself.  Or just keep it in a book you cut the pages out of, like in prison movies.

rated:
DTASFAB said:   romnet said:   You nailed it spot on. My whole point of investing 5% or less of my entire portfolio in Gold Bullion is for those very reasons. It not only is a great way to hedge against bear market, but also a great security measure in the event a dooms day type of event were to ever occur, financial meltdown or any other of the scenarios above! My ideal scenario would be to built a professional vault into the structure of my home where it can be hidden behind a wall or stairway etc... Only problem is I wouldn't be able to trust to contractor I hire to build it...
Build it yourself.  Or just keep it in a book you cut the pages out of, like in prison movies.


This is what I had in mind..
http://pin.it/LBnX3F2

rated:
You will all be shocked to learn that gold policies have a high percentage of being collected on. In home invasion robberies where the crooks know exactly where the safe his hidden and bring a truck and chain to pull it out of the wall/floor.

rated:
romnet said:   
You nailed it spot on. My whole point of investing 5% or less of my entire portfolio in Gold Bullion is for those very reasons. It not only is a great way to hedge against bear market, but also a great security measure in the event a dooms day type of event were to ever occur, financial meltdown or any other of the scenarios above! My ideal scenario would be to built a professional vault into the structure of my home where it can be hidden behind a wall or stairway etc... Only problem is I wouldn't be able to trust to contractor I hire to build it...

  
So in the doom porn fantasy scenario, why exactly will your stacks of gold bullion be worth anything? In that kind of world, only a few things will have value: food and guns. No one will be interested in your shiny coins, or if they are, they can just shoot you and take them. So why is anyone still spending the time to buy actual gold again...?

 

Skipping 7 Messages...
rated:
For those advising buying ETFs as an alternative, I have to disagree.

If you look at the prospectus for these ETFs, they are only required to keep a small fraction of the physical gold on reserve. If and when SHTF and/or Gold goes Sky high, they have a very high likelihood of becoming insolvent. And you, the scumbag individual investor, are pretty much at the bottom of the priority list for getting money back out of the investment.

Those ETFs are great for a trade, but if you are buying as an investment or a hedge for doomsday scenario, I would stay far far away.

  • Quick Reply:  Have something quick to contribute? Just reply below and you're done! hide Quick Reply
     
    Click here for full-featured reply.


Disclaimer: By providing links to other sites, FatWallet.com does not guarantee, approve or endorse the information or products available at these sites, nor does a link indicate any association with or endorsement by the linked site to FatWallet.com.

Thanks for visiting FatWallet.com. Join for free to remove this ad.

While FatWallet makes every effort to post correct information, offers are subject to change without notice.
Some exclusions may apply based upon merchant policies.
© 1999-2017