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So woke up this past Sunday morning to find an upside down vehicle resting on the hood/passenger side of my minivan.  The driver/owner of the flipped vehicle lives on our block.  His story according to the police is that someone hit him from behind that caused him to lose control, flip over and hit five vehicles including mine.  The police told me that they think that he made a sharp left at a high rate of speed, lost control and flipped over.  Anyway, I don't have the full coverage on my van because it's almost 18 years old so I called his insurance co and they said that he may not be carrying enough liability coverage to cover all five vehicles he hit so they'll have to figure out who gets what. 

My question is should I attend the court on the driver's court date as a complaining witness to make sure that the citation sticks in case he doesn't have enough insurance and  I need to go after him in the small claim court?  My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

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Check on this of course but if they total it you can probably get paid for the car and buy it back for scrap price. Nega... (more)

Stubtify (Aug. 08, 2017 @ 5:54p) |

How old you estimate the driver? If he wasn't under the influence but he was ~19 y/o...I think we have our answer to how... (more)

Al3xK (Aug. 08, 2017 @ 6:49p) |

Driver is in his 30s.

ach1199 (Aug. 08, 2017 @ 10:23p) |

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Do you have underinsured motorist coverage? If so, seems like that should cover you. Then your insurance worries about trying to get the funds after it pays you. (In my state uninsured/underinsured is required).

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Wow, 5 cars. Of course the first thing they would check is his rear bumper.

And yes if his insurance can't cover you then you would have to sue and get it out of his home insurance.

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What will you be a witness to? You didn't see the accident, right?

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was his car the one that hit yours directly? otherwise, you may go after the actual car that hit you. sure it may not be their fault, but they have insurance and that's what insurance is for.

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miserly said:   was his car the one that hit yours directly? otherwise, you may go after the actual car that hit you. sure it may not be their fault, but they have insurance and that's what insurance is for.
  
The way I understand it, the OP's car was found underneath his car.

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Bend3r said:   Do you have underinsured motorist coverage? If so, seems like that should cover you.
  
That's a state thing. In NM, yes, but in AZ, no.

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This post is worthless without pics.

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Yes, if you can go ahead of time and talk to the prosecutor. You want to object to any deal the lawyers may make in order to make it go away.
You want to file your claim in court ASAP hoping to be first in line.

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I'm surprised the guy was still breathing to say anything to the cops. What kind of vehicle did he have, a tank?

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ach1199 said:   My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

  Did his car hit yours?  That's about the only fact on record; unless he can produce the other driver or at least a witness, the evidence stands in your favor.  His insurance paying anything to anyone is also evidence of him accepting liability.

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He was hit from behind. So his vehicle should show some pretty significant rear-end damage, yes?

Find his vehicle. If no rear-end damage, snap several photos. Take them to his hearing and give them to DA/judge.

While at court, file a lawsuit against him in small claims. Attempt to get his $$$ before he files BK.

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This is another example of why you should always have full coverage. Not having to deal with the other person's insurance company is priceless.

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qcumber98 said:   This is another example of why you should always have full coverage. Not having to deal with the other person's insurance company is priceless.

Nah. An 18 year old van is probably worth 2-3k and full coverage would probably be 400 a year more. After 5-7 years it's a wash.

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noins said:   
qcumber98 said:   This is another example of why you should always have full coverage. Not having to deal with the other person's insurance company is priceless.

Nah. An 18 year old van is probably worth 2-3k and full coverage would probably be 400 a year more. After 5-7 years it's a wash.

  How much is peace of mind worth to you?

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miserly said:   was his car the one that hit yours directly? otherwise, you may go after the actual car that hit you. sure it may not be their fault, but they have insurance and that's what insurance is for.
 No other car hit my van except the overturned car as seen in the pic in OP.

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that will buff out

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Glitch99 said:   
ach1199 said:   My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

  Did his car hit yours?  That's about the only fact on record; unless he can produce the other driver or at least a witness, the evidence stands in your favor.  His insurance paying anything to anyone is also evidence of him accepting liability.

  Yes, the car ended up on my van as seen in pic in the original post.  The only witness who came out as soon as he heard the crash gave a statement to police that he didn't see any other vehicle in the street at the time.  His insurance told me that they'll accept the full liability for the accident but not sure how much they can cover for each vehicle due to low liability limit on his policy.

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pic2 (4.93MB)
Disclaimer
pic of the other vehicles hit in this accident...the white car first hit a Lexus parked behind the black Pilot then the white car hit Pilot with such a force that it smashed into Accord parked in front of it that caused the back side of the Accord to smash into its trunk then the white car flipped over and in process it hit a Red Nissan parked in front of my van as seen in the pic in the original post.  Then finally landed on my van. 

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ach1199 said:   
Glitch99 said:   
ach1199 said:   My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

  Did his car hit yours?  That's about the only fact on record; unless he can produce the other driver or at least a witness, the evidence stands in your favor.  His insurance paying anything to anyone is also evidence of him accepting liability.

  Yes, the car ended up on my van as seen in pic in the original post.  The only witness who came out as soon as he heard the crash gave a statement to police that he didn't see any other vehicle in the street at the time.  His insurance told me that they'll accept the full liability for the accident but not sure how much they can cover for each vehicle due to low liability limit on his policy.

  I bet he has the minimum coverage required by the state.   What happens if the damages exceed his policy limit?  Do you sue and hope for the best?  Or garnish his wages?

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qcumber98 said:   
 

  yes, he's sues and gets a judgement.  then the crazy driver probably files bankruptcy (or doesn't since he's unemployed/on disability/working for cash).  whatever the case, OP is probably screwed.  I'd probably still sue.  somewhat of a chance that crazy driver might come into money later on.

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pietromoon said:   that will buff out
  
Buff it out, flip it for a small profit, move on.

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The upside down car looks like a fairly recent Acura, the terrible driver may not be a pov.

Are the police not pursuing the "hit from behind" BS?

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ganda said:   The upside down car looks like a fairly recent Acura, the terrible driver may not a pov.

Are the police not pursuing the "hit from behind" BS?

  It's a 2013 Acura. The police checked the backside of the Acura and found no damage that indicate a hit from behind. If this was a hit from behind then there would have been broken head light, turn signal and other debris left on the road from the 2nd vehicle but there was no debris at all. 

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Aside - we really need to get over using the term "accident". It's crash, someone was being a moron and they crashed. Most crashes are caused by someone doing something moronic.

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ach1199 said:   
Glitch99 said:   
ach1199 said:   My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

  Did his car hit yours?  That's about the only fact on record; unless he can produce the other driver or at least a witness, the evidence stands in your favor.  His insurance paying anything to anyone is also evidence of him accepting liability.

  Yes, the car ended up on my van as seen in pic in the original post.  The only witness who came out as soon as he heard the crash gave a statement to police that he didn't see any other vehicle in the street at the time.  His insurance told me that they'll accept the full liability for the accident but not sure how much they can cover for each vehicle due to low liability limit on his policy.

  How much damage did your van suffer, and how does it compare to the other vehicles?  If you arent looking for much, push for a quick settlement of your claim before they give away the coverage limit to other claims - insurance likes to check potential liabilities off their list.  Shouldnt you also have uninsured/underinsured driver coverage on your own policy, to make up the difference?

Do you know the driver?  If the total damage is clearly going to be well above his coverage limits, but your damage is relatively inexpensive, he may be open to a reasonable settlement offer outside of his insurance, for one less upcoming lawsuit to defend.
 

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ach1199 said:   
ganda said:   The upside down car looks like a fairly recent Acura, the terrible driver may not a pov.

Are the police not pursuing the "hit from behind" BS?

  It's a 2013 Acura. The police checked the backside of the Acura and found no damage that indicate a hit from behind. If this was a hit from behind then there would have been broken head light, turn signal and other debris left on the road from the 2nd vehicle but there was no debris at all. 


I love it. I presume the speed limit is 25 and that he also claims he wasn't speeding, claims he got hit from behind though somehow it didn't leave damage but was still hard enough to flip his vehicle at "25MPH", and at that low speed the car was able to damage cars on one side of the street and bounce off them hard enough to damage the cars on the other side of the street, too. Amazing. It would be great to see the driver get charged with filing a false police report too, but slim chance of that happening.

 

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Green for the title of this thread and the pics!  Fortunately, it looks like your van is still drivable.  It looks like the black Honda Pilot suffered some major rear suspension damage.

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zinaba said:   
qcumber98 said:   
 

  yes, he's sues and gets a judgement.  then the crazy driver probably files bankruptcy (or doesn't since he's unemployed/on disability/working for cash).  whatever the case, OP is probably screwed.  I'd probably still sue.  somewhat of a chance that crazy driver might come into money later on.

  The fact the driver concocted a story in an attempt to dodge responsibility indicates he knows he has something to lose.  Maybe he's just afraid of reckless driving tickets, or maybe he knows his low insurance limit leaves his bank account at risk.  Plenty of crazy people have money.

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momoman said:   Green for the title of this thread and the pics!  Fortunately, it looks like your van is still drivable.  It looks like the black Honda Pilot suffered some major rear suspension damage.
  Yes, the van drives just fine...had to tape up the turn signal as it came lose, because the ended up on the front quarter panel there might be a frame damage but I'm not able to open the hood as the hood got squeezed by the quarter panel.  Yes, the Pilot and the red Nissan Rougue in front of mine sustained most of the damage.

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Glitch99 said:   
ach1199 said:   
Glitch99 said:   
ach1199 said:   My fear is that if the citation is thrown out because the police or witnesses don't show up then he may claim in the civil court that the accident was not his fault.  Any FWers had this experience before?   Pic of the accident will be posted soon.

 

  Did his car hit yours?  That's about the only fact on record; unless he can produce the other driver or at least a witness, the evidence stands in your favor.  His insurance paying anything to anyone is also evidence of him accepting liability.

  Yes, the car ended up on my van as seen in pic in the original post.  The only witness who came out as soon as he heard the crash gave a statement to police that he didn't see any other vehicle in the street at the time.  His insurance told me that they'll accept the full liability for the accident but not sure how much they can cover for each vehicle due to low liability limit on his policy.

  How much damage did your van suffer, and how does it compare to the other vehicles?  If you arent looking for much, push for a quick settlement of your claim before they give away the coverage limit to other claims - insurance likes to check potential liabilities off their list.  Shouldnt you also have uninsured/underinsured driver coverage on your own policy, to make up the difference?

Do you know the driver?  If the total damage is clearly going to be well above his coverage limits, but your damage is relatively inexpensive, he may be open to a reasonable settlement offer outside of his insurance, for one less upcoming lawsuit to defend.

  My estimate of the damage to my van would be about $2k.  I told the driver's ins co to take care of mine first to make me go away (since mine is the least of the damaged vehicles)...they want to look at the most damaged vehicles first to see if there will be enough to cover the other vehicles.  I asked if they go by the order of claims filed (I was the 2nd to file the claim) and they said 'no'.  They go by the most damaged vehicles first to see what kind of liability they're looking at.

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qcumber98 said:   This is another example of why you should always have full coverage. Not having to deal with the other person's insurance company is priceless.
  Terrible advice.
insurance is nothing more than what you can afford to fix and basic math.

My car is old and easily replaceable. I'm not making a negative expectation bet on something I can easily afford to fix should something happen to it. And not just something happen to it but something happen to it where i can't get that money from someone else's insurance (if it's their fault)

If I wanted to waste money on bad bets I'd buy lotto tickets.  

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bxlefty23 said:   
qcumber98 said:   This is another example of why you should always have full coverage. Not having to deal with the other person's insurance company is priceless.
  Terrible advice.
insurance is nothing more than what you can afford to fix and basic math.

My car is old and easily replaceable. I'm not making a negative expectation bet on something I can easily afford to fix should something happen to it. And not just something happen to it but something happen to it where i can't get that money from someone else's insurance (if it's their fault)

If I wanted to waste money on bad bets I'd buy lotto tickets.  

  I dropped the full coverage when the value of the van went below $5k as that is my threshold for self insurance. So even if this van is not fixed and I need to dump it, my life can still go on uninterrupted. My teenage son drives this van at the moment so I'd just have to find a decent replacement vehicle for him (may be a Crown Vic) 😀

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We're Sienna bros! Mine's a 2000 though.

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What's the speed limit on this street? Good thing no one got ran over.

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what actually happened: driver drunk out of his mind and doing 90 MPH in residential area, took sharp left, clipped inside of curb, fishtailed overcorrecting and bob's your uncle.

Hopefully he's in jail, because that scene looks absurd.

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ZenNUTS said:   What's the speed limit on this street? Good thing no one got ran over.
  25 mph. We have very light vehicle traffic in our street, especially on early Sunday mornings, this happened around 5:30am so only some dog walkers may be out at that time. 

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Immediate green for pics! 

What's really damaged though? It looks like your hood and fender are dented - I wonder what a replacement hood and fender would cost. Your plastic bumper has some serious paint issues. I'd figure out what it would cost to resolve and then go after the driver for said costs. 

Skipping 24 Messages...
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Al3xK said:   How old you estimate the driver? If he wasn't under the influence but he was ~19 y/o...I think we have our answer to how it happened.

And good news on his insurance covering the claim.


Driver is in his 30s.

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